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Old 12-26-2007, 06:16 PM   #1
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New fish tank.

Ok, I have a 10g with way too many fish. I have 1 faintal, 1 calico faintail, one black moore, and one pleco. This was a mistake that I made because I did not read about this BEFORE I went out and got all this stuff. My bad, and I feel bad for making my fish feel bad. Time to remedy. I now have a 29g. Still not big enough but large enough to help out a lot and I will get a 75g once I move to a bigger place (still looking).

I have set up the tank, washed rocks and put them in, set up filter, treated water for chlorine and heavy metals. Now, I am going to do a fishless cycle and I would love any advice anyone wants to give me. I have read many things about it, and have read the one on this site many times, but since I am doing something I have never done before I feel the need to get as much advice as possible . I am going to use the bacteria from the old tank as much as possible as it is doing pretty good except for building up nitrate horribly fast and having many PWC.

Any suggestions on anything to do with tanks and tank setups happily welcome. Hope to hear from you guys
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:30 PM   #2
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Tip 1: Patience Patience Patience.
Tip 2: Don't overdo the ammonia (if using the ammonia dosing method).
Tip 3: PWC isn't needed until the end, yes you may have to do more than one but since there are no fish, one 80% shouldn't hurt.
Tip 4: Lights off, tank covered while not testing water if possible. Anything to prevent algae from grabbing hold while the ammonia is high. No plants yet (obviously)
Tip 5: (not really for fishless cycling but...) Plecos are technically tropical fish. Some people say they have success keeping them in cold water but I question how happy a tropical fish can be in cold water.

With just the 3 goldfish, the 29 gallon is actually probably big enough if you have good filtration.

Thats pretty much all there is to it really.
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Old 12-26-2007, 06:41 PM   #3
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Welcome to AA. As mentioned doing pwc's are not necessary until after the ammonia and nitrite convert to nitrate. It will take some time for the cycle. If you have a friend with an established tank, see if you can borrow some media from their tank to set on the substrate of your tank. This will help speed things up too.
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Old 12-26-2007, 07:26 PM   #4
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Filtration

Yes, it is a weird match of fish that came from being a newbie. I got a 300gph power filter, that should be more than enough. I guess I was confusing on my post, I have not done any water changes on the new tank, just on the old. I do plan to use the ammonia method and I do have the API master test kit and I do have droppers and things to keep my doses at the right level. I do have my own seeding material.

I really appreciate the quick responses and the friendliness. Looking forward to more advice, and hoping that sometime in the future I am prepared to be the one giving.
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Old 12-26-2007, 08:20 PM   #5
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What I would do is take the filter from the 10 gal (I'm assuming it's cycled) along with the decor and put it in the 29 gal (without cleaning any of the media, filter, or decor). Run them together on the 29 gal for several weeks. After about a month or so the 29 should be cycled. That's going to be the easiest way to cycle that tank. You have 0 Ammonia and Nitrite with present Nitrates on the 10 gal, correct? If so, the tank is cycled. I would put the substrate from the 10 in a mesh bag in the 29 gal during that month also for additional bacteria.
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Old 12-26-2007, 10:03 PM   #6
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If you can, put all the substrate in a mesh bag and put it in the 29. While you are waiting for it to cycle get a liquid reagent kit to test the perimeters on both tanks. I personally keep goldfish and I can tell you right now you should be doing pwc's of 50% at least every other day. They are pooping machines. Also, cut back on their feeding until you get them moved over as well. They need no more than a pinch the size of their eye balls a couple of times a day. Goldies don't have a proper stomach so if you over feed they poo most of it out and it pollutes the water pretty fast. I'd actually feed every other day...perhaps a couple of hours before you clean the tank to keep the water even cleaner. I'd also vary their diet. They love shelled peas, green beans, spinach...any veggie that's low in starch. They also love fruit: orange slices, mango.
Try out the Hikari Gold or Pro-Gold as both are a better quality food and cause less gas.

You can also heat their tank to the mid 70's. It boosts their immune system and they digest better in the warmer water. It's not necessary but just make sure your water doesn't get below 68* as that's getting into their semi-dormant state.

As for the pleco, I would STRONGLY recommend you move him out of the Goldfish tank alltogether. They do indeed require different perimeters and they have been known to go after the Goldfish as they mature going so far as to suck off their slime coats leaving the Goldies open to any and all infections. He'll serve no purpose in algae control in the tank either...well, as he grows. They can get a little lazy and dependant on the algae wafers. If you leacve him in there for a while get him a piece of driftwood to munch on. Just be sure to properly prepare the wood before you put it in the tank as will lower the PH if it's still full of tannins.
If your fish get really big like mine did you will want to add some crushed coral to buffer their water better (they are acidic fish with all that poo) and throw some Purigen into a mesh bag and put in the biomedia to super-filter the Nitrates in the water. These are all adjustments I have had to make and I run a 92 gallon tank with only 5 goldfish, 2 of which are juveniles.
Ask any other questions you may have and feel free to pm me. There is another sire that I frequent that specializes in goldfish called;
www.thegab.org

Good Luck!
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Old 01-01-2008, 09:12 PM   #7
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Thanks locorosa. So much great advice. You have taught me a few new things. I have been feeding them shelled peas and some lettuce. I did not know the orange and mango however, going to have to give that a try. I did realize late that they are not the best of tank mates. My tanks stay at about 75 so that is the low end of the pleco and high end of the golds. Without a cooler that is prolly as low as it is going to get. Some time in the future I do plan to separate the pleco. So far they seem to get along quite well but as you say, as they get older they do get more aggressive and mine is still young yet. I will definitely get the food you recommended.
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Old 01-11-2008, 11:48 PM   #8
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Done

It took only 12 days to do a fishless cycle using ammonia. My fish are now in their happy safe home. I have to admit I did not expect such a fast time but I did have a great seed tank to start with and I am sure that is what helped me out alot. I now have the 29g stocked with 1 faintail, 1 calico faintail, 1 black moore, and one pleco. The pleco will prolly get another tank that is larger as he grows older but for now I have no better place to put him and I just keep the tank at 75 which is ok for all the fish but not optimal for any . Thanks for all the help guys
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