New Tank Problems

[S_Morgan]

Okay, here goes...

I purchased a ten gallon "starter" kit aquarium for my son. I have not had a tank for years, but I never had issues like I am seeing here.

The setup is three weeks old. We have had fish in it for a little over two weeks. After letting the tank normalize over a four day period, We started with two guppies and a Corey. Both guppies died after two or three days and we replaced them. One of those guppies died, and we replaced it with a gold twin barb. Then the other guppie died and we replaced it with a cherry barb. Lost the cherry barb last night. The Corey and the other barb seem fine.

My ammonia levels are high (4.0-8.0 ppm) and my Nitrite levels are zero. This makes me think the biological filter isn't kicking in. I have been doing 25% water changes every three or four days. After each change, my ammonia readings are around 0.5 -1.0 ppm. After two or three days, it is back to 4.0 ppm. I have been using an ammonia detoxifier in the meantime, while waiting for the biofilter to kick in. Also, tested my PH for the first time tonight only to discover that it is 6.0 or lower (test is only good down to 6.0). Tank temp is around 74 deg.

My main assumption is that I am overfeeding them. I am only putting a small pinch of food in the tank twice a day. On advise from the petstore, I did supplement this with a couple of bottom feeder pellets each feeding for the first few days.

All input and advice is welcome!

Thanks,

Scott

 

[enid_b]

Ammonia is way too high, please don't buy any more fish!

The tank is not cycled so all waste is toxic ammonia. The treatment you are using will not allow it to cycle ever.

Take the fish back or to a place of safety then read about the cycle. It's sooo well documented.

Failing that do minimum 50% water changes any time your ammonia gets over 0.5ppm

The pH is the least of your problems, but is compounded by the ammonia levels

 

[enid_b]

And yes you are overfeeding, which will add to the ammonia levels.

 

[tinkster87]

I am currently doing wc of 50% or more daily, you really want to do it daily and get it down to 0.25 or below - otherwise your fish will continue to die. Even if some don't die they will get very stressed and Ill from it

There is a link somewhere for people in your situation I'll try and find it.

 

[tinkster87]

I just learned about cycling but I already have fish. What now?!

I reckon your going to need to do a good few big wc's in the next day or two to quickly get that ammonia down asap!

Cycling a tank can take ages and needs to be done carefully. Im 6 weeks in now (only just over 1 week with fish the rest was fishless.. having ammonia problems see thread for details) and thats a small 10 gallon tank.

 

[alex07]

Start adding some live plants to help keep your ammonia levels down.

 

[librarygirl]

Unfortunately the stores don't tell you about proper cycling of the tank. Letting it "run" for a few days doesn't do anything.

The link above should help you, read it and read it again

With ammonia that high you want to do 80-90% water changes back-to-back ASAP until your ammonia is <0.25 (temperature match the water you put in with the tank water as best you can and dechlorinate the water -- Prime is best to use if you can get it). Then test daily and do water changes as needed to keep it at that level. You're going to be doing this for a while until the tank cycles; with fish it can take a long time. The best option is to take the fish back to the store and cycle it fishless, although not sure if they would take the fish back now.

Also, no matter what the manufacturer says, do NOT change out the filter every x weeks. Leave what you have in there, otherwise you'll just be setting the cycle back further. The beneficial bacteria you need are going to be growing on your filter. Don't replace it (no need to to this until it's literally falling apart which could take years) and don't clean it in raw tap water.
Good luck.

 

[BillD]

If the pH is in fact 6, the ammonia is in the non toxic form of ammonia, ammonium. This will not harm fish, but at lower pH the cycle is slowed or even curtailed. The problem arises when you do a water change with water that has a pH of more than 7, in a quantity large enough to raise the tank pH above 7, which makes all that non toxic ammonium, toxic ammonia. Some of the advice offered above has missed this.
In this instance, where you have only 2 fish left and you began with only a few, I am wondering how your ammonia levels could get so high so quickly.

 

[S_Morgan]

Well, unless I am doing the test wrong, I am definately at a PH of 6.0 or lower. I tested both the water I am putting in to the tank and the water in the tank, and they are the same. I have read where ammonia levels aren't toxic at low PH levels. This is part of what has lead me to post here, since I am still losing fish.

Three questions:

1. If I vacuum out the tank, does this affect the bacteria levels?
2. Is there anything else I should be checking?
3. Would a Green Corey and a Twin Gold Barb survive in a one gallon holding tank while I get this tank sorted out?

Thanks!

 

[alLexX]

what kind of test kit do you have? if its strips,go ghet a liquid one,most memebers reccomend API freshwater master test kit

 

[S_Morgan]

I am using the API Freshwater Master Test kit.

 

[bruinsbro1997]

Well, unless I am doing the test wrong, I am definately at a PH of 6.0 or lower. I tested both the water I am putting in to the tank and the water in the tank, and they are the same. I have read where ammonia levels aren't toxic at low PH levels. This is part of what has lead me to post here, since I am still losing fish.

Three questions:

1. If I vacuum out the tank, does this affect the bacteria levels?
2. Is there anything else I should be checking?
3. Would a Green Corey and a Twin Gold Barb survive in a one gallon holding tank while I get this tank sorted out?

Thanks!

To answer your questions:
1. Nope. You'd have to vaccuum out 200% of your water to try to remove all bacteria in the gravel. And even that won't get rid of it. Most of it is in the filter, which is why it is important you never replace the media in there.
2. Check you nitrites and ammonia and nitrates daily. Ammo over .25, nitrites over 0, and nitrates over 20 can become dangerous to fish. pH you should check before and after you change the water.
3. No. The best thing to do is to return them. One gallon is too small for any fish even if it is a temporary tank.

 

[librarygirl]

+1 to what Allexx said: are you using a strip test or liquid test? What kind is it? If it's strips throw them out and buy a liquid kit, the API Master kit is best. Strips are very innaccurate.

Vaccumming the gravel you mean? It can kick up old food and waste which can cause a rise in ammonia.

If you move the fish to another tank you're still going to have the same problem of them not being in a properly cycled environment, best to leave them where they are unless you can take them back to the store and do a fishless cycle.

**edit***
oops, we all posted at the same time!

 

[S_Morgan]

Okay, I think my earlier reply was overlooked. I am using the API Freshwater Master Test kit. I am pretty confident in the test results I am getting.

I have two fish left, and will not add anymore until this is resolved. I can't return the two remaining fish and have no where else suitable to house them. My plan at this point is to continue doing water changes to keep the ammonia levels as low as I can while I try to get the biofilter working.

Do the bacteria supplements work? I was thinking of using Seachem Stability. I put Tetra SafeStart in the tank when I initially set it up, but it doesn't seem to have helped.

Thanks!

 

[sillygirl423]

When my boyfriend started his tank like 3 years ago, I remember him running it for weeks before getting fish. Also I dunno if this will help, but every water change we use aquasafe (we use tap water) it says its "bioextract formula works to enhance the bacteriological bed which promotes clearer healthier water". He has all but 3 of his original fish.

 

[bruinsbro1997]

When my boyfriend started his tank like 3 years ago, I remember him running it for weeks before getting fish. Also I dunno if this will help, but every water change we use aquasafe (we use tap water) it says its "bioextract formula works to enhance the bacteriological bed which promotes clearer healthier water". He has all but 3 of his original fish.

Some of the aquasafe products are kind of a scam IMO. You can't really help a bacterial bed unless you add ammonia which will just kill fish. If you're looking for water conditioner me and many other members on here use SeaChem Prime.

 

[sillygirl423]

If its not broke don't fix it? Or would it be more beneficial to my fish to change products?

 

[S_Morgan]

Some of the aquasafe products are kind of a scam IMO. You can't really help a bacterial bed unless you add ammonia which will just kill fish. If you're looking for water conditioner me and many other members on here use SeaChem Prime.

Okay. Now I'm confused. Why would I add ammonia? I appear to have plenty of ammonia for the bacteria. I just need to figure out the fastest way to add bacteria.

Based on what I read, SeaChem Stability is supposed to do this. Are you telling me that it won't work?

Thanks!

 

[sillygirl423]

Not to sound stupid or anything but is it possible something is wrong with the filtration system? Like manufacturing defect? Or something along those lines?

 

[bruinsbro1997]

Okay. Now I'm confused. Why would I add ammonia? I appear to have plenty of ammonia for the bacteria. I just need to figure out the fastest way to add bacteria.

Based on what I read, SeaChem Stability is supposed to do this. Are you telling me that it won't work?

Thanks!

The fastest way to add bacteria to your tank is to get some seeded media from someone. I'm sure an LFS would be willing to give you some.
I have never tried SeaChem Stability or any other brands that instantly cycle you tank. There's too many factors that can and can't make this product and many others like it work, for example the number of fish, if your tank has been set up yet, how you are on your PWC, etc. You can try it but I have no idea how it will work for you.