new tank - trying to cycle

[cyates]

I bought a tank from a guy in the classifieds, so everything was used, even the substrate.

I didn't clean the substrate when I first set it up, and the ammonia levels were sky-rocketing. I took all the gravel out and put it brand new gravel.

It's a 55gallon 43" tank, with an emporer 400 power filter, using two carbon filters, and two ammo-chips media.

Ever since I put the new substrate in, it has been exactly the same - crystal clear water,
40 nitrate
0 nitrite
120ppm hardness
120-180 buffer
7.6-8.0 pH

It has been like this every time I've tested it for over three weeks now. I can't get the pH to lower at all. I've dumped three bottles of pH-down in over this period of time, doing the suggested amount per 24 hours, but it just stays a red color, rather than turning orange which is what color it should be for around 6.8-7 which is what I want. I've had a dozen feeder fish in, and half a dozen tiger barbs. I've since removed all of those fish and put to Pimelodus Pictus catfish in just recently.

So, I have two questions:

1) It's going on a month now, shouldn't there be some signs of nitrites?
2) How do I lower the pH if pH-down isn't working?

Thanks!

 

[platylover]

From what I can tell from your readings, missing the ammonia reading, your tank should be cycled. when the tank is showing zero ammonia, zero nitrItes, and some nitrAte, then your tank should be cycled. The only reservations I have about your tank is the fact that you are trying to lower the ph with a ph-down. This can be very dangerous for you fish since this promotes ph swings that can kill fish. I would suggest getting fish that are used to the ph level that you already have. As far as any other ways of lowering the ph, I don't know.

 

[Endgame319]

Your pH and kH are looking close to mine, and I think the best route you could take would be to add 1 or 2 DIY co2 injectors to the tank. For me it dropped the pH to around neutral in less than a day, some peat moss in the filter would also work, you could probably get it to around 6.5-7. And stay clear of pH down chemicals. With your high buffering capacity, the pH would go down for a few hours, then swing back up to what it was before, and this can be fatal to your fish.

What are your ammonia readings? You could have already had your nitrite and ammonia spike, or the bacteria could have lived from when the previous owner had it. If your ammonia and nitrites are 0 and they stay that way, then your tank is cycled and ready for fish.

 

[cyates]

Ammonia and nitrite have been zero for over a week.

The DIY injectors, is that a one-use thing or is it continous, requiring me to keep refilling a co2 tank?

Same question with the peat moss. Which would be cheaper?

Thanks!

 

[Endgame319]

I suggest both. The injector you have to change the mixture every 10-14 days to keep the pH down. But co2 is also very good for plants, if you have any for your tank. And I'm quite sure that peat moss is a one time thing. They are both quite cheap. Under $5. Here are the diy instructions: http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/CO2/

What fish were you planning on keeping any way? Most fish can be acclimated to higher pH and hardness then they're used to and do fine. Unless your looking at breeding or sensitive fish (discus or blue rams). I dont suggest changing it at all. There are many beautiful fish that love your kind of water.

*Edit*
And it looks like your tank is fully cycled - nitrite and ammonia is 0, nitrates are visible. But make sure you dont add fish to fast. About 20% of the intended bio-load at a time is good. And do water changes to keep your nitrates below 40. At levels higher than that, nitrates can become toxic to fish.

 

[Allivymar]

Just a heads up; dump the pH Down. Besides the fact its obviously not working for you, it can really mess up a tank and your fish. Do check out this article for an explanation of pH, gH, kH and how they are interrelated: http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-chem.html

Also, I agree. What type of fish you are looking to keep will help dictate what your ph/hardness would be best at; you may not need to change it at all.

 

[cyates]

Well, I want to keep a happy healthy puffer, which likes ph to be 6.5-7.0. I went to the pet store and they had dried peat fiber for the fluval canister filters. I am going to put it in my media container for the emporer filter, unless you guys think that's a bad idea.

The only think I dont like is that the box says it will turn the water a slight tan. Not that big of a deal, but I like that my water is clear enough to look through the tank from the side and it's as if you were just looking through glass.

Oh, btw, my mom is setting up a 20gallon tank now cus she saw mine. She used red rocks for her substrate, and even though she rinsed them thorougly the water has a red tint, and it's been like that for two days. Will that go away? I tried using the particle clumper stuff, but it didn't improve.

 

[Allivymar]

Depends on what the rocks consist of. I'd be suspicious of rocks that continue to leach color into the tank even after being rinsed thoroughly.

Particle clumper stuff is another thing we tend to avoid here. Its called a flocculent, and while it DOES clump smaller particles into larger ones, those larger particles tend to fall into the substrate and don't wind up in the filter like the claims say. They also aren't great for fish either.

The less chemicals added to the tank the better. Most of us use a chlorine/chloramine removing water treatment for water changes and thats it.

What sort of puffer btw? Theres quite a few different species.

 

[cyates]

The one I have my eye on is the figure eight puffer. The reason being that it is used to not-so-brackish water, and aren't as feisty with tank-mates. Or so I've been told.

Here, let me show you a picture of the 20gal tank. Sorry, my digital camera sucks and takes blurry pictures

Maybe the rocks weren't rinsed well enough. So now how do I get rid of the redness?

 

[Allivymar]

Figure eights; cute lil buggers! Nice writeup about em here on puffernet: http://puffernet.tripod.com/biocellatus.html . We have a few puffer gurus on this forum btw; you might want to start a new thread with puffer in the topic so they see it and pop in.

Oh yuck; that tank looks like a bad horror movie. My first suggestion is removing and dumping the gravel; its obviously NOT appropriate for a fish tank. Running carbon in the filter MIGHT remove it, but only if you change the carbon often (probably every day).

 

[cyates]

Why would the rocks not be meant for an aquarium if I bought them at the LFS where all the other gravel substrate bags were?

What method do you guys use to rinse your gravel?

 

[Endgame319]

Rocks should NOT leach their color into the water. If you didn't rince it well, you'd see dust particles and stuff, but the water should not be RED.

 

[Menagerie]

It could be a bad batch. I would take a water sample with some gravel in a jar to the LFS and ask if anyone else is having that problem.