Newbie + ammonia = help!

[perinowski]

Hello! I'm so happy to have found this forum! I hope you can help me. For the past 8 weeks I have had an new fishless tank that consistently tests high for ammonia. Today I bought an API Master Test Kit to hone in on the problem. The test results are as follows: ammonia - over 8ppm (the test water is almost black ); pH - 7.6; nitrite - 0; nitrate - 0.

A little word about the setup: new 5 gallon Eclipse with BioWheel, never used gravel (purchased about 5 years ago & stashed in closet), new plastic plants.

I have tried 25% (4 weeks ago) and 50% (one week ago) water changes using bottled spring water. I treat the water with Tetra AquaSafe Plus and have tried AmmoLock. Our tap water tests 0 for ammonia.

Does anyone have any ideas as to why this is happening? I would love to see some little swimming buddies in the tank but it's just too toxic right now. Is it possible that the gravel is to blame?

Thank you so much for any help you can give.

 

[loveconvicts]

If there are no fish in the tank there is no reason to a water change. The tank is goin through what is called the cycle! Just let the tank run its course and you'll see the ammonia go down, then the nitrite go up and finally the nitrite will go down and nitrate go up. You only do water changes while doing fish in cycles.

 

[akkitten]

When I started my fishless cycle a few weeks ago my ammonia was that high as well. Wanting to encourage the nitrites I did do about a 50% pwc to bring the ammonia down some. Now, a week later I have nitrites and nitrate and ammonia is a zero...I am having to add a few drops of ammonia twice a day to keep at at 1.0 while I am awaiting the nitrites to go down. I do have it planted with a java fern and a banana plant which helps the process I am told. I don't know ab out the tetra aqua safe and ammo lock, but everyone on here pretty much recommends Prime for the tanks.

 

[fort384]

The water is testing at 8+ppm ammonia and there are no fish in the tank, and you are not adding a source of ammonia? Something is wrong...

What kind of substrate are you using?

The tank will not cycle with that much ammonia in the water. I would perform a 75% water change to get the ammonia down to something more manageable. For a fishless cycle, you do not want the ammonia to go above about 4 ppm. Higher than that, and the good bacteria (nitrobacter and nitrosoma) will not be able to grow.

 

[perinowski]

The water is testing at 8+ppm ammonia and there are no fish in the tank, and you are not adding a source of ammonia? Something is wrong...

What kind of substrate are you using?

Nope, I'm not adding any ammonia.

Is bottled spring water the best thing to use for the water changes?

Substrate? Sorry for my ignorance, but do you mean gravel? The gravel I have was a bag of aquarium I picked up about 5 years ago from Petco or Walmart. Since everything is new (I even replaced the plastic plants with brand new ones last week) I wondered if the gravel was the problem. Have you ever heard the that?

 

[fort384]

Plain ol' aquarium gravel does not usually leech ammonia. Some specialized plant substrates will for a few weeks after adding...

You should just be able to use tap water for your water changes... especially if you tested it and it doesn't contain ammonia. You just need to treat the water with a dechlorinator like prime before adding it back to the tank.

And there are no fish in the tank right?

 

[mfdrookie516]

Test your ammonia test kit against distilled water... it should read 0ppm. Are you sure you're performing the test correctly? There's something not right here.

An after thought: You said "buddies" in your first post. Your tank is not big enough for anything except a single betta. Just wanted to make sure that gets in here.

 

[perinowski]

No fish. I took the water into Petsmart for the first 3 weeks for testing then just bought the strips and treated & tested almost daily. But after reading the forums here, went out and bought the API Master kit. Petsmart wouldn't even sell me fish because of the ammonia.

So, a 5 gallon tank isn't big enough for a few tetras? Maybe I should scrap this tank and go bigger?

Thank you again everyone. I appreciate your expertise.

 

[fort384]

I would do a 100% water change and test again tomorrow. Something is leaching ammonia, or something was contaminated in your tank. I would also test your tap water again or some distilled, as mfd suggested, just to make sure you get a 0 reading out of your test kit. Something is screwy...

There are a few options for fish in a 5 gal. A 10 or 20 gal (or even larger!) would offer a lot wider range of stocking options. But 5 gal tanks can be very interesting too.

A betta would be an excellent choice. The stocking police will come and arrest me, but I keep 5 neons in a heavily planted 5 gal tank. Have for years with no issues. They are schooling fish, and the common thinking is they need more space to swim... but mine school together and seem to get along just fine. I think it helps that I always have them in a heavily planted tank... the plants break it up nicely.

There are also a few other nano type fish out there that you could put in a 5 gal in small quantities. They are not widely available though, and certainly if you are getting your fish from petsmart, the species I am talking about won't be stocked there. However, you can find them for mail order various places on the net (aquabid.com, franksaquarium.com)

There will be disagreements, but I think you could safely keep a small group of pretty much any of the following in a 5 gal:
Phoenix Rasbora
Sparrow Rasbora
Chili Rasbora
Spotted Rasbora
Endlers

In addition, there are also many types of FW Shrimp that are colorful, and perfectly suitable for that size tank.

Red Cherry Shrimp
Blackberry Shrimp
Amano Shrimp
Ghost Shrimp
Crystal Red Shrimp
Crystal Black Shrimp
bumblebee shrimp
(and many others)

 

[perinowski]

Ok, tomorrow I'll test my tap water & do a total water change. No reason not to try that. If this fails, maybe after a week, then I will change the gravel.

Thank you for the recommendations for fish & shrimp. I think the kids would love to see little shrimp in the tank. We have some aquarium stores in the area besides Petsmart and it sounds like we need to visit them to see about the Rasboras. I probably should have visited them right from the start anyway.

Thanks again!

 

[fort384]

Sounds good... the fish I listed are pretty rare... not all rasboras are as small as the ones I listed and most rasboras won't be suitable for a 5g.

Let us know what happens with the water. It is a really strange circumstance. I would be extremely surprised if plain aquarium gravel is causing the issue.

 

[ejaramillo01]

Also remember that most of the local fish stores will see your wallet and your dollars as soon as you enter the store, before they think in what is the best in the long term for your tank.

So read, and read, and read, before you go to the stores.

 

[fort384]

Also remember that most of the local fish stores will see your wallet and your dollars as soon as you enter the store, before they think in what is the best in the long term for your tank.

So read, and read, and read, before you go to the stores.

VERY good advice. A lot of them will sell you just about anything if you are willing to buy it.

 

[perinowski]

Gotcha! Let's keep our fingers crossed that the water change fixes things. I'll keep you posted. I appreciate the advice.

 

[perinowski]

Quick update - Unbeknownst to me, my daughter put some water from a family friend's well established, healthy tank into ours Sunday morning as a means of populating it with good bacteria. So I guess I'll let that circulate for a week before I do a complete water change.

I tested the tank again today, super high ammonia. I also tested the tap water with the API Master Kit instead of the dip sticks (which is what I feel like for buying them) and it's at 1ppm (the sticks show 0). So I tested the filtered water from the fridge and it's at 0-.25ppm. I guess we'll be using the fridge water for changes!

 

[mfdrookie516]

Ok, so basically 2 things here that I see.

A- if the ammonia is above 6ppm, bacteria will not live.
B- nitrifying bacteria are not in the water column. Simply putting a cup of water from one tank to another does nothing but put dirty water in your tank.

If you can get the ammonia down to 4ppm or less, you can take some substrate or filter media from your daughters friends tank, and seed that bacteria in your tank. That will be a big help!

 

[TraceyB4602]

The tank water from an established tank won't help. If she can needs to get some gravel or a the sponge filter to seed your tank.

Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium

 

[perinowski]

Another quick update - ammonia still off the charts. Took a sample of the gravel, rinsed it several times with neutral (zero ammonia), filtered water. Put the sample in a glass container with clean filtered water, and let it set for a few hours. Ran ammonia test on that water and it was 4ppm.

Decided to do a 100% water & gravel change. Sooooooo, now we're running the test again with new gravel before we set the tank up.

The gal at the pet store said that since the original gravel was sitting in a closet for several years, it may have developed bacteria that threw the ammonia off - sounds far fetched but at least it's a theory.

Will let you know how the new gravel tests. Thanks again for all the input!