Nitrite and the cycling process

[feinhorn]

I you add products like Nitri-zorb to remove high Nitrite levels during cycling are you hurting the cycling process or is it ok? I have finally gotten to 0 ammonia but my Nitrites are very high. I know that this is part of cycling but should I just do water changes like every other day or can I use this Nitri-zorb product and do water changes like once a week?

 

[mound]

no no no - don't add NItri-Zorb - the cycling process is creating 2 bacterial colonies, one that will convert the ammonia to Nitrite (the spiked Nitrite readings you are seeing now) the other converts Nitrite to Nitrate - the less toxic form that you dilute with water changes.

If you add Nitri-zorb, you're removing all the food for this second type of bacteria, and you will never establish that equally important colony..

Just wait it out - don't do water changes either as that will delay the process. Eventually the Nitrites will reach zero (as the 2nd form of essential bacteria establishes itself.) At that point you will have a high concentration of Nitrate. Do a 50% water change and you'll be ready to go

 

[loganj]

Whether to just wait it out depends, IMO, on the nitrite levels. If they are high enough to kill the fish, I would suggest doing some water changes to lower the concentration. I really don't think this will lengthen the cycle much. The bacteria will reproduce at its maximum rate until it reaches an equilibrium with the available food. I have always done water changes on new tanks to keep the ammonia/nitrite in check and have never experienced a cycle longer than about 6 weeks. JMHO.
Logan J

 

[Jack]

I agree with Mound. Don't use the nitrite remover. However, as LoganJ stated, a water change might be necessary. A water change will dilute the nitrite but will not remove. It will likely lengthen the tank's cycle, but will allow it to continue.

 

[mound]

Whether to just wait it out depends, IMO, on the nitrite levels. If they are high enough to kill the fish, I would suggest doing some water changes to lower the concentration

I was assuming in my post that the tank was being cycled without any fish..
(my mind has been all wrapped up in the fishless cycle as of late, as I'm currently doing that on my new 125g tank)

If you put fish in the tank w/o cycling it, or a handful of the hardy types for the cycle, then I'd agree, if N02 is VERY high, do a small water change..

 

[Jack]

Mound, how do you do a fishless cycle in a FW tank? I was looking for some information a while back, but couldn't find anything other than "bottled bacteria". I'm a little sceptical about the bottled bacteria stuff. I agree that there could be plenty of bacteria in the bottle, but without food, the bacteria won't survive for long. You have to have fish (or something) to feed the bacteria.

Most reefkeepers cycle tanks with liverock. The die-off from the rock starts the cycle process. Cycling with liverock seems to lower typical ammonia and nitrite levels during the cycle (JME). Almost always, some organisms make it through the cycle.

 

[mound]

as far as I know, there is no difference between doing a fishless cycle in a FW vs. a SW tank.. I'm doing it the way you'll find in most "recipies" on the net -

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/fishless_cycling.php

that's what I followed.. (well, I waaay overdosed with NH3 up front, haven't added anymore since, but the cycle is moving along nicely)

 

[Jack]

Thanks, mound. Very interesting. The only drawback I see is that you really need to add a large bioload after the cycle, or you'll lose some bacteria due to starvation. It wouldn't hurt the tank, it would just force you to add additional livestock at a slower pace.

 

[mound]

I don't know if you'd lose any bacteria due to starvation or not. I guess maybe you would.. in my case, I plan to fully populate the tank with cichlids when the cycle is complete -which is the primary reason I chose to do it this way - so as to limit aggression by introducing them all at once.. The secondary reason is that I am opposed, in principle, to buying fish I don't want, only to force them to live in their own sewage treatment plant for several weeks..

 

[loganj]

The secondary reason is that I am opposed, in principle, to buying fish I don't want, only to force them to live in their own sewage treatment plant for several weeks..

Couldn't have said it any better!

 

[Jack]

"The secondary reason is that I am opposed, in principle, to buying fish I don't want, only to force them to live in their own sewage treatment plant for several weeks."

This is the primary reason folks don't use fish to cycle a reef tank. However, when cycling with liverock, you still have to add fish slowly. Of course, most folks use the berlin method of filtration in reef tanks (the filtration occurs in the rock itself, no equipment). Also, many folks don't like damsels as they can be pretty aggressive. Damsels are about the only fish recommended to cycle a SW tank.

 

[loganj]

A dead shrimp from the grocery store will work fine on either SW or FW...basically all you need is something to rot and produce ammonia. You can even add liquid ammonia to the water and start the cycle that way.
If you cycle with uncured LR, there will be a good bit of die off which will produce a lot of ammonia and nitrite. Although you still have to add fish slowly, there is a good bacterial colony established from the LR cycle. The tank shouldn't experience a spike in either ammonia or nitrite when fish are added.