ph crash at the end of my cycle

[wasteguys2000]

I am doing well with my tank cycle all my trites and ammo are gone in 24 hours, now I am getting big drops in ph and cannot keep it above 6 from 7 ,Is this a problem? And if it is what should I do?

 

[jcolon]

Are you using regular tap water for your PWC? A big pH crashes can be the result of water losing minerals that help keep pH stable. Most municipal tap water has these dissolved minerals / nutrients. But if your municipal gets it's water from reservoirs or you use RO water, then you could experience pH drops since it's softer water.

You can add crushed corals, limestone and or Marble to your tank to help increase pH naturally. In a media bag in the filter seems to work well.

 

[wasteguys2000]

This is with tap water. When I do a water change I can keep the ph good for about 14 hours then it is at 6, and that is with crushed coral. I am worried that these crashes are gonna wipe my cycle.

 

[eco23]

This is with tap water. When I do a water change I can keep the ph good for about 14 hours then it is at 6, and that is with crushed coral. I am worried that these crashes are gonna wipe my cycle.

Do you have the CC in your filter or just in the tank? Placing it into the filter will be the most efficient as it will dissolve faster and help to raise the GH / KH.

The pH crashes won't "wipe" your cycle, but it will make it challenging to complete. Nitrification stops around 6, and once it crashes it can take several days for the bacteria to become active again.

As jcolon said, the bacteria consume the minerals / alkalinity in your water as they convert the ammo / no2. Normally pwc's will replenish what's needed, but in your case the tap water obviously doesn't have high enough alkalinity to support all the conversion happening.

Once cycled, the bacteria should slow down its consumption of the alkalinity since you won't be asking it to consume 4ppm within 24 hours, but as low as your KH seems to be, permanently running a small bag of CC might be a good idea (what I have to do).

If the CC doesn't seem to be buffering the water enough, you can also look at other products like aragonite (which is better at buffering) or even a buffering powder sold at the store. I'd recommend a natural approach like CC or aragonite once the tank is stocked...but since it's an empty tank at the moment, you can basically add in anything you want which will help.

 

[wasteguys2000]

Ty that was great info.

 

[swimwithme]

what about Replenish??

 

[eco23]

what about Replenish??

I'm not 100%, but I believe the products made for reconstituting water like Replenish and Kent's R/O Right focus more on the GH and not the alkalinity...so it only solves half of the problem. I know another member was using the Kent's stuff and still having crashes.

A product like Seachem Marine Buffer (I think you can use it in FW) would be more effective in a case like this since it's sole purpose is to raise pH and keep it there, as opposed to a product like Replenish which is more to restore minerals / electrolytes which are stripped from the water during purification.

 

[swimwithme]

I'm not 100%, but I believe the products made for reconstituting water like Replenish and Kent's R/O Right focus more on the GH and not the alkalinity...so it only solves half of the problem. I know another member was using the Kent's stuff and still having crashes.

A product like Seachem Marine Buffer (I think you can use it in FW) would be more effective in a case like this since it's sole purpose is to raise pH and keep it there, as opposed to a product like Replenish which is more to restore minerals / electrolytes which are stripped from the water during purification.

Thanks eco. I wasn't sure. As always, you are so helpful!

 

[wasteguys2000]

Well ATM I used API Ph up to atleast get it to 7 for the moment when you use the coral does it eventually completely dissolve? One more question,my Ph will eventually stop dropping once I get my fish in the tank? I am asking because I do not want to stress my new friends anymore then I have to.

 

[OasisKeeper]

Well ATM I used API Ph up to atleast get it to 7 for the moment when you use the coral does it eventually completely dissolve?

Yes it is dissolving. But a little amount of solid coral has a lot calcium carbonate in it. As the pH rises, the rate at which it dissolves will slow.
Put another way, a handful of coral bits should last long time.

One more question,my Ph will eventually stop dropping once I get my fish in the tank? I am asking because I do not want to stress my new friends anymore then I have to.

If your tap water is acidic (low pH) and/or soft, it is going to be an ongoing problem with each PWC. Fish waste contributes to acidic conditions as well.

I know the idea of preparing water in advance is disliked by many fresh water keepers, but the salties and reefers do it all the time. I am a big believer in knowing what I am putting into the tank before I put it in. It really depends on your water source.

You can 'build' harder water inexpensively just using Epsom Salts for GH and Baking Soda (sodium carbonate) for KH. There are many references for this on the web and a little google foo will give you the info you require if you want to try it.

 

[wasteguys2000]

That is all great info. I will take a look at the option of keeping water that is at good levels.

 

[wasteguys2000]

Update, The PH crashes put a hurting on my cycle as far as i can tell, I dosed to 4ppm Ammonia and in 24 hours I get Ammonia .25 ,Nitrite .50, Nitrate 40ppm and I am still fighting to keep ph up past 6 using coral and I have to use API Ph up liquid buffer or it will drop to 6 before the 24 hours is up. Does this look like it will still turn out ok?

 

[librarygirl]

So you had nitrites and they spiked and fell and now you are seeing them again? Or is this the first time you have nitrites?

I'm wondering if the liquid buffer is interfering with the coral. If the PH UP only brings the PH to 7 it may be preventing the coral from raising it further. Although admittedly I could be way off on that theory.

How much CC are you using and where is it (in your filter or tank)?

 

[wasteguys2000]

Yes I had nitrites they spiked and then fell, now they are back but it very small amounts, as far as the coral goes I am using about a baseball size amount in the tank and I have as much as i can fit in my filter, i used just the coral at first and it was not enough to keep the ph stable when I use 4ppm ammonia. So without the PH up product my ph would hit 6 while I am dosing to 4ppm.

 

[librarygirl]

Have you tried squeezing the CC to loosen it up? That can help release some of the particles and should raise the PH, at least in theory. I'm not sure how long that would last though. Have you tried the crushed argonite? It's similar to CC but can be better at buffering I think. If you're seeing nitrites again that may be a sign you're starting to lose some BB from the PH being too low. Maybe try another product like the Seachem Marine Buffer Eco suggested to see if you can get the PH above 7?

 

[wasteguys2000]

K, here is the test results from last night (after 24 hours from 4ppm ammo) my Ammonia .25/.50, nitrites are at .50, and my nitrates are at 40ppm. Am i safe to say that I am getting back on track if I am almost consuming all my ammonia in 24 hours and my nitrites are not spiking?

 

[wasteguys2000]

Ok, a week later and it looks like my cycle has gone back to the nitite part. I was getting around .25 and .50 ammo and nitrite all last week until last night, last night I was at 0-.25 ammo but had 5ppm nitrites.
Now, during the morning on Sunday I tested a drop in my ph to 6, that test was taken at 5am and before that the last test was at 11pm Saturday (6 hours). I have been testing every 2 hours when I am home and not sleeping to watch for sudden drops and this was the first big drop since the post was started.
Is it safe to say that my cycle is back to phase 2? Should I throw in the towel due to the acidic water here? Anyone who has fought this battle with ph and willing to share your method would be helpful .

 

[jetajockey]

One other thing that hasn't been brought up is what about cutting back on ammonia dosing? 4ppm is a ton of ammonia for the tank to process daily and it's not likely that you are going to stock so heavily to recreate this amount of ammonia production anyhow.

Worst case scenario if you cut back on the ammonia dosing is that when you do start stocking you might have to do it in stages rather than all at once, but at least it's a different approach to the problem.

You don't have to follow these guides to the exact letter to cycle your tank, they aren't meant to cover every single possible situation.

 

[wasteguys2000]

Ty Jeta, I will try lowering the dose on todays and see what that brings.