Severly high ammonia help

[bkiggy]

I have done water changes, used BioSpira, NutraFin Cycle, Prime for water changes, added StressCoat, added salt for electrolytes
Jesus!!!! Fish are all alive still and show no signs of stress
40 gallon all live plants -
Ammonia 3.0, Nitrites 0, Nitrates 0
I have an Elephant nose
Pictus cat, upside down cat, angel and albino Cory

5 maybe 6 weeks running....
Cycling still ????? Ammonia will not change





A
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[tamtam]

yes it's still cycling, though it's strange your not seeing any nitrites 6 week in. Have you done anything to your filter or media? Have you seen any nitrites yet at all?

Whats your water change schedule? Sadly that's the only way to get ammonia down. With ammo that high though it's going to take a lot of changes and really big ones.

You'll have to do 50% or more, test an hour later to see where your levels are. Then probably repeat the process a few more times until you get it down to below .5. My guess would be about 4 back to back changes of about 50% to get that level down.

Are you making sure you vac the gravel well with changes? I'd also cut back on feeding while you cycle to help keep that ammo down. Every other day is plenty.

 

[bkiggy]

Feeding every other day now. Brine shrimp and Spiralina. Also couple sinking shrimp pellets for Cory and catfish
- no nitrites at all ;(
- no nitrates at all ;(
will the water changes in that quantity shock the fish?
vacuum gravel, yes
- are my chemicals ok that I'm using to 'cycle'
Never touched filters. Use Aquaclear sponge, ammo cubes, carbon

 

[tamtam]

Feeding every other day now. Brine shrimp and Spiralina. Also couple sinking shrimp pellets for Cory and catfish
- no nitrites at all ;(
- no nitrates at all ;(
will the water changes in that quantity shock the fish?
vacuum gravel, yes
- are my chemicals ok that I'm using to 'cycle'
Never touched filters. Use Aquaclear sponge, ammo cubes, carbon

That's a bummer, slow moving cycles can be a real pain.

It shouldn't. Provided you temp match your water and there isn't a huge flux in your out of tap ph and in tank ph you should be fine. A big jump in PH or temp can shock your fish though.

I wouldn't bother with the Stresscoat. PRIME actually does that as well so you can save on adding that. Personally I don't bother with those cycle products, I've never had them make a difference on a cycle for myself, though some people swear by them. I also think that BioSpira is a similar idea to the Nutrifin so I wouldn't use both if you do want to use them.

Honestly all I ever add to my tank is a good quality water conditioner, it's really all you need in most cases. Though if you can get your hands on some seeded media this would be a huge help.

I can't say on the media as I've always run a basic hob with pads/sponge or floss. I modified my filters to remove the carbon since it's biggest purpose is to remove meds or tannins from your water. Most feel it doesn't really serve a purpose otherwise.

 

[librarygirl]

Hi neighbor! (I'm next door in Rhode Island!)

What test kit are you using, liquid or strips?

Have you tested your tap water for ammonia? If not, do so, it's possible your tap has ammonia in it.

No need for all those chemicals; Prime is good enough. I wouldn't bother with salt either; dosing can be hard and it builds up. It can help a bit in the nitrite phase, not sure about the ammonia phase though.

What's your PH? A low PH can stall the cycling process.

With ammonia at 3 I'd do a 50-60%% water change (test your tap first though; no sense putting crazy amounts of ammonia back in if your tap has a lot of ammonia in it), then wait a couple of hours. This should bring ammonia down to about 1.5. Then do another 50%-60% water change (make sure to use PRime each time and try to match the temp of the new water with the tank water as closely as you can---feel both with your hand).

What filter(s) are you running?

 

[bkiggy]

Filter is an Aquaclear 50

with sponge,ammo chips, and bio, took carbon out. Did 10 gallon WC out of 40 gallon and it went down 1 point from 3.5 to about 2.0
Ph is 7.5+\-
No nitrates no nitrites

Now the brackish tank is screaming ammonia and it is the same set up. Only have a puffer in it

Is the Brine shrimp skrewing up the water. Don't have a choice to feed them though and sinking shrimp pellets from catfish ?

 

[Borderlesscott]

Stop using everything but Prime, big water changes, and get the API master kit.

 

[librarygirl]

Filter is an Aquaclear 50

with sponge,ammo chips, and bio, took carbon out. Did 10 gallon WC out of 40 gallon and it went down 1 point from 3.5 to about 2.0
Ph is 7.5+\-
No nitrates no nitrites

Now the brackish tank is screaming ammonia and it is the same set up. Only have a puffer in it

Is the Brine shrimp skrewing up the water. Don't have a choice to feed them though and sinking shrimp pellets from catfish ?

An AC 50 on a 40 gal, particularly with all the fish you have isn't enough. I'd recommend a canister (Fluval or Eheim are good ones; I have an Eheim 2215 on a 40 gal and it works well). At the very least, add another AC, the largest you can get (110). I suspect that your fish load is so high and your filtration is so low that there isn't enough surface area on which the bacteria can form; more/larger fish = more waste which = need for more bacteria. Did you test your tap water for ammonia? A 10 gal change on a 50 gal with ammonia at 3 isn't enough; LARGER water changes are needed (50%) and probably more than one to start reducing that ammonia. ALso take out the ammo chips, replace it with a sponge or bio-rings, something which the bacteria can form on a little better.

 

[bkiggy]

Really? Too many fish? I only have a pictus cat baby, albino Cory, adult elephant nose, upside down cat baby, and 1 angel.
I was eventually going to get more Corys , and bristle nose Pleco, maybe even Borneo sucker.

So what about a 110 Aquaclear filter . I have biological filter sponge and ammonia chips

Took out carbon

 

[bkiggy]

I did last night a 10 gallon water change. I have 40 gallon remember with all live plants. About 10 plants I feed with root tabs.

I will do another water change tomorrow.
What about all the algae ? I scrub it by hand right now

 

[tamtam]

I did last night a 10 gallon water change. I have 40 gallon remember with all live plants. About 10 plants I feed with root tabs.

I will do another water change tomorrow.
What about all the algae ? I scrub it by hand right now

10 gallon in a 40 is still not going to be enough to bring your level down from around 3. You are probably going to need to do a large 50% and probably another larger one after that. You should do the change and re test your water in an hour to see what change it made and keep doing changes this way until it's down to .25. You really need to bump up the amount of water you are changing and how often to control these levels, even with the tank planted. 10% a couple times a week or 20-30% weekly is enough to maintain a cycled tank but while fish in cycling you really need to do more.

You can just scrub the algae off for now. It's not uncommon for new tanks to deal with algae like this, once your tank is up and running for a while and your plants are well established they will beat out the algae.

 

[bkiggy]

I was thinking of getting a NEW filter Aquaclear 110 or Fluval 405? (For 100 g tanks)
The biggest they make
Or is a Fluval 305 for 70 gall enough ?
Not finished cycling yet. NitrItes have not shown up 0
0 nitrAtes
Ammonia 3.0

 

[tamtam]

What are your running on it right now? A new filter can't hurt but don't remove the old one/media or you will be stepping back to the beginning. If you aren't seeing nitrites yet I'd say you are a ways away from finishing your cycle. Weeks at least.

You really need to pick up those water changes and get that ammo down. at 3ppm it's surprising you aren't loosing fish. I'd be pretty worried about ammonia burns with such high levels for so long.

 

[bkiggy]

Ph is 7.6 also

I was going to take media out of this filter and put it in new one. Aquaclear has foam , ammonia chips and bio rocks
Took out charcoal
Tank has been running for 6 weeks

 

[bkiggy]

Did back to back water changes. Got Ammon down to 1
0 nitrites
0 nitrates
Did water changes effect cycling process??
Use bio Spira for bacteria

 

[tamtam]

Did back to back water changes. Got Ammon down to 1
0 nitrites
0 nitrates
Did water changes effect cycling process??
Use bio Spira for bacteria

that's great. No it didn't, no need to worry about that. Your fish will be providing ammonia to feed the bacteria and there is no worry about removing that bacteria because it's not housed in your water column. You just need to keep those levels down where they are safe for your fish

 

[bkiggy]

New filter Fluval 406 will be here in 10 days.

I plan to put the media from the Aquaclear in the Fluval and dump a bottle to Stability in it. I added a bottle of Colony today to help jump start.
Ammonia is stable at 1.0
0 nitrites
0 nitrates
7.2 ph

 

[bkiggy]

Crap

Ammonia was back up to 2 and ph went down to 6.5
?
Am I worrying about nothing and just " leave it alone " ? A wait and see game now! ! I just don't want fish to die

 

[Dreadz]

As Librarygirl said, remove the ammo chips. They're likely to be zeolite based and whilst they will absorb the ammo initially, the salt you're adding to your water will cause the ammo to leach back into the water.
As for the bottled bacteria, try Tetra Safestart or Dr Tims One and Only. They're the only two that work. I can personally vouch for the Safestart, Turned my last cycle around rapidly.

 

[tamtam]

keep doing water changes. 2ppm is still way to high. Anytime it is over .5 you need to change water and keep changing until it it's down below .5.

Anything above .25 can start to cause stress of fish, .5 is the absolute highest you want it to be. This is the unfortunate reality of fish in cycles. Nothing but water changes is going to fix this problem while the cycle happens.