Water Quality OK, pH and GH are crazy low

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SassyMiss

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
May 3, 2013
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171
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Texas
Hi all, I started a 10 g cycling about 3 weeks ago and it seems that it's finally done (I seeded it with filter media from my 20 g). Yesterday, I tested the water, and ammonia was 0, nitrites were 0, and nitrates were 40 (this after I dosed the tank with ammonium the day before so as to see how long it took to cycle it).

But when I tested the pH, GH, and KH, the pH was 6, the GH was 60 mg/L (ppm? unsure but it took 6 drops of solution to make the reaction, using the Nutrafin testing kit) and the KH was below 10 mg/L (it took only 1 drop of solution to make the reaction happen).

In my 20 g, the pH is pretty stable at 7.6, with GH at 120 and the KH at 60. It's a planted tank, with java moss, java fern, amazon sword, water sprite, and others, with a large piece of driftwood. The substrate is Flourite and black sand.

In the 10 g, I have java moss and one java fern, with Fluval shrimp substrate (8.8 pounds) and 4 pound of black sand under the shrimp substrate.

In the 20 g, I have 8 glowlight tetras, 6 dainty corys, 2 platys, 1 dwarf gourami, about 4 ghost shrimp, 1 bamboo shrimp, 1 nerite snail, and a bunch of red cherry shrimps.

I was planning on moving the red cherries to the 10 gallon once it was stable and cycled.

I did a 50% water change last night after I tested the water, and will retest tonight, but does anyone have any ideas as to why the pH, KH, and GH are so low? And will it come back up on its own, if I let it cycle another week or do massive water changes, or should I add Equilibrium or Alkaline buffer?

Thanks so much for everyone's help!
 
A Gh of 6 is fine not low. As long as Gh and Kh are at least 4 in a planted tank your good. Your Kh is low which is likely why your Ph is low. So you can use baking soda to get Kh back up and in turn this will raise Ph. You have a small tank so try adding 1/2 teaspoon of baking soda premixed in a cup of tank water, wait a couple hours and retest. You can add more baking soda as needed to get to the level you want. I run almost all my tanks with a Kh and Gh of 4 (4 drops to change color), all are planted, and all do great. Unless your keeping livebearers or African cichlids you don't need a crazy high Gh and Kh.

One thing you need to worry about is when Ph falls to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB begins to die. It's not uncommon for Ph to fall during cycling so get out the baking soda and get the Kh/Ph back up.

If by chance your tap water has a low Kh and Ph you might want to add some crushed coral in a media bag and add to your filter or hang it under the outflow of your filter. This will add a steady supply of buffer to the tank.
 
A Gh of 6 is fine not low. As long as Gh and Kh are at least 4 in a planted tank your good. Your Kh is low which is likely why your Ph is low. So you can use baking soda to get Kh back up and in turn this will raise Ph. You have a small tank so try adding 1/2 teaspoon of baking soda premixed in a cup of tank water, wait a couple hours and retest. You can add more baking soda as needed to get to the level you want. I run almost all my tanks with a Kh and Gh of 4 (4 drops to change color), all are planted, and all do great. Unless your keeping livebearers or African cichlids you don't need a crazy high Gh and Kh.

One thing you need to worry about is when Ph falls to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB begins to die. It's not uncommon for Ph to fall during cycling so get out the baking soda and get the Kh/Ph back up.

If by chance your tap water has a low Kh and Ph you might want to add some crushed coral in a media bag and add to your filter or hang it under the outflow of your filter. This will add a steady supply of buffer to the tank.

Thank you so much for your suggestions. I say that they are crazy low because my other tank's parameters are so different yet I'm using the same tap water.

I plan on putting red cherry shrimp in my ten gallon, so would my parameters be okay for them?

Re: the crushed coral. Would a limestone rock work as well? I have a rock that reacts to vinegar (bubbling) and I seem to recall is its from the coast. I can soak it in hot water and then in a bucket of my old tank water for a week and add it to the tank; what do you think?
 
I'm not a shrimp expert but know RCS are pretty easy ones. IMO a GH and KH of 6 will be fine. And yes limestone will add buffers BUT unlike crushed coral you can't add or take away any if needed unless you have a bunch of small rocks.

If the rocks didn't come from the ocean or were exposed to salt water that should be fine. But really watch your readings so they don't go crazy high.

I've been in this hobby for over 30 years and I can tell you that if you set up 5 identical tanks side by side, waited till they matured for 4-6 months, did the same maintenance, used the same water, they would most likely all have different parameters. Each tank has it's own chemistry and things like different stock, different amounts or types of food, all kinds of reasons make each tanks water unique onto itself. That why I always say what works in one persons tank may not work in anothers.
 
I'm not a shrimp expert but know RCS are pretty easy ones. IMO a GH and KH of 6 will be fine. And yes limestone will add buffers BUT unlike crushed coral you can't add or take away any if needed unless you have a bunch of small rocks.

If the rocks didn't come from the ocean or were exposed to salt water that should be fine. But really watch your readings so they don't go crazy high.

I've been in this hobby for over 30 years and I can tell you that if you set up 5 identical tanks side by side, waited till they matured for 4-6 months, did the same maintenance, used the same water, they would most likely all have different parameters. Each tank has it's own chemistry and things like different stock, different amounts or types of food, all kinds of reasons make each tanks water unique onto itself. That why I always say what works in one persons tank may not work in anothers.

Thanks for your help. I didn't know that about parameters and different tanks. I realize they wouldn't be identical but didn't realize they would vary so much. Learn something new everyday, I guess! :)

These are freshwater clam shells I think. I put them in and my rock, about 24-36 hours ago. Since I don't have inhabitants yet, I thought to experiment. Kh is 20, Gh is 100, ph is 6.4. I'm going to do a 50% pwc, let it run for another few days, and see where I am then.

I'll keep you updated. And at the risk of sounding like a sycophant, I've heard of you and your reputation for being an aquatics plant expert, so I'd love to get your opinion of my planted 20 g.
 
Watch your Kh and Ph. When ph falls below 6.5 biological activity slows down. When ph falls to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB begins to die. You might want to raise your Kh which will in turn raise your Ph.

Post a picture of your tank and I'll take a look!
 
Watch your Kh and Ph. When ph falls below 6.5 biological activity slows down. When ph falls to 6 or below biological activity stops and BB begins to die. You might want to raise your Kh which will in turn raise your Ph.

Post a picture of your tank and I'll take a look!

Thanks! I have cryptocoryne, water sprite, bacopa caroliniana, java fern, java moss, Christmas moss, amazon sword, hornwort, ad some reddish leafed plant that I don't remember the name of.

I finally got a new bulb, a 10K one, and the plants look so much better.

Can bacopa be a carpeting plant? If so, can it be spread by cuttings?

image-1275937521.jpg

image-648133832.jpg

image-3775832482.jpg. This is the Christmas moss. It almost all died off, but its coming back.

image-3745029256.jpg. This is the java moss.

image-2597159263.jpg. The biggest amazon sword with the water sprite in the foreground. The water sprite almost died but has been growing more since the new bulb.

image-4223105472.jpg. The hornwort.

image-1195690366.jpg. This is the mystery plant. It was redder when I first got it.


Thanks for your educated opinion!
 
The plants look nice and healthy. I'm not a fan of those type decorations but if you could add some driftwood and a few rocks the tank would actually have a nice natural look to it.

The red plant appears to be some type of ludwigia. In order for plants to color up they need high light, low nitrates 10ppm, and higher phosphates 2-3ppm. CO2 and liquid carbon also helps. Yours is losing color most likely because your lighting is too low. When plants receive the proper combination of the above you can get all kinds of colors from different species....

Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community - Rivercats's Album: 5-12-13 update/new plants - Picture

Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community - Rivercats's Album: 5-12-13 update/new plants - Picture

Do you use root tabs under your swords and crypts since they are heavy root feeders? How about ferts for the water?
 
The plants look nice and healthy. I'm not a fan of those type decorations but if you could add some driftwood and a few rocks the tank would actually have a nice natural look to it.

The red plant appears to be some type of ludwigia. In order for plants to color up they need high light, low nitrates 10ppm, and higher phosphates 2-3ppm. CO2 and liquid carbon also helps. Yours is losing color most likely because your lighting is too low. When plants receive the proper combination of the above you can get all kinds of colors from different species....

Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community - Rivercats's Album: 5-12-13 update/new plants - Picture

Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community - Rivercats's Album: 5-12-13 update/new plants - Picture

Do you use root tabs under your swords and crypts since they are heavy root feeders? How about ferts for the water?

I actually have the moss growing on a large piece of driftwood. Several rocks are in there as well. That's what the big pink thing next to the driftwood.

I have root tabs under the amazon, crypts, and the water sprite as well as under the ludwigia. I dose Seachem Excel every other day, alternating with Seachem Flourish. But the amazon started having tiny holes in the leaves. I just noticed that today.

The plants are greener than they were before I changed the bulb. Is 10k too low light? What intensity light do you suggest?
 
Tiny pin holes usually indicate a potassium deficiency. You need to add another root tab or two. Depends on what brand you use. Swords and crypts really are nutrient hogs and they can use the nutrients from root tabs really quick.

Liquid carbon such as Excel is better when used daily as it only stays in solution 12-24 hours. If your worried about using Excel and Flouish together don't be, one is liquid carbon and one is a fert and are made to be used together or separately.

Plants can use light in the range of about 5000K to 10000K. Anything with a higher K rating has a lot of blue light spectrum which aquarium plants don't use but algae loves. Plants don't see light as we do, I run 6000K bulbs. The difference in say the 6000K bulbs I use to the 10K bulbs your using it that your 10K bulbs look brighter to the human eye.
 
Tiny pin holes usually indicate a potassium deficiency. You need to add another root tab or two. Depends on what brand you use. Swords and crypts really are nutrient hogs and they can use the nutrients from root tabs really quick.

Liquid carbon such as Excel is better when used daily as it only stays in solution 12-24 hours. If your worried about using Excel and Flouish together don't be, one is liquid carbon and one is a fert and are made to be used together or separately.

Plants can use light in the range of about 5000K to 10000K. Anything with a higher K rating has a lot of blue light spectrum which aquarium plants don't use but algae loves. Plants don't see light as we do, I run 6000K bulbs. The difference in say the 6000K bulbs I use to the 10K bulbs your using it that your 10K bulbs look brighter to the human eye.
I use Seachem's root tabs. I probably do need to add another one or two in the substrate. I will try it tonight and see if the new leaves look better.

On another (related note), the leaves on the amazon are also starting to look a little "see-though" - one or two looks a little lacy. Is it the same thing - low ferts?

I was dosing every other day because I was concerned about the effect on the shrimp. I'll up the dosage (slowly) this week and see what happens.

Thanks!
 
Definitely sounds like the are lacking the nutrients they need. The root tabs won't help the damaged leaves but new growth should be healthy. Another thing is if any of the leaves have a lot of damage you should cut them off so the plant puts all it's growing energy into new growth.
 
Definitely sounds like the are lacking the nutrients they need. The root tabs won't help the damaged leaves but new growth should be healthy. Another thing is if any of the leaves have a lot of damage you should cut them off so the plant puts all it's growing energy into new growth.

oh, yeah, you're right about that. I never thought about cutting the damaged leaves of a plant before I got into aquariums and planted tanks. I totally forgot about pruning. I'll do that tonight.
 
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