All new Died - Don't know why

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johngebw

Aquarium Advice Apprentice
Joined
May 15, 2005
Messages
10
Location
Florida, USA
75 Gallon Reef Tank setup.

8 Weeks old and finshed cycle

48" 4x65W Coralife LUNAR Aqualight Deluxe Series
2x Actinic and 2x 10,000K, 3x 3/4W Blue LEDs -Straight Pin
100 pounds of live rock (adding more)
30 gallon sump
AquaC EV120 Protein Skimmer w/ JG Fitting + Rio 2100 Pump
live rock in sump
Heater
SpectraPure LiterMeter III LM3 Aquarium Dosing System
2 SEIO M820 820/3200 Pumps
Nature’s Ocean® Bio-Activ Live™ Aragonite
CaribSea Mineral Mud Refugium Substrate


Salinity = 1.02
Nitrate = 1.5
Nitrite = 0
PH = 8.3
Temp = 78.1
Alk = High - 12.7
Phosphate = 0
Calicum = 300

Hopefully putting all that together someone can tell me possable causes why new Cleaner Shrimp, Coral Banded Shrimp, 2 Pencil Urchin, & a Feather Duster died this morning. There were put into the tank yesterday afternoon.

I also put 2 Pink Tip Haitian Anemones in the tank and they both have kinda sucked in them selfs. I never had this happen with my old setup. I Acclimation correctly as instructed. I also put 4 turbo snails in to but they seem to be ok.

does anybody know why this would happen? I'm thinking that the Alk might have caused this death so soon.

John
 
Alk is high, but not that high. However it's out of balance with your calcium levels...they should be at least 425ppm with an alk that high.

still, that shouldn't kill inverts in under 24 hours.

Salinity... 1.02...what? 1.020? .021 .022?

Also, anemone's aren't recommended until the tank is at least 6 months old, preferably 9-12 months.

Anyhow, nothing 'jumps out' at me as being the obvious culprit.
can you describe your acclimation method? that's about the only thing I can think of besides a contaminent.
 
Salinity is 1.0275, and Ammonia is 0. The 2 that are out of wack are Calcium & Alk and the Alkalinity is way over. I just wonder if very high Alkalinity can hurt new arrivals. I'm kinda guessing on the number for Alkalinity because my Salifert kits I ran out of and I'm using my backup kits. One of the kits is just color with High, Med, & Low. The other is also color but telling me passed 300ppm.

I know I made a big mistake in adding the anemones; I hit myself in the head for it! But my other additions should have been ok. I also noticed that my plants that were doing good are now dieing too. Acclimation was done by adding the bags and letting them sit in the tank for 30 min. then I put 1/2 cup of my water into the bags. I do this 4 times. Each time i wait 20 to 30 minutes.

So I'm at a loss right now.
 
drip acclimation is better, although snails and shrimp should not be that picky.

Salinity is high. I've never seen a recommendation for over 1.026. 1.025 is what most reefers seem to shoot for.
 
OK, so I need to drop the Salinity, and I'll do the drip next time. but as for my Alk problem, I'm gonna try adding just C-Balance Part A from Two Little Fishies. Hopefully will drop my Alk and increase my Calcium.
 
Replace water with non salt water. Not evap. but water change. I'd do a gal every 8 hrs until your sg is closer to 1.024-1.025
 
Didnt list your Ammonia levels, though your Nitrate should be 0, not 1.5 Your SG should be 1.025 max in general (Course those of us with Hydrometers are never really sure, now are we?) I am doubting your tank is cycled. To be sure, were it me, and it is not..I would consider some Bio-Spira. Can be bought off the internet or from a good LFS. Its not cheap but it has always helped me.

http://www.marineland.com/products/mllabs/ml_biospira.asp

Another great theory would be related to the anemones. *Very* tough little animal to keep and I would suggest with those params probably insta-croak. They are way toxic and if you did not remove them right away they could have easily have polluted the tank causing your other delicated inverts to croak. This I know from experience. Maybe a clown fish or two is in order to get things rolling. Its much cheper than dumping in a bunch of expensive animals.

Best of Luck!
 
I would say it was the acclimation.. Did you test the SG of the LFS water ? You need to test your water SG and the LFS SG and them drip slowly till the water in the bag or bowl matches the tank... I dip for an extra 30 min after it matches. Ph is another issue when acclimating fish.. IMO Shrimp are very sensitive and need a slower acclimation then fish.
 
Thanks for your reply's. I must say that I should have known better putting that many at one time. My first reef I had I waited 4 months before I put anything in. This time I wait only 4 weeks. I'm not very happy with myself at all. And I never thought that my Pink Tips would release toxic's. I just took them out tonight, I wanted to make sure there were indeed dead.

I don't know why everybody seems to think my Salinity is low, this is the readings I’m getting, 1.0275
I did not check for copper, but that kit is on the way.
I just purchased quite a few LaMotte’s & Salifert's kits for a more accurate readings

The Alkalinity is off the charts but right now all I can get is 400+ ppm. I will have to wait till my good kits come in which should be tomorrow or Wed. Right now I'm dosing with C-Balance Part A only from Two Little Fishies. That will at least save my rock. O BTW all I did have in the tank was a Cleaner Shrimp. No corals except that were on the rock when I got it. That too does not look good either but the coralline algae is still very strong and looking good. On the PC lighting, for what I want to keep would be fine, including the pink tips.

Forgot to add that my Ammonia was 0

I'll just keep on getting the tank back in balance and try and find out which did kill my friends.
 
I don't think anyone was implying your salinity was low. At 1.0275 you are a little high. It should read 1.025 as general rule of thumb at the top end and 1.021 at the bottom. I think getting the better kits was a wise move on your part and you'll get a much clearer idea of the condition of your params. As a general rule, good params to shoot for would be something like:

salinity 1.025 SG

Alk 8 - 12 dkh (nsw is ~8 dkh, however most reef keepers keep it elevated. Mine for example runs about 11 dkh and the corals completely dig it!)

PH 8.2

mg 1350ppm (Should be 3 x your ca, however, nsw is about 1350)

ca 400 - 500ppm (most including myself shoot for 450ppm. This is important to corals and inverts who rely on ca for making shells..)

ammonia 0

nitrite 0

nitrate 0 - ? FOWLR, prolly can range on up to 30+ ppm, but through good filtration and water changes, you can keep them much lower. And should ; )

Temp 78 - 82 (Tops!) Anything above 82 starts to make sweaty fish!


There are many other params (Copper is always a no no for inverts!, borate, strontium, etc) but in a FOWLR tank you can start with getting these in line. Once thats the case, you should be ready to add something to cycle with. Again, I *highly* recommend BioSpira. Not just because you can cycle a tank in 24 48 hours, but it doesn't kill fishies. (Or buy a fish you may only wish you had not) If you decide to cycle with something live, then of course you need to wait for ammonia, nitrite to be 0 and nitrates to be 0 or darn close.

Best of Luck!
 
Thanks for the info PC. You know with my old system, I always had a problem with Nitrates. What's the best practace to use to keep them at 0?

John
 
I think your right PC, It ws the Purple Tips that killed the rest. I'll never do that again. But everything seems to be coming back to norman now.

Salinity = 1.025
Nitrate = 0
Nitrite = 0
PH = 8.3
Temp = 78.1
Alk = High - 15.1
Phosphate = 0
calicum = 250 Was 130

I started dosing with ESV Calcium Hydroxide at 2 gallons a day. Then I started to dose with Seachem's Reef complete. Tank is looking better everyday. Still have those cyanobacteria but that will go in time by itself.
 
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