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Old 11-14-2004, 12:10 PM   #1
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Fish opinion

Hey everyone,

I have had a royal gramma since my tank finished cycling, which was back in early July. The clownfish that was originally in there with it died of either disease or some unseen agressions by the gramma. (the only visible marks on the body was a spot behind left gill that looked like scales had been scraped off, about the size of a pencil eraser, and a milky color). I did a few water changes, and watched the gramma closely for about 3 weeks to make sure no changes in behavior or anything like that. I then got a smaller clown, (which was smaller than the gramma). She was fine for about 2 or 3 weeks. The worst i ever saw was the gramma opening it's mouth now and then to scare the clown, but no actual attacks. Then the clown was dead, out of nowhere! No markings on the body that I could see.
Do you guys thing it was acts of agression? Is my gramma just that mean? Should I try to get a clown that matches its size? Or other fish recommendations?

TIA,

matt
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Old 11-14-2004, 12:20 PM   #2
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Doubt if it was the gramma, have never heard of a mean one. Clowns are usually more aggressive than Gramma's.
Are the Clowns tank raised? Did you qt them?
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Old 11-14-2004, 12:21 PM   #3
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I doubt the Gramma actually killed the Clown. Their bark is usually worse than their bite. Was the Clownfish eating and was it acting normally or hiding most of the time. I see you currently have a 12g, how stable has the water parameters been? Could a sudden spike of some sort killed the smaller Clown?
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Old 11-14-2004, 03:51 PM   #4
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Yea, I always take a water sample in with me to the LFS, things have been good. The worst was the nitrates hit 6 after that first clown died. I'm not aware of anything that could have caused some spike in tank parameters, my corals have been fine, and the other inverts have been their happy little selves. It's definitely got me puzzled! The clowns were tank raised, I believe. I hadn't qt the clowns when I added them. The 1st clown was added at the same time as the gramma (the clown lasted almost 5 months), the 2nd clown lasted about 3 weeks or so.
Does that help at all?

-matt
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Old 11-14-2004, 05:12 PM   #5
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Most of the issues with small tanks revolve around temp and salinity which need to be kept stable. No more than 2F swings daily. The odds of getting 2 sick clowns in a row is low unless they were from the same store/tank.
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Old 11-15-2004, 01:22 PM   #6
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Maybe try to get the clown from a different store.
Seems the first one lasted a lot longer than the second. So acclimation wasn't the issue.
Did the 2nd clown have white stringy poopy? stringy poopy is internal parasites.
What were the diets for the clowns?
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Old 11-15-2004, 09:41 PM   #7
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I don't remember consitantly seeing white, stringy waste....but I seem to remember seeing some white waste now and then. (well, i only had it for 3 weeks! )
Maybe I'll try a clown that matches the gramma in size, and keep an extra eye on temperature swings. My heater seems to do a good job keeping the temp constant, I run about 76-77. But maybe I did too big of a water change, I know that the water in my jugs is always cooler than that tank. So it's possible that I did too big of a change for the clown(s) to handle.
Thanks for all the help guys! I'll keep you posted on any developments!

-matt
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Old 11-16-2004, 12:46 PM   #8
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IMO your temp is a little on the cooler side. 80 degree seems to be the average temp.

How many gallons is a big water change? I usually do around 10% a week and slowly poor the room temperature water change in.
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Old 11-16-2004, 10:27 PM   #9
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I agree with klam on the temp. The low on the scale is usually 78. I also keep mine at 80. That alone could have caused this problem.
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