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Old 05-26-2004, 12:31 AM   #1
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How quickly can I assume...???

... that a few white spots on a couple of my fish is ICH or another parasite? Should I begin to medicate immideately or wait and see if it's just lympho or something else that isin't harmful?

I have a medium Emporer with a tiny spot on his tail and a tiny blue tang with a spot or two that almost look like dimples. He is so small I can barely see what is on him.

I am running a UV sterilizer so perhaps that will keep things from getting out of hand to quickly.

On a separate note, I have succesfully used NO-ICH to completely eradicate a breakout in 2 weeks in the past.

All my water tests are great, but the tap water is a bit harsh and full of phosphates here in Chicago.

I don't have money or room for a QT tank, so that suggestion won't be helpful :p

Thanks in advance for any thoughts on the subject.
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Old 05-26-2004, 09:20 PM   #2
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Emporer Angelfish? and...a blue tang? I lost those exact fish with what started out with those symptoms and ended up NOT being ich. Quarryshark really helped me out figuring out what to do and I was able to save the others. If it were me, I would treat them since they are showing signs, but keep a real close eye on them, you never know, it could be something besides ich. Mine got real bad real fast. Without a QT, you are limited on the medications you can use. Are they showing any other symptoms?
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Alex n Mary

150 gallon, 30g fuge/sump, 4.5 watt/gal VHO Lighting, 4" sand bed, 290 lbs LR, CDX-3 Nitrate/Phosphate filter

Female Naso "Isabell" or "Izzy", Emperor Angelfish, Flame Angel, Red Sea Sailfin tang "Bambi", Maroon Clown "Nani", 5 Chromis, 1 Aglae Blenny "Bengi" , Yellow Watchman Goby, pr of Banggai Cardinals, Lyretail Anthia, Six Line Wrasse

1 cleaner shrimp, Coral Banded Shrimp, lettuce nudibranch, 1 sand sifter stars, 1 tiny red brittle star "red", 1 tiny red and white banded serpent star, 2 tiny banded serpent stars, small orange Linkia starfish, assorted hermits and snails. Corals: star polyps, A ton of different types of mushrooms, yellow zooanthids, brown-orangish and light blue paly's, orange ricordia.

90g RR, W/D, 120 lb's LR SF eel, pygmy angel, pr sebae clownfish, 4 chromis. Star Polyps & Mushrooms
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Old 05-27-2004, 01:17 AM   #3
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QT, I'm sorry to say is the answer if they have ich. If its in your main, it will not go away without a lack of fish hosts for at least a 4-6 week period. This allows the parasite to go through its life cycle and die off with no fish to host it. Treating the main is a bad idea. If the medicine is strong enough to work, it will kill off thing that you don't want to kill like your inverts, nitrifying bacteria, etc. Other med they claim are "reef or invert safe" simply do not work. This is documented over and over. Ich may appear to go away, only to come back twofold.
Now since you did not qt the fish, there is a strong possibity that is is a parasite. I would watch them closely for any signs. These would be salt grain looking spots, rapid gilling, refusal to eat, cloudy eyes, hanging in one spot, etc.
The advisors wrote an excellent article on parasites at the top of this catagory, you may want to check it out.
Good luck!!
clowninround, how are your guys doing?
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Old 05-27-2004, 11:19 AM   #4
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They are doing really good...though they both seem to be tired of the 20 gallon . The 150 is set up and it is bueatiful...my husband however is VERY impatient to put fish in...I am getting that way myself . But if this has taught me anything, QT is the most important part of adding fish into a tank!!! Did you get the pic I sent of the 150?
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Alex n Mary

150 gallon, 30g fuge/sump, 4.5 watt/gal VHO Lighting, 4" sand bed, 290 lbs LR, CDX-3 Nitrate/Phosphate filter

Female Naso "Isabell" or "Izzy", Emperor Angelfish, Flame Angel, Red Sea Sailfin tang "Bambi", Maroon Clown "Nani", 5 Chromis, 1 Aglae Blenny "Bengi" , Yellow Watchman Goby, pr of Banggai Cardinals, Lyretail Anthia, Six Line Wrasse

1 cleaner shrimp, Coral Banded Shrimp, lettuce nudibranch, 1 sand sifter stars, 1 tiny red brittle star "red", 1 tiny red and white banded serpent star, 2 tiny banded serpent stars, small orange Linkia starfish, assorted hermits and snails. Corals: star polyps, A ton of different types of mushrooms, yellow zooanthids, brown-orangish and light blue paly's, orange ricordia.

90g RR, W/D, 120 lb's LR SF eel, pygmy angel, pr sebae clownfish, 4 chromis. Star Polyps & Mushrooms
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Old 05-27-2004, 11:38 AM   #5
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That was from you? Wasn't sure. It looks great!! You should have a blast with that. Gives you so many more options, congrats!!
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Old 05-27-2004, 12:06 PM   #6
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update...

The fish show no signs of being sick. They continue to have about 1-2 small white spots each. The rest of the tank is symptom free. Since they are small and appear to be perfectly round I don't think it's lympho. The fish are acting and eating normally and appear to be thriving. Guess I will take a wait and see stance.

Separately, I see that you don't believe NO-ICH can work. I am not sure what to say about your skepticism except that it worked perfectly for me the one time I used it. It did kill my starfish, but it didnt hurt any of my crabs or shrimp. I dont have a reef so I dont know about "real" inverts like corals and the like.

Just my 2 cents on NO-ICH.
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Old 05-27-2004, 01:59 PM   #7
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How long ago did you treat for ich last time?
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Alex n Mary

150 gallon, 30g fuge/sump, 4.5 watt/gal VHO Lighting, 4" sand bed, 290 lbs LR, CDX-3 Nitrate/Phosphate filter

Female Naso "Isabell" or "Izzy", Emperor Angelfish, Flame Angel, Red Sea Sailfin tang "Bambi", Maroon Clown "Nani", 5 Chromis, 1 Aglae Blenny "Bengi" , Yellow Watchman Goby, pr of Banggai Cardinals, Lyretail Anthia, Six Line Wrasse

1 cleaner shrimp, Coral Banded Shrimp, lettuce nudibranch, 1 sand sifter stars, 1 tiny red brittle star "red", 1 tiny red and white banded serpent star, 2 tiny banded serpent stars, small orange Linkia starfish, assorted hermits and snails. Corals: star polyps, A ton of different types of mushrooms, yellow zooanthids, brown-orangish and light blue paly's, orange ricordia.

90g RR, W/D, 120 lb's LR SF eel, pygmy angel, pr sebae clownfish, 4 chromis. Star Polyps & Mushrooms
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Old 05-28-2004, 02:43 AM   #8
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2 weeks

The treatment was a 2 week treatment and then i let the tank sit for another 2 weeks.
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Old 05-28-2004, 10:35 AM   #9
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Yes, but I was wondering how long ago it had been since you treated the tank. The reason I ask is that like Quarryshark said, the parasite may have never left the tank. The symptoms on the fish may have dissappeared, but the parasite may have still been in the tank to reappear at a later time. However, if the treatment was done a long time ago, maybe that is not the case. How are the fish doing now?
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Alex n Mary

150 gallon, 30g fuge/sump, 4.5 watt/gal VHO Lighting, 4" sand bed, 290 lbs LR, CDX-3 Nitrate/Phosphate filter

Female Naso "Isabell" or "Izzy", Emperor Angelfish, Flame Angel, Red Sea Sailfin tang "Bambi", Maroon Clown "Nani", 5 Chromis, 1 Aglae Blenny "Bengi" , Yellow Watchman Goby, pr of Banggai Cardinals, Lyretail Anthia, Six Line Wrasse

1 cleaner shrimp, Coral Banded Shrimp, lettuce nudibranch, 1 sand sifter stars, 1 tiny red brittle star "red", 1 tiny red and white banded serpent star, 2 tiny banded serpent stars, small orange Linkia starfish, assorted hermits and snails. Corals: star polyps, A ton of different types of mushrooms, yellow zooanthids, brown-orangish and light blue paly's, orange ricordia.

90g RR, W/D, 120 lb's LR SF eel, pygmy angel, pr sebae clownfish, 4 chromis. Star Polyps & Mushrooms
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Old 05-28-2004, 11:27 AM   #10
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Today the fish look great. The Emporer now only has 1 spot and the blue tang is looking symptom free as well.

I had let the tank sit for about 5 weeks total since the parasites appeared to be gone.
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