My Fish Wish List (Reef)

[Phyl]

As my cycle winds down I'm in the process of making a wish list for my 120g tank. I plan (oh ... some day in the future when I get good at this) to have a reef tank but for a while it will be FOWLER (plus inverts).

My wish list looks like this:
Fish (Adult Size in Inches)
Coral Beauty (4.5)
Yellow Longnose Butterfly (6)
Scooter Blenny (3)
Royal Gramma (3.5)
Percula Clown (3)
Blue Chromis Damsel x 3 (3)
Spotted (Pajama) Cardinal x2 (3)
Tassled Filefish (12)
Zebra/Dwarf Lionfish (7)
Filimented Wrasse x3 (4)
Golden Wrasse x2 (5)
Sixline Wrasse x3 (3)

How many of these can I actually keep in my 120? Are there some that you'd steer clear of more so than others?

I don't plan on doing anything fast (my tank isn't even done cycling but I want to get my filter media in my wet/dry so that it can start to colonize for my QT tank -- which begs the question of how long it has to sit in there to get a good colony going), but I do want a good plan for what we'll want in the tank so that we know who to add first, who to add together, etc!

Thanks!
Phyllis

 

[captivereefs]

Thatr dwarf on will eat anything half his size so be careful. Skip the butterfly, tilefish and the scooter blenny, they will starve out. Everything else seems OK just drop the total number of wrasses to 1 each and you should be okay. Just make sure you have good liverock for the pygmy angel and a good skimmer for the biooad.

 

[Phyl]

The butterfly was chosen for his coloring. I love that bright Yellow. Would a yellow tang be ok to add to the list if I took out the Butterfly, filefish and the blenny (why would these starve)? I was thinking (and didn't put it in writing) that I would go with one set of wrasses, these are just the three types that I liked for their coloring, behavior, etc. An interesting idea to use one of each. Would they be happy like that?

So sad to have to bail on the dwarf. I've always loved the look of those little buggers!

Phyllis

 

[fishfreek]

yes you will need to bail on the lion if you want to keep half of whats on your list. I was looking at your list and my first impression was thats way to many fish but then I saw it was just a list of possible inhabitants.

For more info on individual species compatiblity please look at our compatiblity matrix http://www.aquariumadvice.com/SWCompatibility.php If that link does not work its on our home page on the left.

 

[RocketSeason]

The Butterfly is not a good choice because it is difficult to keep alive.

The Dwarf Lionfish will eat the Perc Clown the wrasses The Coral Beauty angel, THe Cardnials, and the Damsels. so, obviously that won't work out well.

I would Say that It would be Ok to add the tang, but the Cardinals will get a bit freaked. THey are rather timid creatures.

I would also have two Perc Clowns. Clowns do MUCH better when Kept in pairs.

You do not want to overpopulate your tank because it will cause serious problems. You can only really keep 24 inches of fish in a 120 gallon tank. (vastly different than Fresh water)

IF you want an alternitive to a tank or a butterfly and have a fish with a nice yellow coloration, look into a yellow watchman Goby. It is a nice bottom dwelling fish. (I like bottom dwellers best of all.)

Give us a revised list!

 

[steve r]

you could go with a lemon peel angel for yellow color, but you may have to scrap the coral beauty. i dont know if the two angels would get along. your tank may be big enough for both though.

steve r

 

[Phyl]

The ick factor of the Tang makes me want to steer clear of them (as well as wanting the yellow early on) but the Lemon Peel sounds like it gets aggressive as well as being a little difficult to keep. We were looking for peaceful, easy to keep, reef safe fish when we made up the list to narrow down from. Not that it matters as I'm out of water anyway!

I've revised my list to:
Coral Beauty/Flame Angel (4.5)
Royal Gramma (3.5)
Percula Clown x2 (3)
Blue Chromis Damsel (3)
Spotted (Pajama) Cardinal x2 (3)

That gets me to 23" (whew narrowing this list is HARD). What factor does my wet dry w/sump and 145# of lace/gulf/keys rock play in the equation? Do these equal each other out or can I have less fish because of the rock? More fish because of the sump? What if I added a refugium (not that I know how I'd work that into the plumbing, but I'm looking for options ) I think I'm going to have to start planning my 300 gallon tank because I want one of everything! Limiting to 24" is really hard.

Phyllis

 

[Clown Monarch]

I highly recommend the sixline wrasse - it's probably my favorite fish. He's completely non-aggressive, always stays close to the rocks, and loves swimming through all the little nooks and crannies you've created for him. Rather than eat like a pig (like the rest of the fish), he'll usually select one shrimp, grab it, and carry it to some private spot behind the rocks. I've been told he eats harmful worms in the tank also.

Even though they aren't large, they really do have a lot of personality.

 

[fishfreek]

Dont let ich scare you away from a tang. A problem with ich reoccuring on a tang in a tank is an early indicator that there is something wrong with the tank vs just a fish that is ich prone.

I have had a powder blue tang, a very suceptable ich fish, and its only gotten ich once in 4 years. And that was when it was first introduced into a new tank that had a problem with its sump pump and was putting microbubbles into the water. I have had a yellow for going on two years now with no sign of ich aswell.

I like your newly revised list. You might want more chromis though as they are a schooling fish. I would say its save to put three chromis in the tank with the existing fish list you have.

What factor does my wet dry w/sump and 145# of lace/gulf/keys rock play in the equation? Do these equal each other out or can I have less fish because of the rock? More fish because of the sump? What if I added a refugium (not that I know how I'd work that into the plumbing, but I'm looking for options Very Happy) I think I'm going to have to start planning my 300 gallon tank because I want one of everything! Limiting to 24" is really hard.

The wet/dry will give you additional filtration as well as the live rock but filtration is not the only factor with the number of fish one can sucessfuly keep in a SW tank. Other factors include overall tank space, oxygen levels, ability for fish to establish terrories. A 120gal tank is a nice size tank and will aford your fish a fair amount of swimming room. Expecially since we are talking about all small fish. Each will be able to establish their own areas so territoral disputes will be minimal. Your overall selection is fairly peaceful albeit almost all SW fish are more agressive than the average FW counterpart.

While a wet/dry will increase the operating oxygen levels allowing one to sustain more fish should the power go out the wet/dry would be out of operation and therefor its oxygenation benfits would be lost. If this happens on an overstocked tank your fish will quickly sufficate due to lack of oxygen in the water. So this is yet another reason to play it safe and 'understock' a tank vs overstock it.

 

[Phyl]

I proudly showed my husband the fish list that we came up with and he *freaked*! There are no BIG fish, there aren't ENOUGH fish. Then he proceeded to find 1001 resources on the net that say that you can have 1/2" of fish per gl of saltwater or 2" of small fish in 4 gl and 4" of large fish in 10gl, etc. Basically he's saying that we can have 40-60" of fish in our 120. I don't think I'm going to win this battle (until some fish have paid the price)! There are too many places on the net that advocate what is considered here to be "overstocking"! Including the book "SW for Dummies" (like anyone should consider THAT a resource?!), www.liveaquaria.com, etc. Any thoughts?

I'm forcing the slow and patient hand (we just put the filter media from the QT tank-to-be into the sump -- how long does this need to be in there?) so it will be a WHILE before we have much in the way of fish in there but that will only last so long!

We plan to put our system on a UPS to keep it up and running in the event of a power failure (and have a generator if need be). I can probably up the LR content another 30# and we can probably figure out how to get a refugium in there to add to the water table. Basically he's looking at this HUGE and EMPTY tank and is just dismayed at the thought of having very few, very tiny fish in it!

 

[quarryshark]

Basically he's saying that we can have 40-60" of fish in our 120. I don't think I'm going to win this battle

Sorry to say, everyone would loose in that situation ...and in a hurry too. Some very experienced people just advised you on a wise stocking plan. I would show him this post and have him browse the sick fish forum for a while. He may change his mind.

 

[austinsdad]

If you're gonna go reef in the future, you might consider not doing angels at all. Some have luck, but most seem to think the question is not "if" the angels will nip at corals, but "when".

I'd also suggest you keep the wrasse. The six-line may work well for you. On a yellow fish - maybe the yellow tang? Last in the tank though. They get kinda territorial. There's also the foxface rabbbit. Ugly when sleeping or stressed though. I got a midas blenny recently. Great fish with an abundance of personality. "bout 4 inches at most maybe. Kinda yellow/gold in color with interesting motion to his swim. The canary blenny is really yellow, but you can't handle him with bare hands. Won't attack you or other fish, but has got a venomous bite.

I'd also second the 3 blue/green chromis choice.

 

[fishfreek]

Well I can speak from experence I know someone who had a 90 gal tank with what must have been 5 tangs, foxface, perc clowns, and some other assorted fish. If his sump pump stopped for a period longer than just a few hours nearly all of his fish would be dead from suffication.

An example is he went to bed with a working pump. Woke up next morning to a quite tank. Found the pump tripped the breaker over night and nearly all his fish where dead. The cause... Lack of oxygen. Had the tank been 'properly' stocked the fish could have survived the power outage.

I have an 80 gal tank with the following fish load:

Powder blue tang
Coral beauty
Yellow goby X 2
blue damsel

In my 75 gal tank I have:

Yellow tang
Flame angel
damsel (was a three stripe yellow/blue damsel as a juvie)
(will add a pair of clowns in the future)

The rought and dirty rule of thumb I see most often is 1" of fish per 5gal of water. This rule of thumb was developed based on the oxygen level that saltwater can hold as well as the fact that many SW fish need more swimming room than the FW fish. This simple rule of thumb does not factor in other things like temperment, enviormental conditions like overall swimming room as compared to your aquascaping.

In the end there are people who have tanks that I would classify as overstocked that are suscessuful but the reality is that the final result is not overly natural. Overstocked tanks will be more disease prone as well as require more agressive skimming, filtration and water changing.

 

[austinsdad]

austinsdad wrote:
Won't attack you or other fish, but has got a venomous bite.

Actually it's the spines on their fins that are venemous, not the bite.

Cheers
Steve

I think that's the foxface rabbitfish with the spines. The blenny has the bite.

 

[RocketSeason]

your revised list shows only one chromis. I think that having 3 would be nice. they would school and would look very pretty together.

( I think you could get away with 2 more if your filtration was high.)

as far as overstocking goes. Yes, it is a big deal to overstock your tank. Fish will die, diseases will run rampant, water will not stay in proper parameters. In Salt Water, Its a VERY big deal.

 

[Phyl]

Rocket, I meant to show 4 damsels total there (adding the 3 more that FF recommended). I think one big thing might make him happy enough .

My last list had me at 32" when you considered the 4 damsels. How's this? I'm at 32.5 now.

Yellow Tang (8)
Royal Gramma (3.5)
Percula Clown x2 (3)
Blue Chromis Damsel x3 (3)
Spotted (Pajama) Cardinal x2 (3)

I think as he sees the tank come to life he'll be a little less anxious to have a million fish in it. *crosses fingers*

Is there something with a lot of personality that you'd swap for gramma or does it have enough personality to add?

I appreciate all your help here (and so will my fish)!

 

[RocketSeason]

I like it. still, check out the Watchman Goby. or another bottom dwelling goby. they are very colorful and will add alot of intrest to the bottom of your tank. (you could probibly squeeze him in.)

now post your hardware list and let us pick that apart! LOL!

 

[Phyl]

Hardware is:

* Oceanic RR 120G with 2 overflows falling like mad into
* Proclear 200 wet/dry with built in skimmer and sump (I haven't removed the bio
balls yet though it is on my list of things to do; a little at a time).
* mag 1200 pump (pumping 1200g an hour though I'm not sure how much I loose
getting to the top of the tank) returning to opposing returns at the ends
of the tank
* a UV light (that I've yet to plug in-- don't want to kill off the good stuff while it is
trying to establish)
* Current Dual Sattelite with 2 10000K and 2 actinics (65w per)
* 85# of base rock
* 30# of gulf rock
* 30# of keys rock
(going to add 30# rock from LR.com--does anyone have experience with the coral rock that they sell?)

I don't have any power heads in the tank other than the 2 returns. How do I know if I have enough flow?

 

[Phyl]

If you were going to squeeze one more in would it be a wrasse or a goby? The yellow watchman is cute. What do you think of the Green Mandarinfish (goby) http://www.windowtothesea.com/display.php?cat=1&subcat=17&item=171 ?

The alternate would be the 6line wrasse.

 

[RocketSeason]

I don't like recommending Mandarins. They are not good for the home aquarium. Although you do have enough rock there to support a mandrin in about a year or so, note that they only eat copopods and will starve if a large enough copopod population doesn't exist.