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Old 01-22-2013, 07:35 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_X View Post
Take your pic. Either can cause the decline, as well as a super cold environment for a couple hours.
Ah yes, I had forgot about it being in the cold to top it all off.

I suspect it would have at least handled the cold and even poorer water quality if it would have been fed well.

As of now my only test kits are for ammonia, nitrite, nitrates, and pH.

Oh and I forgot to mention the salinity earlier, but its 1.025.

Anyway, I knew I needed more test kits knowing I was going to keep corals as well. I wasn't too worried about them just yet since the sun is my only hard coral as of yet so I wasn't exactly worried about the calcium and such being used up with my water change schedule. Test kits for alk, mag, and cal were next on my items to buy. Now with the sun in the shape it is in is there any of those kits (or even others) that would be worth getting now just to see if anything else could be affecting its health? I will definitely get them all I was just waiting until my next payday and order them all at once along with other items I need at that time. I can certainly pick up one or a couple or something if any wouldn't give any indication towards the sun's health.

Shew, I hope that made sense.
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:13 PM   #32
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Actually, no. I think not being fed and poor water quality take a back seat to massive temp swings in my opinion.
I would test for calcium, alkalinity, and mag, but the only one I would be worried about is alkalinity. i've never seen low calcium levels do anything but slow the growth of stony corals. Alk swings on the other hand I have seen cause rapid tissue loss.

Down the road I expect you'll get an idea on how often you have to change your water to export nutrients and replace lost elements. I recommend a weekly schedule. whether the tank needs it, or not
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Old 01-22-2013, 08:42 PM   #33
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Actually, no. I think not being fed and poor water quality take a back seat to massive temp swings in my opinion.
I would test for calcium, alkalinity, and mag, but the only one I would be worried about is alkalinity. i've never seen low calcium levels do anything but slow the growth of stony corals. Alk swings on the other hand I have seen cause rapid tissue loss.

Down the road I expect you'll get an idea on how often you have to change your water to export nutrients and replace lost elements. I recommend a weekly schedule. whether the tank needs it, or not
Ah, I see. I have to say that even though I was obviously not happy the package containing the sun coral was left on the truck to get cold, I didn't expect that to pose more of a problem over the starvation and water quality even.

It shouldn't have been a sudden change in temperature, either direction, but it was a pretty good range in both directions. I didn't exactly check the temperature of the water the sun arrived in but even through the bag it felt pretty cold to me, so it had to be quite low.

I'll see what I can find tomorrow in terms of an Alk test locally. Unfortunately I only have two options in terms of LFSs. I'm thinking at least one of those two should definitely carry an alk test kit as they actually keep saltwater tanks, the other store does not. I'm going to have to read more about alk, I know it needs tested but have to say I haven't tried to learn more than that yet.

Any brand of test kits I should look for or avoid over others? I doubt I have much of a selection but just in case.

I wouldn't imagine the mag or calcium levels to be low because I don't really have any corals that could have been using the up, it also makes sense that it would play a part in delaying growth more than anything. I've also been seeing coraline growth (slowly) and recently identified some live rock hitchhikers (by searching online-pretty confident in my id) as neomeris annulata. Seeing as it needs calcium to grow I doubt my calcium levels have been low. I only have a few that have sprouted up but they have grown in height. I've debated on whether to leave or pluck, may make a thread about them.

In any case, I perform at least weekly changes of at least 10 gallons, and lately more now that I have the storage for 15-20 gallons. I'll keep up on the changes and monitor my nitrate levels as well. Still don't understand how they got to the level they're at. I want them back down and don't want to raise them even further with attempting to feed the sun.
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Old 01-22-2013, 11:45 PM   #34
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I've still been researching regarding a starving sun coral, as I'd say thats the case with mine, and came across something that may be of some help. Thought I'd post here and maybe get some opinions

Here is the thread I came across of someone who has a sun coral that looks to be in the same shape mine is in.

sun coral has not opened - Marine Aquariums South Africa

This is a bit of advice this person received, copied and pasted from that link.

"What to feed? A suncoral in this state is not able to capture food with it's tentacles - it is far too weak. It will not even open up it's tentacles, as it is too weak. This feeding with fitler feeding food is crucial now. It cannot capture brine or mysis, so dont even waste your time with it, unless you much it into a soup. Rather get some Brigtwells Amin-Omega, reef snow, phyto plankton and zoo plankton and mix it all up into a milk. Dont be shy.

You will see the mouths swelling up nicely once the food is in the container. What the coral is doing then is basically "breathing" in the food. This will SLOWLY help it gain energy, and then after a few weeks you will notice some yellow dots as they tentacles start coming out. Then a few weeks later it will show some tentacles. Then you can start feeding live brine shrimp nauplii and cyclop-eeze. "

I've came across several other posts about how the coral is starving and does not have the energy to actually feed as normal. This is the first one that explained more in detail and also made more of a suggestion in terms of reviving the coral. I know nothing about the individual who made that post but it seems the OP of that thread followed their advice and had great results (as seen when reading through thread and with the follow up picture posted).

I believe I'd like to give this a try, but again, thought I'd get another opinion.

I'm also not sure what I can get locally but will be calling first thing in the morning. If I can not get what I need locally then I'll have to order online. I just home the wait time with shipping does not cause any more issues.
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Old 01-23-2013, 11:48 AM   #35
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I find that amazing, since they are a large polyp coral. I don't see how it's going to "breath in" anything without a breathing apparatus. The way they feed is with their polyps. As far as I know, these aren't like frogs that can absorb food through their skin.
I'm curious to hear how it turns out for you.


*edit*
As a matter of fact i did just read an article that said corals can absorb nutrients through their flesh-
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2005/12/aafeature2
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Old 01-23-2013, 04:18 PM   #36
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Well that gives a little bit of hope for the coral, then!! Good luck with it and let us know how it works. Can't hurt to try.
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Old 01-23-2013, 05:36 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_X View Post
I find that amazing, since they are a large polyp coral. I don't see how it's going to "breath in" anything without a breathing apparatus. The way they feed is with their polyps. As far as I know, these aren't like frogs that can absorb food through their skin.
I'm curious to hear how it turns out for you.


*edit*
As a matter of fact i did just read an article that said corals can absorb nutrients through their flesh-
Feature Article: Colors by the Thousands - Light, Colors and Corals, Part I — Advanced Aquarist | Aquarist Magazine and Blog
That was an interesting article. All the talk of light/spectrums/etc put me back in my chemistry class lol. It also makes me more hopeful in terms of the feeding regimen suggested in the thread I had found.

I wasn't thinking that the sun coral would necessarily breathe it in so much in that sense. If it is indeed too weak to extend and pull in food I thought that the polyps might be capable of sucking in (breathing) in smaller particles of food in that way rather than absorbing. I assume its not an ideal diet for the coral but should provide enough nourishment so that it will have enough strength in some time to feed as normal. It seems it worked in one cause. I also found mention of amino acids, and similar, being important for the coral to take in when it is in this state. It just wasn't as detailed in the process of reviving from that standpoint.
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Old 01-23-2013, 05:39 PM   #38
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Well that gives a little bit of hope for the coral, then!! Good luck with it and let us know how it works. Can't hurt to try.
Thats how I felt when I read the article and certainly don't see how it could hurt to give it a try. Thanks, I definitely will.

I'm going to call my LFSs now to see what they have in stock, hopefully at least one of the items suggested. I hate to have to order online and prolong this feeding process even more, especially if it is what it is needing.


Edit: I just got off the phone with both the LFSs and neither has any sort of zooplankton that I wanted but one of the stores will order me some and it will be here on Wednesday. One of my LFSs does have some Kent Coral Accel (in place of the Restor I was going to get). They also have some phytoplankton and reef snow in stock but I wasn't going to bother with either. I wasn't sure if it would exactly be beneficial but if it would be I could pick something like that up. Especially since the zooplankton will be delayed. This same LFS now has frozen cyclops and rotifers in stock. Think either of these would be worth getting yet?

Right now I'm going by what little I've read about coral foods since looking into how to save the sun. I'm still trying to learn but feel pretty clueless still so opinions would be great.
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Old 01-24-2013, 05:57 AM   #39
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I use reef snow for my filter feeders. Waiting almost another week for food wouldn't be ideal IMO. I would start with the reef snow. JMO.
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Old 01-24-2013, 05:46 PM   #40
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I use reef snow for my filter feeders. Waiting almost another week for food wouldn't be ideal IMO. I would start with the reef snow. JMO.
Thanks, I was concerned as well with the wait on the other food. I picked up some Coral Accel today and can go back tomorrow and pick up some reef snow, I'm pretty positive they do have that in stock.

I tried feeding the sun coral out of the tank last night so I could target feed more accurately, not have worry about keeping inverts away, and keep most of the food out of the display tank. The coral is attached to a rock so I did not handle the coral in any way and it did not leave the water at any point.

I soaked the brine and mysis as before and attempted to entice the sun into opening as before. I also targeted each polyp in hope I would get a response and they would eat. Unfortunately I still did not get a response. I will try again tomorrow with the coral accel as well, then reef snow after I am able to pick that up.

While I still haven't gotten a response it doesn't appear that the white has spread which leaves me a little more hopeful.
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