Tang w/Ich, QT w/LR

[luckycat]

OK so yes I know better!! I'm sure many threads start like this...I actually HAVE a QT tank but did not use it one time - last time I don't use it - when introducing a new Yellow Tang.

The Tang has two white dots on one pectoral fin. They are very pronounced when my blue T5s are on, look sort of like debris (with whitish color) when my sun T5 lamps are on. So I'm thinking don't take a chance get the fish out it may be ich (I have never seen ich before). So first does that sound like ich? Does ich grow on fin tips only? If so I'll search for recommended medication.

So I setup my quarantine tank again, using water from my tank to fill it up initially. I have never done this b4 but can I put lr from my fuge in my qt to help boost beneficial bacteria for the QT, even if I'm going to medicate the tank? I would rinse the lr out well before putting back in the fuge.

Good idea or bad?

Also the tang has been in the display tank with my 5 other fish for 3 days... do I need to qt all other fish?

Thanks[/b]

 

[steve-s]

If you choose hyposalinity as a treatment, the rock can eventually be re used but I would allow it to air dry a few weeks just to be safe. If any meds are used at all, it's junk after that. Keep in mind that anything in/on the rock is toast no matter what treatment is chosen. More commonly the only thing to survive would be the bacteria. If the rock is heavily infused with life, you can also experience harder to control water quality from the die off, in the long run, not the best of options.

As to the problem with the fish, how long have the spots been visible and how long have you had the fish? C. irritans will affect just about every nook and cranny of the fishs' outer surface. Few parasites stick mainly to the finnage.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

If you choose hyposalinity as a treatment, the rock can eventually be re used but I would allow it to air dry a few weeks just to be safe. If any meds are used at all, it's junk after that. Keep in mind that anything in/on the rock is toast no matter what treatment is chosen. More commonly the only thing to survive would be the bacteria. If the rock is heavily infused with life, you can also experience harder to control water quality from the die off, in the long run, not the best of options.

As to the problem with the fish, how long have the spots been visible and how long have you had the fish? C. irritans will affect just about every nook and cranny of the fishs' outer surface. Few parasites stick mainly to the finnage.

Cheers
Steve

Makes sense, thanks for the quick reply.

The spots have been visible since I got the fish a few days ago. However they seem only very visible when the blue light is on. No spots on the skin anywhere. Like I said under the non-blue lights it sort of just looks like debris on the tip of the fin, but it is still a bit whitish (blue just brings it out).

Maybe it is not ich? I have been unable to locate pictures of ich on yellow tangs fins, but will continue searching.

 

[steve-s]

Could easily be C. irritans. It can often be easier to see first thing in the AM and late at night, lighting definately being a factor. With tangs, you also need to be wary of the possibility of velvet. If the spots are a larger (sugar) size that will not be the case. Velvet is rarely visible unless the light hits it just right. Looks like a sheen of gold with black specs, especially hard to see on a yellow tang.

How's the breathing, color, appetite and so on?

Here is a pic of what C. irritans would look like.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

Interesting..the dots are actually much larger than that. I'll try to get a picture. The tang doesn't scratch itself on anything, seems to be breathing just fine, and eating just fine - eating flake food and pellets, and continuously munching on algae from the rock. The dots are just on the tip of the fin, and they are I guess 1/2 the size of a rice grain? Maybe that is a good way of putting it.

I tried to catch it to put it in a qt that I setup but I had a very difficult time of it, and gave up. It will be a non-trivial task to catch this fish without taking out most if not all of my rock which is going to be a major pain. I was nervous about really causing stress in the fish.

 

[steve-s]

Try to get the pic if you can, could be either a lympho problem or bacterial. C. irritans will not usually be that large unless secondary infections are being caused at the contact point giving the appearance it's larger than it is.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

OK I managed to get some pictures, not perfect but I hope they help.

There are no visible white spots on her body, except for the normal distinctive mark near the base of the tail on both sides. Only thing I'm seeing is these small (maybe 1/4 size of a rice grain?) on the tip of the fin.

Side view:

Side below view:

Side pectoral fin view (see "clumps" on tip of fin).

 

[luckycat]

UPDATE: Now my blue powder tang has two white spots on its fins - one on the dorsal and one on the pelvic. They are larger than a grain of sand - about the size of 1/2 of a rice grain. But tehy are very flat, whereas the spots on the tang look like they are larger (not flat).

I have put both of these fish in a 10g qt. I have 3 chromis and a clown still in the display, not sure if I should put them in the qt as well. I am not sure if this is ich I'm dealing with.

 

[steve-s]

Please post all water quality numbers. Definately Lympho or bacterial (right pectoral), I leaning towards the former.

I am assuming the dots on the tangs forefront are from the glass, not the fish itself? If it is on the tang, I would suspect a copepod or worm.

I am also wondering how long you've had this tang? I see the nori in the pic but I am kinda dismayed by the sunken belly. Have you ever noticed pale/white or stringy feces? The tang is seriously under weight.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

Yes the dots are on the glass, not the tang. I just got the tang about a 4 days ago. Again I can kick myselt for not qt'ing esp. since I already have a 10g at all times for qt...

I also see the sunken belly of the tang and thought it was skinny - it eats still like the dickens, but it doesn't fill up. Compared to our blue tang which is very plump!

Water params S: 1.022, Nitrates/Nitrites/Ammonia: 0, pH: 8.2.

I spoke to the lfs that sold me the tang today, he thought it sounded like a fungal issue, and said to just qt the fish and it should clear up by itself in 2-4 weeks (keeping daily water changes and healthy feeding).

I will do some searches for lympho, bacterial infections... if bacterial what medications should I put in the qt? And do I need to worry about thsi spreading to my 3 chromis and 1 clownfish? Both tangs are not in qt.

Thanks

 

[steve-s]

Fungal issues in marine aquaria are highly unlikely. What looks like a fugal problem is almost always bacterial. It can be treated with the use of a gram negative antibiotic like Maracyn II but if lympho (which I suspect), it will have no affect. As far as your other fish contracting it, not that likely either unless water quality/living conditions are sub standard.

I would do a few water changes on the main just to be sure and bolster feedings with a good [acronym="Highly Unsaturated Fatty Acid"]HUFA[/acronym] vitamin.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/showquestion.php?faq=2&fldAuto=45

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/showquestion.php?faq=2&fldAuto=43

Make sure that yellow tang gets lots of veggies and foods soaked in selcon for the next while. Frozen tangs preparations are a great addition to the diet. I highly recommend Ocean Nutrition. Also feed garlic at every feeding for the first while. Pay special attention to the feces (grosse I know) for stringyness or faded/white color. It should be relatively the same coming out as it is going in. Need to rule out the possibility of an internal worm or parasite.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

Thanks for the feedback steve-s. I'll write back to provide progress and actions taken based on this feedback.

 

[luckycat]

UPDATE: Yellow tang in the qt is getting darker in color - seems like from the inside it is dark. It is not swimming around as much as it was. My blue tang seems fine, also in the qt. I hope the blue doesn't catch what the yellow has.

 

[luckycat]

The skin on the yellow tang is now turning brown! I'm going to do another qt water change today. My blue tang is in the qt w/ the other tang and I'm concerned now about whatever the yellow has spreading. They are both seemingly eating in the qt, I put some nori in the tank for them to munch on..however I can tell they are both stressed, they are hiding in a big PVC tube that I put in the qt.

What does brown skin on a tang imply? I am not sure what meds I should use at this point, if any.

 

[steve-s]

Two things to check here. The dark color can be an indication of three possible probelms. Low pH if streaky, an internal worm if small dark patches or Vibrio if large blotches.

Please test the pH/alk of the water and post back with anything remarkable that fits the vague descriptions I provided. Given the overall appearance of the yellow tang I would not be surpised if both worm and Vibrio.

Can you describe the feces at all? I would also post an updated pic if possible.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

pH is 8.2...I don't have a way at the time to test alk, unfortunately, and I don't have my camera now... As far as feces, I haven't been able to specifically identify that in the qt.

I'm going to try to get my camera to post an updated pic.

Good news is I guess that the tang is still alive, and eating.

 

[steve-s]

As far as feces, I haven't been able to specifically identify that in the qt.

I meant as it was "exiting" the tang.

What you are trying to identify is the color and consistancey. Stringy, long pieces, liquid, white/pale or dark in color.

Cheers
Steve

 

[luckycat]

Just wanted to post a quick update on the Tang (yellow) - he seems 100% fine. I did treat with Marcyn II for the 5 day treatment, and the fish has been in qt since 11/20. He is eating well, has his coloration all back, and seems to be swimming just fine.

So I don't know if this will benefit anyone else on the forum, but in my case it could be that no treatment, and no qt, and just time may have resolved the issue, as Steve-s suggests maybe a lympho or bacterial.

I'm just glad the yellow tang made it through..oh btw the white spot on the blue tang disappeared soon after putting him in the qt, and she is also fine.