and another one bites the dust...

[JasonC]

Woke up this morning to a dead dwarf gourami. This was rather suprising as he has been fine recently.. eating well, good coloration, etc. When I found him, here is how he looked:
- nose down, curved body, clamped fins.
- hard as a rock as if muscles had siezed at time of death.
- pale, edges of body/fins turned a light brown, nose and mouth area were black.

Water params:
- pH = 7.4
- ammonia = 0
- nitrite = 0
- nitrate = 10-20ppm
- phosphates (had the kit, may as well use it) = 0

Any ideas on what may have caused this? Like I said, as of about 10:30pm last night, he was fine.

I am getting extraordinarily frustrated...

 

[neilanh]

What test kit are you using?
Tank Temperature?
When was your last PWC?

 

[JasonC]

Test Kits are all API, tank temp is 75.6 (I try to keep it around 76), and the last pwc was exactly a week ago today. I topped off yesterday am.. and I use prime as my water conditioner. I try to do 25% PWC once a week, and never let it go more than 2 before I PWC. I was due for one this AM.

Thanks for helping me look into this...

 

[mitcore]

the ph is too high for the gourami, it needs to be 7.0
i have gourami die on me and when i check ph it is up as soon as i drop it, they stay alive
my tank are at 26 deg
water hardness at 85
that might help you a bit

 

[Zagz]

The ph is fine if it is stable. How long have you had the gourami?

 

[JasonC]

Its been in since august... actually the first fish in the tank. The tank has been at 7.4 since september... so its not like it was a sudden swing to 7.4.

 

[Zagz]

I find gourami's to be hard to keep. Not sure if it is because they are weak stock at the lfs. I have personally given up. He had no bloating or fungus at all?

 

[mitcore]

I have no trouble with gouramis if the water stats are fine and stable,
they are a fairly hardy fish and can live with alot of different tank mates

 

[fort384]

I would find it hard to attribute the loss to a pH of 7.4 vs. 7.0. Especially if they were living in that pH for months prior to the fatality.

 

[JasonC]

Zags - no, no bloating, no fungus... thats why I am so confused... just a total loss of color, clamped fins and the fact that he was completly stiff... not like previous fish that I have had pass away who were still... well... bendable.

Mitcore - from the research I have done on the little buggers, I have seen acceptable pH levels as low as 6.5 and as high as 8.0. If water conditions are the problem, wouldnt he have succumbed a long time ago?

 

[mitcore]

fair enough what about chlorine? have you got that in your water?

 

[JasonC]

Yes, there is chlorine in the water and I did top off the tank the morning before, but sufficient Prime was used to handle that.

How am I confidant in that? Cause Prime is almost annoyingly concentrated, and I would need a medical syringe to measure out less of it than I would have needed to deal w/ the 1 Gal. of water that I used to top off.... actually, thats not a bad idea... I am always concerned that I may be using too much of the stuff...

 

[missileman]

My dwarf gouramis thrive at 7.4Ph and are very hardy fish.
Did anything change recently, any new fish added to the tank?

 

[Fishyfanatic]

Jason- You can get baby medicine syringes at the drug store, that's what I use for dosing my tank.

The pH isn't the problem. Unless it is drastically low or incredibly high, it won't be an issue. I'm at a loss as to what could have happened to it. Was it picked on after death?

 

[JasonC]

Missileman - Nothing has changed in the tank except for the removal of 2 fish 2 months ago. Thanks for the confirmation on the pH... the hardiness of the fish is why I went with it... I was hoping for some long term success as I learned more.

FishyFanatic - Good idea on the baby syringe... and with a wiggler of my own on the way, I have an excuse to get one... though it will never make it into the nursery (ooops ;P) As far as was the corpse getting picked on, yeah... one of the amano shrimp was gnawing on it.

I'm @ a loss too... may have to strike this one up to freak incedent, or bad stock. Which sucks, cause then there is nothing for me to take away and learn from the incedent.

 

[Fishyfanatic]

Yeah, don't confuse those syringes. Danios don't take well to baby tylenol. haha

If ask about the picking because it could have died from being partially eaten. But if it was just shrimp gnaws, it's highly doubtful.

You may have to chalk it up to a freak incident. Every once in a while we get one of those and it's unexplained. Could be something with the fish similar to a heart attack or something along those lines. Unexplained.

 

[missgingersnap]

I had the exact same thing happen to one of my dwarf gouramis. I thought it was weird that he was so stiff too. He also had the brownish black colour around the mouth and also on the underbelly. He was perfectly fine the day before. I thought it was because I treated the tank for ick but now I guess it was one of those weird things.

 

[JasonC]

You know, I wonder if this has anything to do with that Dwarf Gourami virus I have heard about before? Hopefully someone with more knowledge will see this and chime in...