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Old 10-03-2014, 02:54 AM   #1
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Bad luck tank. .29 gallons

A bit of history. Started out with 2 small fancy tail goldfish (Gonzo and Camilla) in a 10gal with intent to upgrade as they got a bit bigger. Thought the tank was cycled, it wasn't. Poor fish went through the works, high amonia, nitrite spikes, etc. Finally got it level and then Gonzo died a week before my paycheck that was dedicated to getting them a 29 gal.

Set up the 29 gal, filled with water *slowly from a brita as our tap water isnt great even with conditioner.* let run for only 2 days BUT with the old filter floating in it, some gravel from the old tank, some decorations, and 2 of those bacterial colony floating stars. Had water tested, transfered Camilla, rest of the substrate, rest of the decos, and now had 2 filters running. Got water tested every 3 days, levels have been great since. (LFS does free water tests. Said very very minor amonia levels, normal for a goldfish tank)

Flash forward. Lost 6 ottocats only weeks after adding. (2 at a time. Replacing only as died) decided no more ottos. Camilla bottom sat for days, then was active, then bottom sat, then active. LFS girl (who has a 200gal tank and a couple 100 gals, shes really good with fish) said its possible just permanent damage from the previous conditions, or possible she is just bored/lonely.

Added a fancy tail, small guy. Klauss. Followed her around like a puppy, not nipping. They were thick as theives and even slept in a nook together. A month in Camila started getting swim bladder. Gave her some peas, no luck. Noticed slight signs of maybe it being bacterial, took some pictures, was recommended tc tetra by a girl at the LFS that wasnt the usual one i talk too. 1 day of that treatment Camilla was swimming normal again, but white splotches showed up. Ich. Verified i couldn't treat both at once.

Ran 2 new carbon filters to remove tc tetra and did 30% W/C. Waited 48 hours. Added ich treatment. Cured the ich. Then her and klaus developed black on some scales and part of fins. Regular healing process for goldfish, except Klauss got better. Camilla got fin rot. Lost most of her giant tail in a matter of 48 hours. Klauss the sweetheart stayed by her even when she wasnt swimming.

Asked for help, found the regular girl at the LFS, she recommended sulfur something. Didn't seem too hopeful when i showed her the picture, Camilla also got red gills. Turned the 10 gal into a sick tank, put camilla in it with the meds, acclimated her of course. She died a few hours later. (She was barely moving by the time i got back from the pet store. Really rapid decline)

Not wanting Klauss to be alone for too long, as adding fish after a goldfish has been alone for a long time never works well for me (and he looked really blah) i went to the LFS the next day and picked up a slightly bigger ryu fancy tail. And a cory cat. Asked about the sick tank / quarantine tank, regular girl said probably not a good idea if the meds are still in that tank, better do a big water change in that little tank and replace the filter then let it cycle before using it. While a quarantine tank is recommended its probably safer in this case to just acclimate and add. *also got water tested. Levels still "next to perfect, which for such little waste producers is perfect"*

New goldfish is slightly bigger than klauss and pushes him around a bit during feeding and just randomly sometimes. (Stress maybe new tank for him and all). BUT my cory died in 24 hours. He was very hyper in the store. Very calm in the bag on the ride home. Then just sat in one spot in the tank all day. Then went sideways and breathing heavy. Then spastically started swimming on his side for about 45 seconds... and death.

I have read so much conflicting info on cory cats. Dont mix with goldfish. Their amonia rates even at best will kill the cory fast! Cory and goldfish are great companions! Dont get a cory they need warmer water! Get 5 corys minimum or they will die they need to school! ...

29 gal. Klauss is doing fine (other than being chased a bit. its only day 2 for the new fish) levels are all normal. Ph. Nitrites. Amonia, etc. Catfish of any type die super fast. Dont want to buy "5 corys" and a) have them die, b) isnt that WAY beyond max capacity for a 29gal??

Suggestions? Help? What can i safely add for a bottom cleaning fish? And at what point should i be concerned if klauss keeps getting chased?

Sorry for the really long post, i just figure as much detailed info on the fish and tank history the on my first post the better. That way im not accidentally omitting anything critical that could radically change any advice i might get.
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Old 10-03-2014, 01:28 PM   #2
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Your first mistake was the Ottos in a goldfish tank. Especially one that wasn't an established tank. At best you expect a %50 survival rate even in a balanced tank. Ottos are very sensitive. And they eat the bacteria that grows on the glass, new tanks won't have much.

As for the cory, I've heard they like to be in groups. I have six now and they all build sand castles together. I don't know if they're good with gold fish or not. Hopefully some one else will chime in.

Bottom feeder with a gold fish? I have seen lots of people do plecos in a gf tank. They're SUPER hardy. As a child I had a comet and a six inch pleco in a 1g (if that bowl). He was tiny when I got him. And also, I was six, I didn't know any better. Oddly he lived two years in the bowl only to die two weeks after I put him into my new 15g warm water tank.

Maybe do research and get the right one for the right size tank. They get pretty big. I haven't had one since that above mentioned pleco. but I believe there are some that stay around six inches.

I hope things work out for you! I'm so glad you upgraded your tank for your little buddy.


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Old 10-03-2014, 02:27 PM   #3
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Wow. A really sad story, I can totally relate to. I have a 20 long and a 29. I too am unable to keep the original fish I get. I would suggest research a lot. Goldfish will out grow tanks very fast. I have reached the point where I am being more open to several different hinds of fish in hopes I find a comparable match. People go on and on about water paramiters, ammonia is the most important. Yes they do sell Pleco that don't grow over 6 inches, I'd just double or triple confirm that is what your getting. Don't put to much faith in the store employees, they have lead me in some awful messes. Good luck and know your not alone. I'm still looking for a match and have been at this over 6 months.


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Old 10-03-2014, 03:05 PM   #4
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Welcome to the community.

There are a good number of articles and threads to read through when you have the time about keeping Goldfish and also tank mate suggestions.

Well that sounds like a lot of trouble and work you have been doing for the tank. Now that you are getting some of the basics down things should get easier.

I think that you have picked a difficult fish. Not really all that difficult but it has some very specific conditions and problems associated with it's keeping.

As for the low ammonia and near perfect parameters. When you go next time for the water testing, please have them write down what the numbers are. That helps to see possibilities of why things might have or might happen in the tank.
Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate
PH

What is the temperature?

One thing that is important to know is to not clean your filter pads in tap water. Only swish in old, pwc water or new water that has been treated with dechlorinator. Do not replace the filter pads normally because that is where all the beneficial bacteria aka BB live. If you remove/change the filter pads due to medication or age, you will loose your BB. If the meds killed the BB you have to start over anyway.

So your tank probably isn't cycled again. If I am understanding where we are in the progression of things. When did you change the pads, number of days or weeks ago???
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Old 10-03-2014, 06:03 PM   #5
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Pads were changed about a week ago, but when i change pads i only change 1 at a time. Two filters two pads. I also leave in those stars and when i change pads i make sure not to gravel vac.

I've since learned to trust 3 of the store employees, but the rest all seem like temps that just rattle off answers from the back of packaging...

I've done a ton of online research but i always get conflicting answers. Dumbest thing i have read so far is the "common knowledge" that you can't put a snail in a goldfish tank.. even as a kid ive had a goldfish and a snail. Both lived for years...

Sadly the plecos my lfs sells are all ones that get bigger than 6-8 inches.

I remember having a cory as a kid, with my one non fancy goldfish and snail, guy lived forever. I wouldn't mind getting a couple corys but I'm not sure the tank can handle it.

Getting water tested today when i return the dead cory. Ill have actual numbers soon.

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Old 10-03-2014, 06:06 PM   #6
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Temp is 78-82 at highest but usually around 75. dumb heater that came with the tank has a + and a - but no numbers to program like the little heater i got for the 10 gallon. I keep reading goldfish like it colder, then on sites taking about good tank mates reading they like it around 78. Maybe that's just because goldfish have a wider survival range and the better companions like it closer to warm?

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Old 10-03-2014, 11:43 PM   #7
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Ok got the water tested again. Zero nitrates. Amonia less then 0.25 and the girl said last time i was in it was zero as well, the water test on the uncycled quarantine tank was 0.25. And PH was 7.6

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Old 10-04-2014, 12:35 AM   #8
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As for the temp, Goldies like cooler water 72-74F would be fine.

When the water is much warmer it reduces the amount of oxygen available for the GF to breathe so that can cause stress to the fish as well.

I would reduce the temp a little more until you have it right - a couple degrees a day if you can,(I know it is a dumb heater).

Hold off on the tankmate idea for a little bit.

The snail thing is that Goldies will eat snails, usually smallish ones that is why it is recommended no snails.

It would be good to stay with some basic stuff first. The Mystery snails should be alright.

Later after the tank stays stable and is completely cycled, then would be the time to add something else if there is enough room available in the tank.

A 40G Breeder tank or 55 might be better if you are looking to get more tank mates in the future.
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