Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Freshwater > Freshwater & Brackish - Unhealthy Fish
Click Here to Login

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
 
Old 02-28-2017, 04:59 AM   #1
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
Betta being lethargic and not eating

Hello.
My betta fish has been lethargic and refusing to eat for around three weeks. He is lying on the gravel most of the time. He would occasionally spring up but slowly swims down to the ground. He looks like he is falling when he swims down.

I see obvious fin rot. He doesn't do anything but moving his gills lightly. Under the gills, the colour has changed from green-blue to gold. It looks rusty. Around his eyes and mouth also looks rusty.

I've been following 10-day-routine, which was told by an aquarist.
1. Remove the carbon filter. (The white one)
2. Days 1, 2, 3 and 6 - 1.5 ml of Protozin.
3. Days 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 - 2ml of Melafix.
4. On the Day 10, do 25-50% water change, insert the carbon filter back and leave it up until Day 11. Take out the filter and restart from Day 1.

It has been 13 days but the fish is still lethargic. He rarely moves his eyes around.

I would appreciate it if any of you could give me some advice.

Below are my aquarium info:

The water tank is Fluval Chi 2 (19l).
There are two plants.
There is a 25w heater.
The temperature is always between 25-26C.
I do water test every day and the nitrate level is always a little high. The result sometimes shows O.K. but sometimes slightly higher.
__________________

__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 10:20 AM   #2
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
nirbhao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Michigan, Metro Detroit
Posts: 3,000
Oh no! MelaFix is no good for bettas. It coats their labyrinth organ and makes it hard for them to breathe.

Start daily water changes (30 - 50%) using a high quality water conditioner like Prime. That's going to help a lot.

How high is your nitrate?
__________________

__________________
I'm probably on my phone.

http://injaf.org/
http://thedelicion.com
nirbhao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 10:32 AM   #3
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by nirbhao View Post
Oh no! MelaFix is no good for bettas. It coats their labyrinth organ and makes it hard for them to breathe.

Start daily water changes (30 - 50%) using a high quality water conditioner like Prime. That's going to help a lot.

How high is your nitrate?


Oh, really? The aquarist who gave me that routine seemed pretty certain about his method... He even said he wouldn't bother too much about water change.

The nitrate level is always a little high. It's still in the 'O.K.' range but it's sometimes slightly higher.

I use Stress Coat for removing chlorine and Quick Start for bacteria. Will that be okay?
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 12:50 PM   #4
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 21
It sounds like he may have bloat I would put him in epsom salt and give hime a pea without the shell split the pea in quarters. I have been through this multiple times
__________________
ciaralynn0128 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 01:17 PM   #5
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
nirbhao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Michigan, Metro Detroit
Posts: 3,000
Did this person also recommend you buy from him when this fish is dead? It's like bizzaro advice.

I'm just one person on the internet, but consider how you would treat an infected wound. Would you cover it and leave the bandage on for 10 days? All of the toxins coming from the fish are staying right there in the water. Even if you kill the pathogens, you then have dead pathogens in the water. Just because they are microscopic doesn't mean they vanish.

This aquarist doesn't sound like the best resource to me. Within the next few hours, people who successfully keep healthy fish will resoundingly tell you that water changes are an important tool in healing an unwell fish.

I'm not familiar with stress coat, but you probably don't need quick start anymore. If you have zero ammonia and nitrites but some nitrates, your tank is probably cycled.
__________________
I'm probably on my phone.

http://injaf.org/
http://thedelicion.com
nirbhao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 06:33 PM   #6
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by ciaralynn0128 View Post
It sounds like he may have bloat I would put him in epsom salt and give hime a pea without the shell split the pea in quarters. I have been through this multiple times


I wanted to use the aquarium salt and even have bought it. But the aquarist told me not to use it as it will damage the plants. I'm quite confused...
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 06:43 PM   #7
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by nirbhao View Post
Did this person also recommend you buy from him when this fish is dead? It's like bizzaro advice.

I'm just one person on the internet, but consider how you would treat an infected wound. Would you cover it and leave the bandage on for 10 days? All of the toxins coming from the fish are staying right there in the water. Even if you kill the pathogens, you then have dead pathogens in the water. Just because they are microscopic doesn't mean they vanish.

This aquarist doesn't sound like the best resource to me. Within the next few hours, people who successfully keep healthy fish will resoundingly tell you that water changes are an important tool in healing an unwell fish.

I'm not familiar with stress coat, but you probably don't need quick start anymore. If you have zero ammonia and nitrites but some nitrates, your tank is probably cycled.


I appreciate your advice. I will stick to the plan as there are only seven days left.

But as you said, I will do the 25% water change every day as you advised.

Thank you. Could you tell me what is the illness of my fish based on the symptoms I described?

I've also attached some photos. Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1898.jpg
Views:	64
Size:	213.9 KB
ID:	295686
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1656.jpg
Views:	76
Size:	216.9 KB
ID:	295687
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 07:08 PM   #8
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
nirbhao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Michigan, Metro Detroit
Posts: 3,000
Oh my goodness those pictures are heartbreaking! You must be so sad!

He's so pretty. I hope you can help him through this.

First, Epsom salt is an entirely different chemical than aquarium salt. It will not damage your plants and will help your betta. I definitely agree with that and a pea. I usually put a couple of peas in the microwave for a few seconds and then squeeze them through a garlic press.

I think right now your betta is just very weak. The fin rot is stressing his system, and any water issues (even if they're minor) only make it worse.

I think the MelaFix is a major stressor. Here's an except from a really long article that was written in 2008 and updated two months ago:

Quote:
Tea Tree oil (Melaleuca leucadendron and Melaleuca alternifolia) is a phenol-containing essential oil.
Its active ingredients are cyclic terpenes which have a similar structure and action to turpentine (a KNOWN liver toxin).
The acute toxicity for the major terpenic compounds (linalool, ocimene, alpha-terpinene, 1,8-cineole, terpinolene, camphene) is 2 - 5 g/kg body weight, which is considered a moderately toxic range.

From a toxicological point of view Tea Tree oil is comparable to oil of turpentine, which is readily absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract and then finds its way to the liver. What may be the problem is that under certain conditions Melafix may be toxic to the liver in Labyrinth fish/Pencil fish.
http://<br /> http://www.fish-as-pet...html?m=1<br />

Adding more and more melafix without removing the old water is making the water increasingly toxic.

He's your fish, and by all means you can stay the course- but is it working?
__________________
I'm probably on my phone.

http://injaf.org/
http://thedelicion.com
nirbhao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 07:43 PM   #9
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by jadugarr View Post
I wanted to use the aquarium salt and even have bought it. But the aquarist told me not to use it as it will damage the plants. I'm quite confused...
Put him in a separate tank or bowl until he is better i have saved many lives doing this with epsom salt.
__________________
ciaralynn0128 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 07:48 PM   #10
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
nirbhao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Michigan, Metro Detroit
Posts: 3,000
Really and truly epsom salt will not harm plants.
__________________
I'm probably on my phone.

http://injaf.org/
http://thedelicion.com
nirbhao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 10:44 PM   #11
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
I've added one more picture I took tonight.

I really feel grateful for advice from all of you. I will definitely buy epsom salt tomorrow.

I've just seen a YouTube video about putting one spoon of salt per 40l into an aquarium. Since my aquarium is 19l, I think I can put half a spoon of salt. Will that be okay?

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1998.jpg
Views:	54
Size:	215.2 KB
ID:	295694
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 11:09 PM   #12
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
I meant a teaspoon, not a spoon.
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 11:20 PM   #13
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 21
That should be okay ☺ I have 4 betta but, about a year or so ago my betta had bloat and I did epsom salt and it worked wonders. I have also done it with goldfish as well epsom salt is like magic! I love my bettas I did have 5 but my 1 that I had over a year just passed recently. It was heartbreaking. Sadly you never know how old they are when you get them. So you will never know their time to go. But anywho the epsom salt should help! Give us updates on him! ❤
__________________
ciaralynn0128 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2017, 11:28 PM   #14
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Autumnsky's Avatar



POTM Champion
Tank of the Month Award
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Northern Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,271
Hi, Epsom Salt is Magnesium Sulfate and is used to help plants grow better so no worry there.

Epsom Salts is a very good healer. When you have spare time you can look it up and read about it.

The best thing for fin rot is perfect, clean treated water.

StressCoat is good, it has aloe. Do not use the Melafix with tea tree oil. It is useful stuff for many things but not for Labyrinth organ breathing fish like Betta as already correctly mentioned.

Please do 4 50% pwc over the course of a day, 2 now then about 8-12 hours later 2 more to clean out the tank and water. 50% at a time as it will change the water he is in more gradually. So not a 100% change at one time - 2 back to back 50% pwc's.

Here is some info for doing Salt Treatment and Epsom Salt for the tank water.

Do NOT use the Salt treatment for your fish, but you might need this info later down the road.

Follow the directions for the Epsom Salt treatment. Make sure there are no additives in the Epsom salts only ingredient: Epsom Salt / Magnesium Sulfate.

"Salt being aquarium salt, kosher salt, sea salt, or other salt which contains nothing other than salt, no iodine, anti caking agent, etc. Salt.

You can have 2 rounded tablespoons per gallon for Epsom Salt. To make the change/adding salt to water easier for the fish, have a freshly pwc tank.

Make the amount of water and Epsom Salts (ES) to equate to the total amount for the gallons of the tank. 1G=2 rounded tablespoons 5G=10 rounded TBL

Dissolve the ES into the container you will be using to dissolve it in. I use hot water from my tap. If you have older lead pipes in the house or a old water heater, don't use hot water from the tap. Use /heated water from a rinsed off container and use a stove/pot or microwave to heat water. Rinsed off because some rinse agents from the dishwasher can leave their rinse stuff on the dishes.

Then take the ES concentrate and add it gradually. I will personally do a little more than a 1/4 amount, then if you are gonna be home with the fish, add a small amount every couple hours, but if you won't be home, just divide the other amount into 1/3 parts to add every 8-10 hours. This just makes it more gentle way to allow him to get used to it.

In the past if I was really worried I might add it all in 12-20 hour period, not waiting as long in between. I have never had an issue even when adding the whole amount in smaller portions over an hour or 2. You may want to call the medicine manufacturer and ask if they know if Magnesium Sulfate will interfere with the treatment. If so just do a couple -3 pwc to remove it. You would want clean freshly pwc tank before treatment anyway.

To add the ES to pwc, calculate the amounts of the pwc - water to be added back in.

Let's say you do 1G pwc every day. I use a plastic gallon water jug and make up an amount of concentrate to use per pwc. Extrapolate the amount of pwc you want to do with an amount of water, say 1 cup of water with the 2T of ES and say 5 days PWC = 5C water and 10T ES, your amount to dose will be slightly more because of adding the ES ~1C+2T per pwc. You can add this to the pwc water when you do the change.

You can mark the gallon jug ahead of time with a sharpie line for each dose or just have a measuring cup for the fish.

I like the dollar store for measuring cups, spoons, water pitcher, turkey baster, sieve, strainer, etc. for the fish, they get their own stuff no one uses for anything else."

*******

You can add an air bubbler if it does not blow him around too much, you can use a valve or clip to reduce the flow.

He's dying, you need to act fast, clean water & Epsom Salt. See if he will eat the pea. You can use canned no salt added Peas too. If you haven't seen any improvement before, you do not have anything to lose and I have been successful often for ill fish with clean water and ES. This is not a miracle, because he is sick, he may also need medicine.
__________________

New to FW fish? First tank in a long time or EVER??? Need some info on keeping fish?
Start here - Aquarium Advice Article
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/guide...ater-aquarium/

Community Rules
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forum...ork&page=rules

FW & SW
Favorite tank right now - 12G Edge nano fish
Autumnsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2017, 05:59 AM   #15
Aquarium Advice Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 7
Thank you, guys. I have never felt this amount of hospitality, warmth and kindness in any other Internet forum.
I appreciate your help and detailed explanation.

Sadly and most tragically, my fish has passed on. I will bring his body to a shop and had them examine him thoroughly. I really want to know what caused the illness.

I will leave some photos of him when he was lively and healthy.

Again, thank you so much for your help. I promise I will come back again.



Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0383.jpg
Views:	50
Size:	252.6 KB
ID:	295702

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1387.jpg
Views:	51
Size:	186.0 KB
ID:	295703

Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_1989.jpg
Views:	48
Size:	128.6 KB
ID:	295704
__________________
jadugarr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2017, 08:09 AM   #16
Aquarium Advice Addict
 
nirbhao's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Michigan, Metro Detroit
Posts: 3,000
Sorry for your loss. Thank you for the beautiful pictures of your betta while healthy.
__________________
I'm probably on my phone.

http://injaf.org/
http://thedelicion.com
nirbhao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-01-2017, 11:12 AM   #17
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
 
Autumnsky's Avatar



POTM Champion
Tank of the Month Award
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Northern Colorado, USA
Posts: 13,271
Yes, he was a beautiful guy. It is always even more difficult when you don't know what happened. So sorry you lost him.
__________________

New to FW fish? First tank in a long time or EVER??? Need some info on keeping fish?
Start here - Aquarium Advice Article
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/guide...ater-aquarium/

Community Rules
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forum...ork&page=rules

FW & SW
Favorite tank right now - 12G Edge nano fish
Autumnsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2017, 05:14 AM   #18
Aquarium Advice Freak
 
Kwakatoo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 286
He was beautiful, sorry for your loss
__________________
Kwakatoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-04-2017, 07:44 PM   #19
Aquarium Advice Freak
 
jfhrtn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: East NC
Posts: 335
Very beautiful fish. Sorry to hear of his passing. The light blue/teal to red/white transition was stunning
__________________

__________________
jfhrtn is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
betta, eat, eating, lethargic, not eating

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Betta fish being lethargic AJ_117 Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 30 08-27-2015 05:38 PM
Lethargic Puffer Fish not Eating Rnbwfimmy Freshwater & Brackish - Unhealthy Fish 10 02-26-2013 06:08 PM
Two of my Zebra Danios are lethargic and not eating? Skyan Freshwater & Brackish - Unhealthy Fish 1 07-29-2012 08:55 PM
Dwarf frog eating/looking lethargic? eowyn Freshwater & Brackish - Aquatic Reptiles, Amphibians & Herpetology 0 01-06-2012 07:24 PM
Tiger Barbs not eating and being shy. FUBAR Freshwater & Brackish - Unhealthy Fish 6 12-02-2005 02:33 AM







» Photo Contest Winners







All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:51 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×