Guppy with clamped fin

[Scottx2]

Good evening everyone,

Hoping you may be able to help. I'm having a bit of a problem with one of my guppies. I recently purchased two male guppies, one of the two died after displaying very similar symptoms to the one I'm having problems with now. They both showed a clamped fin and really struggled to swim.

The second one now seems to have red gills.

I've tested my water and my ammonia is 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 20-40, pH 7.

Any ideas?

 

[brennae]

Interesting. Red gills is often a sign of other problems sometimes being ammonia poisoning. Clamped fins is another symptom of a bigger issue. Tank size, filtration, water additives, ferts?

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[Scottx2]

We have a 100L tank with now 4 guppies (most we had at once was 6) and 8 cardinal tetras so we don't think it's a stocking issue.

We water change 20% every week, sometimes twice and always use prime to dechlorinate the water. We have started putting in aquarium salt into the new water when we change it but we had problems before we started this. We don't use any fertilisers and can't think of anything contaminating the water as we use equipment only for the tank and it has the hood on all the time as well.

Thanks

 

[Scottx2]

Forgot to say the tank has been running for 6 months and we've only had problems the last month. The filter is for a 100l tank and was the one we had when we cycled it.

 

[brennae]

Did you quarantine the newest guppies? I'm wondering if they brought something in if nothing else is off in your tank.

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[Scottx2]

We didn't, we don't have a QT currently. Generally we put them after allowing them time to settle (allow the temperature to adjust, adding some tank water to the bag etc). However we did get a third guppy at the same time as the two displaying symptoms and he is completely fine.

 

[brennae]

What's the tank temperature?

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[Scottx2]

78 degrees.

 

[brennae]

I breed guppies mostly the Moscow strains- my credentials for what I am about to say. I would lower the temp to 75 degrees F. I just looked it up and cardinals can take down to about 68. 78 is going to make the guppy metabolism speed up but is not necessarily healthy for the fish. Also the warmer the water the less oxygen content.
Did you purchase all the guppies from one tank at the lfs and are they just a stadard variety or something more fancy? I ask this because the fancy strains often end up being a bit weaker.

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[Scottx2]

I'll try reducing the temperature, thanks for the advice.

They are the more fancy strain of guppy. I purchased them all from the same LFS, the same place I've bought all of my fish from without any problems before.

 

[brennae]

Well here's an example of what fish go thru before they get to the fish store. They are bought and sold and change hands a few times. If they are from overseas who knows if the bag water got changed after the were flown in and made it through official inspection. Who knows how long wholesaler had them before a store ordered them. At my lfs on fish stock day. They float the bags and then dump this fish in. No acclimation. I have seen first hand the dead and dying fish that arrive. That's why fish cost what they do, to make up for the part of the order that didn't make it to the consumer. This is an extreme amount of stress for the fish. If you happen to purchase them the same day they arrived or even the next day then the process starts all over again of adjusting to new water etc. Add that to genetically weakened fish bred for profit and not outcrossed enough. The are vulnerable to lots of things. In my opinion because nothing obvious comes to mind, up your water changes and maybe add some leaves as both types of fish benefit from the tannins. I don't use salt personally and I think it can be overused so be cautious on that front.

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[brennae]

Oh I forgot to add something. I have much better luck when I find a private breeder near my area and purchase my stock from them. Chances are the livestock was raised in similar water conditions then and you usually end up with less stressed and as a result healthier fish.

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[Jmunroe]

Fish do go through a lot of stress in travel for sure. I would like to clear something up that brennae mentioned in regards to the fish being floated and then added directly to the tank. This is the best way of acclimation for fish that have been shipped for long periods of time.
I'll explain.
Fish and water are added to a bag for shipping. Ammonia and waste being produced by the fish in that small bag causes the water to become acidic and the pH to drop. When pH is low ammonia becomes less toxic and if the pH gets low enough ammonia is hardly toxic at all.
So the fish bag arrives after its long journey. You float the bag to temp match the tank it's going in and drop and plop the fish in. If you start to acclimate the fish by dripping or adding small amounts of tank water to the bag, the pH starts to rise and you guessed it, that extremely high ammonia level in the bag that is not toxic suddenly becomes lethal.
The rise in pH that the fish is subjected to when taken directly from the bag and added to the tank doesn't matter much. Fish can go directly from low pH to higher pH without much issue. They don't however go from high pH to low pH very well.
The fish should be removed from the dirty bag by net or hand and added to the tank. You should never dump the water from the bag into your tank. This will increase the chances of your fish getting sick and dying more than the drop and plop ever would.
So this is how fish are able to be shipped in bags. And what to do when they arrive.
Now if your getting fish locally and they are not in the travel water for an extended period of time then of course drip acclimation can make their adjustment much easier.

Edit. I forgot to add.. To the op, change more water. Your probably starting to see the effects of the small water changes over the 6 months, along with fish that may have some issues when you received them. Fish with issues and non pristine water will develop issues quickly. Pristine water is the best medicine.

 

[brennae]

Whenever I get fished shipped to me I add a drop of Prime immediately upon opening the bag to counteract that ammonia. I then put the fish and bag water in a specimen container and acclimate to my water conditions. I've never lost a fish this way. Everyone has a different way of doing things though.

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[Matt68005]

Sounds like gill flukes. get some prazipro......