Guys please confirm what im dreading? ich?

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
aqua_holic said:
Because it opens up the possibility of temperature changes, compromising the treatment. Many proponents of the heat treatment advocate no water changes during the treatment. It's just an unnecessary variable to add to the mix. Often those that have trouble with the heat treatment are doing water changes.
Click to expand...

But i guess, if you continue to feed, as you would, you still may have to due to nitrates correct? I understand that you probably shouldn't get into nitrate danger territory over the space of 10 days presuming that your readings were good prior to starting the treatment?
 
Ruffers99 said:
As to the water changes, I was only going to do them if my water parameters required me to do them??



And to the UV unit. It wasn't so much as to treat ich specifically, just more of a preventative tool that was hooked up when I needed it (such as when I introduce new fish or I am dealing with any kind of illness in the tank).

This is the uint that I spec'ed out for my filter flow.





so in summary:



  • Temp up to 86 (will try 88, but may loose tetra's)
  • Dose w/aquarium salt as per above article.
  • keep the lights off
  • dose w/stress guard
  • wait around 10 days to make sure it clears.



did I miss anything? thanks guys!!
Click to expand...


Yes I would only do water changes if you have ammonia or nitrite problems. You are correct about the nitrates - for the duration of the treatment, it's a nonissue.

UV is nice, but it's hard to really quantify it's benefits with anything more than green water. If you've got the $$ why not. If you don't, don't worry about it.

The first and last items on the list are all you need to do. Salt is unnecessary when treating with heat. Lights - don't matter If they are on or off, less for the comfort of fish that are in really poor shape. Stress guard? I guess if you want to use it, but it's not important. Temp up and wait - that's really all there is to it. I know, it seems so simple and easy - I think that's why people always want to hedge their bets - adding unnecessary aspects to the treatment.
 
aqua_holic said:
Because it opens up the possibility of temperature changes, compromising the treatment. Many proponents of the heat treatment advocate no water changes during the treatment. It's just an unnecessary variable to add to the mix. Often those that have trouble with the heat treatment are doing water changes.
Click to expand...

Yea I could see that being a problem. I should have said to temp match with a good digital thermometer. I forget that some or most do the simple hand check. I monitor temp as adding and keep no difference over .5 deg and only error to the warmer side.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Aquarium Advice mobile app
 
aqua_holic said:
The first and last items on the list are all you need to do. Salt is unnecessary when treating with heat. Lights - don't matter If they are on or off, less for the comfort of fish that are in really poor shape. Stress guard? I guess if you want to use it, but it's not important. Temp up and wait - that's really all there is to it. I know, it seems so simple and easy - I think that's why people always want to hedge their bets - adding unnecessary aspects to the treatment.
Click to expand...

ok and thanks, yeah i hear you on the hedging bets.. its never something you want to have to worry about, though I know its common among folks as you can see by the amount of times ich is posted.

Thanks again for everyone's comments on this, I think I have a plan worked out. I will try 86 as that seems to be the norm. I just hope I don't loose my tetra's. :(:( Or any of them to that point.
 
aqua_holic said:
I disagree with doing any water changes. It doesn't matter how many parasites are in the tank, they will all die from the heat. There's really no point whatsoever to remove them prior to them being killed.

Water changes do not make the heat treatment any more effective, though it's possible for them to make the treatment less effective.

UV is an extremely expensive means of dealing with ich. Once the heat treatment is complete there will be no ich in your tank, and it will continue like that till you re introduce it with fish or plants.
Click to expand...

Except that lower nitrates also increase the fishes resistance to ich by giving them an immune boost.Assuming you temp match the water then theres really no risk involved.
 
Don't use sadly with your loach. I have heard they don't handle salt very well

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Aquarium Advice mobile app
 
On a side note.. gbrs will do better long term in Temps of 80+.. it may not sound like a lot but every little but counts with them.. good luck with the ichy

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app
 
Mebbid said:
Except that lower nitrates also increase the fishes resistance to ich by giving them an immune boost.
Click to expand...


I suppose in a massively overstocked tank that could possibly make a discernible difference. But boost or no boost, the treatment kills the parasites - has nothing to do with the fishs immune response, and IMO proper quarantine is a more effective measure for preventing figure outbreaks than boosting the fishs immune system. Again, as was mentioned, it's only 10 days - I think it would be nearly impossible to show any difference in the fish from 5-10 nitrates to 15-20, or 30 for that matter.
 
aqua_holic said:
I suppose in a massively overstocked tank that could possibly make a discernible difference. But boost or no boost, the treatment kills the parasites - has nothing to do with the fishs immune response, and IMO proper quarantine is a more effective measure for preventing figure outbreaks than boosting the fishs immune system. Again, as was mentioned, it's only 10 days - I think it would be nearly impossible to show any difference in the fish from 5-10 nitrates to 15-20, or 30 for that matter.
Click to expand...
The ich causes tissue damage when it bursts forth from the fish opening up the risk of secondary infections. The higher temperature increases the speed of the life cycle while preventing it from breeding. The ich that's already there will be worse for the fish for a short period.

Water changes can only help at this point, assuming they are temperature matched.
 
Can't recall I've ever seen anyone mention infection of tissue damage from the ich, and I know it's never happened for me. And like I said, there is no way that anyone can tell a difference between the effects of those levels of nitrate on the immune system over such a brief period of time. It's a purely theoretic argument, and I'm certainly in no position to disagree with you on that level. But from a practical standpoint, it's splitting hairs.
 
Ruffers99 said:
ok thanks Nick I will look into getting some stress guard if that will help the fish while i am treating this.



I was also reading this which seemed a pretty good write up on badmans forum wrt ich and its was suggested to use salt also (even with CL). so I guess i will get some of that also.



As to the water changes, I was only going to do them if my water parameters required me to do them??



And to the UV unit. It wasn't so much as to treat ich specifically, just more of a preventative tool that was hooked up when I needed it (such as when I introduce new fish or I am dealing with any kind of illness in the tank).

This is the uint that I spec'ed out for my filter flow.





so in summary:



  • Temp up to 86 (will try 88, but may loose tetra's)
  • Dose w/aquarium salt as per above article.
  • keep the lights off
  • dose w/stress guard
  • wait around 10 days to make sure it clears.



did I miss anything? thanks guys!!
Click to expand...


I'll check out the flow rate and other details on mine tonight. Haven't looked in a long while. From memory it's a 24watt. Very slow flow rate. Maybe a gallon a minute or so.

For that price that should be a good unit.

I run mine 8hrs every day and then bump it up if anything going on.


http://www.fishbeginner.info/home/aquarium-uv-sterilizer-use/
 
Ruffers99 said:
ok thanks Nick I will look into getting some stress guard if that will help the fish while i am treating this.



I was also reading this which seemed a pretty good write up on badmans forum wrt ich and its was suggested to use salt also (even with CL). so I guess i will get some of that also.



As to the water changes, I was only going to do them if my water parameters required me to do them??



And to the UV unit. It wasn't so much as to treat ich specifically, just more of a preventative tool that was hooked up when I needed it (such as when I introduce new fish or I am dealing with any kind of illness in the tank).

This is the uint that I spec'ed out for my filter flow.





so in summary:



  • Temp up to 86 (will try 88, but may loose tetra's)
  • Dose w/aquarium salt as per above article.
  • keep the lights off
  • dose w/stress guard
  • wait around 10 days to make sure it clears.



did I miss anything? thanks guys!!
Click to expand...


IMO the only thing you're missing is a good QT practice. Your best defense is a great offense. You run a much higher percentage risk of introducing a problem without QT, and then your back to square one of trying to fix something that could've easily been avoided. One of the easiest to point out is cross contamination. Whether it be "dirty" tools, putting pet store water in your tank, or a fish with ich, there's a really good chance it could've been prevented.


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice
 
Dont waste money on meds, crank the heat up and play the waiting game. Had the same problem this time last week i am spot free and my fish are beyond happy.
 
dcutl002 said:
Good to hear ChaosTropicals. No more fish loss?

Sent from my BN NookHD+ using Aquarium Advice mobile app
Click to expand...

Nope! And my fish are happier than ever! Ive never seen my pleco out so much and my oscar actually "dances" around the front of the tank when i wake up to feed him in the morning and when i get home from school.
 
like over a day. 86 is perfection and it works like a charm. They may look worse first, but its because the heat speeds up the cycle of the parasite. They will soon clear up, but make sure you leave the temp up to 86 for 10 days at the very minimum to make sure you nuke all the ich.

Also, warm water carries less oxygen so surface agitation by lowering your water level, so your HOB filter makes a splash or adding an airstone is ideal.
 
THanks for all your encouragement and advice guys! I have cranked the temp so its on its way up to 86 as we speak, it was 84 when I left the house this morning, so I am expecting it to be there when I get home tonight.

I hear you on the QT statement, but I dont currently have a separate tank for that and I would have to think where I would put it in the house. I am pretty careful and I have tried to correctly drip acclimate according to research, so there should only be a fraction of the diluted LFS's water on the net when i transfer the fish to the tank, but I know that, that is all it could take sometimes. I think the fish must have had it already..

And yes, I want to try to avoid meds wherever possible, though I might still get the seachem stress guard to try and make the fish more comfortable during this or any other potential issue..

I will come back in 10 and update! fingers/legs and probably fins crossed. :hide:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

A
Ich vs. Stress Ich?
Replies
6
Views
4K
Colin_T
C
B
vacation ich treatment
Replies
4
Views
320
bananafish
B
F
GloFish and Ich
Replies
5
Views
3K
Colin_T
C
R
New fish owner, please help me
Replies
3
Views
380
Aiken Drum
Aiken Drum
V
Angelfish has clamped anal fin
Replies
10
Views
796
Andy Sager
Andy Sager

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom