I Have Some Bad News...

[ArtesiaWells]

Our Red Cap Oranda that was affected by the open blister/ulcer has died as well. The only fish left now is the Black Moor...

I think the tank was about to crash anyway, as we drained the water and are in the process of transfering the Moor to a new holding tank -- when we began draining the water and using the syphon to clean the gravel, ALL KINDS OF DISGUSTING DEBRIS came floating up from under the substrate and decor...slime, what appeared to be mold, fish poop, filthy dirt particles...it almost clogged the syphon tube up it was so thick and nasty...

This tank is in HORRENDOUS condition, what with the infection that ran through it and all the decor and plants being slimed over by some filthy mass; we are stripping it down to start over, and will transfer the Moor to a new small Goldfish Starter "tank" of some kind while we clean the main tank...

This is going to open up a whole new battery of issues and questions for me, though...first of all, did we do the right thing by draining this infected tank now that all the fish but one have died? If so, is it "normal" to start over when a tank kind of crashes? With the re-setup process, we know we are going to throw away the decor, gravel, bubble wands and plants -- as well as all filter media at this point -- because these are more than likely badly infected with whatever "bug" this was on the goldfish that killed them...but how do we go about disinfecting the tank itself and the power HOB filters? Do we use bleach of some kind?

We also need to start thinking about new aquascaping ideas for the new setup when it's time...I don't know what kind of theme to go with...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

We drained as much disgusting water from the main tank as we could, but need to get rid of the gravel and remaining water -- all decor and plants and filter media have been discarded as well. We have the Black Moor set up in one of those Marina 7 "goldfish starter" kits for kids, just as an emergency, which has an internal filter and some gravel and a plant, and have added already cycled water we bought from Petsmart. However, the Moor is now creating stools that have cottony-looking puffs coming off of them, so she is probably infected with the bacteria that killed the other fish. We don't know what to do for her at this point.

As far as setting up the old tank again -- what is the process for sterilizing it and the filters? Does the tank get washed down in bleach? How much concentration? The same with the filters?

If anyone could get back to us ASAP it would be appreciated because we'd like to get that old tank at least up and running with fresh gravel to start with so the Moor can go back in with some Stability and water conditioner...

 

[smomus]

I'm sorry to hear about your fish if you clean your tank watch out for cycles! Are you going to start over with filter media as well?
I've heard of, and used several methods. Some safer then others.
You could used a bleach solution. 1 part bleach to around 15 parts water. This will disinfect everything but be sure you have throughly rinsed everything once you have dosed the bleach water then also rinse in some water pre-treated with a good dechlorinator. Wouldn't hurt to let tank dry out over night once rinsed throughly
Another way that I've used is hydrogen peroxide. Spray down the entire tank with full strength peroxide. Then rinse same as above. This method I used when I bought a used tank that us now housing a very happy green spotted puffer.
Another i've heard of but haven't used is vinegar. Same method as above.

 

[smomus]

Oh and I would only use conditioner. Not the stability. The less you add to a tank the better it is in the long run. And less work for you

 

[Borderlesscott]

I would use Stability - its worked for me over and over, not an excuse not to do regular water changes aswell though.

 

[ArtesiaWells]

I'm sorry to hear about your fish if you clean your tank watch out for cycles! Are you going to start over with filter media as well?

Thank you for getting back to me, smomus. Of course, I am aware that if we start over and clean the tank we would have to re-cycle; and yes, we were going to start fresh on everything -- including fresh, new filter media for both the Aqueon QuietFlow 55 filter (two cartridges) as well as the AquaClear 110 (the sponge and Bio-Max). We are going to be patient and do the re-established tank right. This was a NASTY infection in this tank and we need to clean it really well and throw away all substrate, decor and filter media.

I've heard of, and used several methods. Some safer then others.
You could used a bleach solution. 1 part bleach to around 15 parts water. This will disinfect everything but be sure you have throughly rinsed everything once you have dosed the bleach water then also rinse in some water pre-treated with a good dechlorinator. Wouldn't hurt to let tank dry out over night once rinsed throughly

How is this done, though? Do we take the tank over to a tub and pour the water/bleach into it to clean? Does the tank really need to be washed down with dechlorinated water if it's not ready to accept fish any time soon (unless we move the Black Moor in there immediately for comfort)?

Another way that I've used is hydrogen peroxide. Spray down the entire tank with full strength peroxide. Then rinse same as above. This method I used when I bought a used tank that us now housing a very happy green spotted puffer.
Another i've heard of but haven't used is vinegar. Same method as above.

I have heard of the vinegar method, but I am uncertain if these things are done at the tank location, while it's on its stand, or inside a tub...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Oh and I would only use conditioner. Not the stability. The less you add to a tank the better it is in the long run. And less work for you

I used Stability on our 10 gallon we set up for the aggressive Red Cap Oranda that attacked the two fish in our 60 gallon and ultimately killed them by opening their nasty wounds (we isolated him in this 10 gallon starter tank) and after a week of dosing he is doing fine and the water seems to have cleared and remains stable. We even bought him two small tankmates today, which seem to be doing fine as well.

Stability is supposed to "kick-start" the cycle process and from my experience, it works -- here is why I want to use it so quickly though: We would like to get the Black Moor out of that little goldfish starter kit we bought for her (Marina Goldfish 1.77 Gallon Aquarium Starter Kit - Specialty Pet Month - Featured Products - PetSmart) and into the cleaned-up 60 gallon as soon as possible, so we need to clean this tank out, disinfect it, get some gravel down and filtration going, and we're going to have to use something like Stability because we cannot wait on the cycle process...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

I would use Stability - its worked for me over and over, not an excuse not to do regular water changes aswell though.

We only plan on using the Stability to kick-start the tank's cycle process -- we are only going to use it for the instructed week.

 

[smomus]

Do what is easiest. My tanks are smaller and easier to stick in the tub, but with a 60 that isn't feasible. If I were you I would do the hydrogen peroxide, in a spray bottle. saturate EVERYTHING with the peroxide let it sit for a while then rinse it. Empty the water, then rinse again. If you don't intend on adding fish immediately, then rinsing with conditioned water may not be necessary. peroxide isn't as harmful to fish as bleach and vinegar.
As for the stability, your choice. Some swear by it, others don't. If you were pleased with it in your 10 then go ahead

 

[Darklight]

Filling the tank with warm water and disolving a good amount of aquarium salt, then soaking the filter and parts in it should steralize sufficiently. Then giving the tank a good wipe round inside with the solution. Just a thought.

 

[Darklight]

Sorry for your fish loss by the way...... I"d be in bits

 

[smomus]

Filling the tank with warm water and disolving a good amount of aquarium salt, then soaking the filter and parts in it should steralize sufficiently. Then giving the tank a good wipe round inside with the solution. Just a thought.

Ths is true. I thought about it and forgot to mention it. although the other methods are probably cheaper, unless you already have aquarium salt

 

[aoessand]

when i reset up my 50 gallon i just carried it outside washed it with vinegar <to cut the white build up> and then used a lil bleach and just rinsed it for a good 30 minutes with the hose i dont see the point to using conditioned water just to rinse something just a waste of prime or whatever your using to condition your water...

 

[hcourts]

Did you treat your moor when you moved him to the other tank??

 

[jlk]

I am very sorry you lost your other fish . I would opt for bleach (10% solution). Salt will not kill all pathogens. You will need to soak everything for atleast 15mins then rinse very well. I honestly would do a fishless cycle on this tank because water changes are difficult for you. What 'tankmates' did you add to the small tank?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Do what is easiest. My tanks are smaller and easier to stick in the tub, but with a 60 that isn't feasible. If I were you I would do the hydrogen peroxide, in a spray bottle. saturate EVERYTHING with the peroxide let it sit for a while then rinse it. Empty the water, then rinse again. If you don't intend on adding fish immediately, then rinsing with conditioned water may not be necessary. peroxide isn't as harmful to fish as bleach and vinegar.
As for the stability, your choice. Some swear by it, others don't. If you were pleased with it in your 10 then go ahead

Hey Again Smomus,

Yeah, we simply cannot pick this tank up and carry it to the bathroom tub -- it's too heavy even without water...we tried. That leaves us no choice but to clean and dissinfect at the tank itself...but I don't know how to do this without having running water to rinse all this crap out...

Interesting suggestion about the peroxide -- maybe we'll try that, but I don't know how to "rinse" the stuff out after it sits awhile, as you suggest, without the tank being in a bathtub...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Sorry for your fish loss by the way...... I"d be in bits

Thank you, Darklight; we are indeed very, very saddened with our loss...we raised these fantails for two years straight and they were growing and getting nice and big...this infection hit them and the tank like a bat out of hell...

I don't even know if I want to go on with this hobby anymore; the diseased tank is absolutely DISGUSTING, with moldy, infected water that we can't even get out completely because we don't have a water pump and can't carry the tank to our bathtub...so the disgusting, fungus-ridden black water is sitting at the bottom with some gravel and we don't know how to get the rest out. Further, the water upon hitting our skin during the decor and water removal process has made us itch and burn, so something really awful got into this tank to wipe out the life in it...

Here's a clip from another forum I posted on to summarize my thoughts about what has happened; I'm tired and weary and very upset right now to go into fresh details about it:

Hi Guys,

It has been very hard to cope with our loss; we miss our fantails a lot and the house is not the same without them. Right now, we're trying desperately to save the Black Moor who was left (we put her in an emergency "Marina Cool 7 Goldfish Kit" that's ridiculously small, just temporarily to get her out of the infected,filthy tank water she was in) as well as monitor the health of the Red Cap Oranda who caused all this mess, in addition to some tankmates we bought him today, in the recently-cycled 10 gallon.

First of all, with regard to the "prepackaged water" issue -- this isn't hogwash...the jug the water came in is legitimately labeled as "ready to use" water without the need for waiting for a cycle (I assume without the beneficial bacteria that grows on the substrate, filters, etc.) and it wasn't just some water Petsmart sold us without a label or anything in some strange jar...it was a big jug with labeling on the back and front. Regardless, the Black Moor who received this water is doing okay since she's been put in hours ago, and the water is absolutely crystal-clear in that little holding tank...

Now, here is the dilemma we're running into with the tank that just crashed -- this thing is NASTY. Whatever water is left is absolutely BLACK and disgusting, with gross floating masses of debris and slime-like formations...all of this was under our substrate and decor, so it was probably a crash waiting to happen. My wife and I spent ALL DAY cleaning this tank out -- it's too large to move with any water in it, and we can't manage to pick it up even with very little water in it, so all the cleaning and cleansing will have to be done at the tank itself. I can't even get all the water out of this thing, as it got too low to continue syphoning, and we can't scoop any more out with a giant plastic spoon thing we have been using. Plus, there's still more gravel left in there...this disgusting, bacteria-infected water made our skin itch and get irritated just touching it, and I am ready to just throw the whole towel in already...I don't know if I can go through this with another tank setup...

How can we get the remainder of the water out? It has like an inch or two left at the bottom of the tank...should I attempt to let it evaporate? And what about the remainder of the gravel? Once everything is out and drained, how do I go about cleaning this tank without taking it over to a tub to be washed down with scalding hot water? What do I use?

 

[smomus]

Same way you do water changes. each time you put water in then siphon it out, it will dilute what ever you used to clean it.

 

[ArtesiaWells]

when i reset up my 50 gallon i just carried it outside washed it with vinegar <to cut the white build up> and then used a lil bleach and just rinsed it for a good 30 minutes with the hose i dont see the point to using conditioned water just to rinse something just a waste of prime or whatever your using to condition your water...

Hey aossand,

Thank you for the reply; what happened to your 50 that you reset it up? Did you have a crash or massive fish loss as well? What went wrong?

I wish we could carry this tank outside, but we just can't -- first of all, this is on the second floor of our house and we can't even lift it off the stand to get it into our bathtub on that floor...it's simply too heavy.

I don't think I would use the dechlorinated water either; as far as the bleach, how do you administer this procedure? Should I just pour water and bleach into the tank?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Same way you do water changes. each time you put water in then siphon it out, it will dilute what ever you used to clean it.

I see...

The thing is, we just threw away our syphon hose too because of the infection spores on it from draining the tank water...

Is there another way around this?