I May Soon Lose Another One...Can Anyone Tell Me Why This Keeps Happening?

[ArtesiaWells]

When I kept comets, I fed them around 3 times a day and the pinch was super tiny. I dipped it under water in the filter outflow so the could scavenge for it

So you wouldn't recommend one feeding per day, no matter the size?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Earlier in this post you mentioned a concern about exhausted carbon in the filter. Why use carbon at all ? It is really only needed to remove colour, odour or medication from water. And since you are using Purigen, it's even less necessary. There is some information I've read that suggests long term use of carbon can actually harm fish. Though it is used by many, and was once considered essential, this is changing.

I don't run the carbon in the AquaClear filter (if that's what you were assuming); I run it in the Aqueon filter because I use the company's own replacement floss cartridges which are loaded with the carbon bits...in the AquaClear 110, I run the sponge, a sack of Purigen and the BioMax (in that layering order)...

You may do better by using more biomedia in place of the charcoal in the filter. Charcoal does not support the beneficial bacteria as well as some other media does, so it should help with filtration.

I was considering swapping out my stock Aqueon cartridges for BioMax, sponges, etc. to make it run like an AquaClear -- but I'm not sure yet...

And frequent, small meals should help too. You might consider getting some floating Azolla, many goldfish relish eating this plant and if you have enough light over the tank it grows quite well. Mine is quite red, looks very pretty, really. Some Koi keepers grow Azolla just to feed their Koi. Azolla caroliniana is the species name, or one of them anyway.

So small feedings throughout the day instead of ONCE a day? I read and get SO many different opinions and viewpoints on this subject as it relates to goldfish that it's head spinning at this point...

When I clean my Aqua Clears, I squeeze and squash the sponge quite thoroughly in tank water. I do the same to the floss. The ceramic stuff I swish and roll around in my hands to clean it. I also cover the back, side and top of the filter with foil, as the tank is in a window and gets too much sun,which tends to grow algae in it. The foil stops the algae, and also seems to reduce the growth on the walls of the box in general. I only clean the filter box itself every few months. I do wipe down the media basket when I clean the media.

I squeeze and rinse the sponge in removed tank water, as well; I haven't rinsed off my BioMax pellets yet however as they still seem to be in the seeding process. The Purigen pack, of course, doesn't get rinsed. My tank isn't near a window (directly anyway) so the algae isn't a factor for me; though I DO cover the "exposed" areas of the back of the hoods on top with foil, interestingly now that you brought up "foil," to stop the evaporated "pops" from the bubbles coming from the bubble bars in the tank because they were running down the back glass...

How "infected" can the filter box itself get without cleaning it out often? I mean, the only serious maintenance I thought a filter should get was the media attention; does that gunk really need to be removed?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

The author of this post had sudden deaths due to, what we guess, is some toxin in the water. Carbon is good in this instance because it absorbs chemicals, including medications, chlorine, chloramine, and heavy metals.

Running new carbon in this case is recommended until the water can be tested from his local water supplier. This test is provided for free by the city. I don't run carbon in my tanks either, but my tapwater is filtered through a two stage filtration system that includes carbon.

I recently replaced an old dirty Aqueon carbon cartridge with a fresh new one, so I am hoping this will suffice for your suggested "running new carbon" because "in this case it's recommended" procedure...

Also, I didn't have "sudden deaths;" I had deaths in the past from what looked like the same "infectious growth" that appeared to be growing on my fantail currently, but they weren't sudden...they definitely took their time in the outbreak but my big question was WHY the fish continue to get these symptoms. As it relates to the current issue, I THINK the fish in question is experiencing improved symptoms, but I have to double check on that and get back...

 

[Fishfur]

I know, the net is a wondrous source of confusion sometimes. Anyone can say anything and you have little way to verify it all.

But for what it's worth, because fancy goldfish haven't really got a stomach as we think of one, they do better with frequent smaller meals. Most of them are pigs, and eat too much if allowed to. But their gut is meant to function best when they graze. They can't graze in the tank, so the best you can approximate it with is more frequent meals.

I don't suggest you stay home just to feed fish, but a pinch in the morning, one sometime in the afternoon, one before bed, that should help, I hope. Peas are used often to manage constipation and they work, so if that happens, go with peas.

Growths on the fins can, I only say can, be related to water quality problems, as can split fins sometimes. It can be opportunistic organisms that are always in tank water, taking advantage of some weakness, whatever it is.

I often suspect inbreeding, because it is rampant among commercially bred fishes of all kinds, and the effects are not always readily visible defects.

It can be so frustrating to have a problem continually recur and not be able to manage it. But clean water, well cycled filter, enough but not too much food, these things are manageable, and sometimes they are all you can do.

I quickly gave up using any commercial filter inserts and always use my own media in any filter. Even the smallest of the small will fit a bit of sponge if nothing else, and that way I always know what's in them. I don't think carbon is good to use all the time, but it is useful if there are contaminants in the water it can adsorb, which is what it does. But it does get 'full' and recharging it is not practical for most, though it is possible if you have access to the right equipment.

I don't think filters become 'infected' as such, unless you have ick or some other parasite or an outbreak of something like columnaris or neon tetra disease, which are due to known organisms. Then I think sanitizing a filter might be helpful. The biofilm that accumulates on all surfaces exposed to the water is not, to my knowledge, harmful to any fish. Many fish need it, and do very poorly without it. I've never seen any thick buildup inside my filters, only the guck at the bottom where the water first enters, which is soon squeezed out when I do the sponges.

I have never kept discus, so I really can't comment on the remarks about how they are kept, but the only thing I get that infests my filters has been algae, and now not much, thanks to the foil. I did use mylar film, but it tears too easily and then the algae reappears.

But there many organisms in tank water at all times that don't cause issues about 99% of the time, unless there is a weakness for them to exploit. Hence the term opportunistic infections. One good article I read recently pointed to ammonia as the number one reason for 'mystery' deaths and disease in most fish, because many tanks have chronic low levels that do damage over time, either due to lack of maintenance or improper maintenance. But I doubt that's your problem, you've been taking good care of the tank. Sometimes we just don't get answers.

Wish you luck. I have an elderly cat that has become anorexic after having a stroke and she makes me crazy when she refuses to eat. I have been tearing my hair out worrying over her.. I truly understand how frustrating this kind of chronic problem can be.

 

[Algebra309]

That disease is called bloat, by the way. That cottony looking white stuff is the result of a fungal infection. It's a pretty easy fix with Melafix. I've had it in my tank a couple of times. Fish don't really survive from it unless treated early, but you need to treat the entire tank to get rid of the disease.

 

[Fishfur]

Where was bloat mentioned ?

 

[Algebra309]

And something else you should know, you really shouldn't be changing out the water that much. I know it would seem like a great way to keep a tank clean, but that much new water can really stress out fish. You should have water changes about every 2 weeks- 25%. If you're not comfortable with that, you can do it every week, but that's maximum. Just let the biological filter do its job and relax.

 

[Algebra309]

Where was bloat mentioned ?

He explained a disease that he had in his first post. Sorry, I didn't really look at anything else but the first few post.

 

[Fishfur]

Right.. sorry, I did read that, but it got a bit lost along the way. But bloat does not usually result in an ulcer.. it usually just kills the fish unless it's constipation that can be sorted soon.

But the extra water changes may be a bit of overkill. They do need clean water, but I'd go with once a week changes. I will try and find out if goldfish can tolerate salt. I don't know, but it is a very reliable treatment for many things that ail fish, if they can take it.

I'll see what I can learn elsewhere and come back tomorrow.

 

[Algebra309]

Right.. sorry, I did read that, but it got a bit lost along the way. But bloat does not usually result in an ulcer.. it usually just kills the fish unless it's constipation that can be sorted soon.

But the extra water changes may be a bit of overkill. They do need clean water, but I'd go with once a week changes. I will try and find out if goldfish can tolerate salt. I don't know, but it is a very reliable treatment for many things that ail fish, if they can take it.

I'll see what I can learn elsewhere and come back tomorrow.

Oh, well, the past times I've had bloat it usually comes with a huge bloated stomach and fungal infection with result in that white cottony growth, so I just sort of assumed. I could be wrong though.

 

[Coursair]

You can get veggie clips. At the store we fed organic rinsed Romaine Lettuce , Zucchini ( raw or blanched) , Shelled thawed green peas, etc...
An Orange slice is good as well, just messy. Feed near water change day.

You can buy Anacharis. Plant it or float it, they'll eat it. You can often get free Duckweed, its pretty and they'll eat it.

Soak flakes before feeding. Sinking pellets only.

More veggies and greens and less processed food will help digestion. You are feeding good food though. Omega One Algae wafers are good also.

 

[Fishfur]

The fungal infection is usually secondary, or opportunistic. The bloated fish is sick and the organisms for fungal and bacterial infections are always in the water, and will take advantage of any weakness, illness or injury.

It is why they are called opportunistic infections.. they take any opportunity they find, but otherwise do no harm. Healthy fish can fight them off and don't get infected.

Just like us really. If you are already sick or injured, you are much more likely to catch something else because your immune system is already under stress and can't fight back as it should.