Ich - temperature, light, and feeding

[nsx]

So, it finally happened. One of the Red Platies I brought home last week had Ich. He's got 4 spots now, but it doesn't seem like the other fish are affected yet.

I'd prefer to do this without chemicals. Since I have cories, I'm not going to use salt, and have opted for the high temperature treatment. I'm slowly turning the temperature up to 88 degrees.

A few questions:

- Is 88 degrees overkill? Will it be just fine with 87?
- Does the light have to be off during this time, or can I follow the normal cycle?
- Feeding and water changes as normal ok?
- Can my fish handle 88 degrees for 2 weeks? I've got:

Tiger Barbs
Albino Tiger Barbs
Red Platies
Albino Cories
Panda Cories
Siamese Algae Eaters

So far, all seems ok. The fish (including the sick Platy) still swim normally, no scratching or flashing, still eat like pigs, and no other signs of stress. Let's hope this goes smoothly.

 

[tkos]

Raising the temp will only speed up the life cycle of the ich. You need to add something else to actually kill it off. Salt and meds are the only way. 86 F is generally recommended.

Look in the articles section for Allivymar's ich artcile. It will have all the info you need.

 

[Menagerie]

ACK WAIT!!
I don't believe cories like warm temps--QT the ill fish and research the needs of the other fish! I know cories are NOT fond of salt.

 

[Allivymar]

The corys will do fine with the temps, but some cory species do NOT do well with salt, and I just don't know which they are, so I recommend none.

 

[nsx]

Raising the temp will only speed up the life cycle of the ich. You need to add something else to actually kill it off. Salt and meds are the only way. 86 F is generally recommended.

Look in the articles section for Allivymar's ich artcile. It will have all the info you need.

I got the idea for raising the temperature from Allivymar's excellent article. It says that temps above 86 degrees alone will kill Ich. I'm raising mine to 88 just to be sure. The article also says Cories do not like salt, so I'm going to try without salt first and see what happens.

 

[nsx]

So, checked on the tank this morning, and it looks like still only the single Red Platy is affected. It doesn't look like she's gotten any worse, still only 4 spots, and she is acting totally normal. The other fish look and act normal as well.

So, back to the original question, can the lighting, feeding, and water changing regimen stay the same, or should it be changed during treatment?

Also, am I turning up the temperature too fast?

Normal: 77.9
upon discovery of ich: 78.8
6 hours later: 80.6
12 hours later: 81.5

Currently at 81.5, and am planning to turn it up about 1 degree
every 6 hours.

 

[Allivymar]

No changes necessary. The only change is if you do the salt tx as well; then you need to make sure the salt levels remain the same. You might want to up the water changes just to get rid of any parasites in the water column or the substrate, but thats only an option.

1 degree every 6 hours should be fine.

 

[TankGirl]

High temp therapy will treat ich just fine by itself, but either keep the water level lower so there is splashing and increased surface agitation (high temps lower the oxygen concentration in the water) or put in a bubble wand or something to make surface agitation.

The cory cats do not like high temps, preferring about 79 to a high end of 82, but you might be able to do it. You might PM Guppyman about whether or not the cories can hack it. Since cories do not do well with the salt or the other common ich medications available, it is a toss-up.

 

[nsx]

Thanks everyone for your input! As the temperature gets higher, I plan to turn on the dormant airstone. I turned it off a few weeks ago when I added some plants.

With the Cories, as Tankgirl mentioned, it's a toss-up, but I figure it's best to try first without any chemicals or other additives.

Hoping for the best!

Moral of the story, get that empty tank/filter in the corner up and running as a QT Tank for new arrivals. :?

 

[nsx]

ACK WAIT!!
I don't believe cories like warm temps--QT the ill fish and research the needs of the other fish! I know cories are NOT fond of salt.

I thought once you have ich, you have to treat the entire tank, not just QT the sick fish, as once it's there, it's in the whole tank. Is this not correct?

 

[TankGirl]

This is pretty much the case, but you have to take into account the fish that will not survive the treatment. The point of treating for disease is to save the fish, so if you lose some of your fish with the therapy you are not ahead of the game. If the cories are not so far showing signs of infection, then get them out of there and treat the tank with the big guns, in the interest of saving as many fish as possible. It is oxymoronic, more than a little ironic, and a difficult decision, so your question is a valid one without a neat and tidy answer.

 

[Christmasfish]

I think she meant get the symptomatic fish treateed first and take portion of time finding the right method before treating the ones simply exposed

 

[Menagerie]

It depends on whom you talk to. I started a thread in General Discussion about Ich for the Sake of Ich.
For the most part, it is well advised to treat everyone, but I have pulled a sick fish in the past and had no other fish come down with it. Since you are not treating with meds, it should be safe enough. I do not like treating fish that are not showing illness, or acting ill. Basically, I was worried about your cories. Good luck with the treatment and keep an eye on the little guys!

I think she meant get the symptomatic fish treateed first and take portion of time finding the right method before treating the ones simply exposed

YES!!

 

[nsx]

Ok, so at lunch hour today, I made a trip home, and hastily set up the empty tank that I had. It's now a QT tank to keep the Cories while the main tank is going through the high temperature treatment. Those buggers are fast and hard to catch!

Luckily, I had bought a new filter for the main tank 2 1/2 weeks ago, but had kept the old filter running all this time until the new filter could be seeded with beneficial bacteria. The old filter is now on the Cory QT tank. Let's hope that neither tank starts cycling, but I'll be monitoring both tanks for ammonia and nitrite spikes.

Do I need to add anything to the QT tank? There is nothing in there now but the Cories and the old filter. No substrate or decorations. I know the Pandas will probably miss their cave. I shouldn't have given my old heater away, but for the time being, it should be ok, because the ambient temperature in the room will keep the unheated tank temperature around
78.8 degrees.

The main tank's temperature is now at 82.4 degrees.

As for the sick Red Platy, it looks like the temperature is having an effect now, as 2 out of the 4 ich spots have dropped off. The two on the tail are still there, and one of the other Red Platies looks like she's starting to develop a spot on her tail. All fish are still acting normally, however.

 

[TankGirl]

Sounds like a great way to handle it, and I am glad you had an extra tank for this purpose. The cories will technically be fine without anything in the tank, but I think it is a good idea to give them some kind of cover, because if they feel stressed that can cause them to come down with .....um, I won't go there! You don't need any substrate but see if you can find something for them to hide in.

 

[nsx]

Looks like things are moving along. Main tank temperature now is 86 degrees, and by the same time tomorrow, I'll be at my target temperature of 87.8 degrees. All the ich spots have dropped off the Red Platy, but unfortunately, she, and 2 of the other Red Platies are starting to show signs of fin rot. Since the QT tank has the Cories right now, I can't do anything for this until the ich treatment is finished. Hopefully the fin rot won't get any worse. Even with the minor fin rot, the Red Platies are still acting normal. All of the other fish are still looking and acting normal as well, although the Tiger Barbs are a bit more aggressive than usual today.

As if that wasn't enough, the Cory QT tank had a minor ammonia spike yesterday, and is going through a nitrite spike right now. The ammonia is back to 0 today, so it looks like a mini-cycle is taking place. I'll keep the nitrite in check with daily water changes until the mini-cycle completes. Let's hope it doesn't take too long. The Cories are doing fine though, and not showing any signs of stress or ich. I took their cave from the main tank, washed it off, and let it dry completely before putting it in the QT tank. Hopefully that was enough to prevent bringing any ich over. The main tank's ammonia and nitrite have thankfully held steady at 0.

Thanks again everyone for your input!

 

[Menagerie]

nsx--How are your fish doing???

 

[nsx]

nsx--How are your fish doing???

Hi Menagerie, thanks for asking.

The temperature has been at 87.8 degrees since Friday in the main tank, and I plan to keep it there for another 1 1/2 weeks. So far, no other fish except for the single Red Platy that had the 4 spots have shown any symptoms of ich, so I guess I caught it fast enough before any of the others could be infected. All the spots have since dropped off the single Red Platy, and hopefully the temperature is doing it's thing. The Cories are doing fine in QT at 78.8 degrees, with no symptoms of ich. The Nitrite spike in the QT tank went away after 1 day, and all water parameters are normal.

What is beginning to worry me, however, is that 3 out of the 4 Red Platies have fin rot that seems to be getting worse. Not sure if this is due to stress from the temperature or what. 2 out of the 4 also seem to have some kind of white "blotch" on them, although it doesn't look like fungus or cotton growth. 1 out of the 4 will sometimes hover with clamped fins for a few minutes, but then return to normal. Other than what was mentioned above, all the Red Platies swim and eat normally. Melafix is arriving tonight (thankfully sooner than I originally expected), so I'm going to dose the main tank and see what happens. I was hoping I could wait until the ich treatment was completed, so I could treat the Red Platies in QT, but the fin rot has me concerned enough that I will just dose the main tank with Melafix. If that's not effective, 10g and smaller tanks are quite inexpensive here, so I will probably consider investing in another QT tank and treat with chemical based medication. Luckily, I have a 3rd filter I can use for this purpose. I started running it on the main tank recently to get it seeded with beneficial bacteria.

None of the other fish are showing any symptoms of any kind.

I didn't realize what efficient cleaners the Cories are until keeping them in a no-substrate tank. When I feed them, the food sinks to the bottom looks quite messy. When I look at the tank say, 1/2 hour later, it's spotless again.

 

[TankGirl]

Be sure you have adequate aeration in your tank with the high temps. This lowers the O2 available to the fish, so you need to let the water level drop and the filter return splash a bit, and/or get a bubble wand or something to create some surface agitation.

 

[nsx]

Be sure you have adequate aeration in your tank with the high temps. This lowers the O2 available to the fish, so you need to let the water level drop and the filter return splash a bit, and/or get a bubble wand or something to create some surface agitation.

Yup, I've turned my filter flow to full, and have lowered the water level about 1/2 inch. For the first couple days of 86+ temperatures, I also turned on my dormant airstone, but it seemed like overkill, and so far, the fish seem ok without it being on.