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Old 04-11-2013, 12:27 PM   #1
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Loach may have ich

I introduced 4 khuli loaches into my main tank 5 days ago. I QT them for two weeks and they looked so healthy and I was tired of hearing that crappy filter. I gave them a good look over and then put them in my main tank. Yesterday I saw one laying on the back of my diy CO2 diffuser. He looked like he had all kinds of white dots on him. I reached over to get the net and by the time I turned around he was gone. I looked for him but couldn't find any of the loaches. I have sand substrate and I think they must have buried themselves to get away from me. I haven't been able to find them since I put them in the tank.
He was laying beside a mass of nerite snail eggs so I am hoping he was just covered in the eggs. I checked my fish this morning and saw one of the loaches in the Christmas moss. I netted him and he looked fine. None of my other fish seem to have spots. The Dalmation Molly has a couple of suspicious dots though. Couldn't really get her to hold still to see if it was her natural white dots or something else. I can usually catch her but I had hand surgery last week and can't get both hands in the tank to catch her and then hold her still while I check her out. Should I remove my nerites and add salt, plus raise the temp as a precaution. I am having a cyno outbreak too. I have erythromycin ordered for it. Please not attacks. I have tried everything I found on the internet and the cyno just keeps growing.

I am going to order another filter to keep on hand for QT so I won't be temped to shorten the QT process because of a load filter.

I have a new tank vac coming today or tomorrow. I plan on giving my tank a thorough cleaning and do a massive water change. My old vac was crappy and wasn't getting all the gunk out. My water tests are PH 6.8, ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 20.
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Old 04-11-2013, 12:49 PM   #2
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Be careful dont do too much at once, you could put stress on your fish
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Old 04-11-2013, 02:11 PM   #3
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Okay, I found all four of my loaches. They where hiding in the Christmas Moss "Tree" that I made. The are at the top of the tank, about an inch under water. No spots on any of them but three of them look pale. Like their color is fading. The fourth one looks fine. What could be causing them to look like that. My PH keeps dropping because of CO2. It has gotten as low as 6. I have started testing it several times a day and adding a pinch of baking soda to bring it up. I have shells that I have crushed in the tank to buffer it. I have been looking for crushed coral but l have only been able to buy it online and at $30 a bag plus shipping I just can't afford it right now. I heard that cuttlefish bone can be used. Is that right? I can get one of those for $1.
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Old 04-11-2013, 07:36 PM   #4
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What is your KH?
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:19 PM   #5
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I don't have a KH test. I just got my CO2 indicator today. It is still blue. All of the loaches but one has died. The one left looks okay. I am keeping my fingers crossed that it lives. My tank has only been up for three months. I had a ten gallon that was cycled and I used the filter material from it to start this one. I did a fish less cycle then transferred my existing fish.

I took my tank apart and drained just over half the water. I got my new vacuum today. I siphoned out all the cyno I could and a lot of hidden waste. I found several gas pockets on the back side of the tank in places that where hard to get to. While I was moving everything, I found a baby shrimp. It was so tiny. My female ghost shrimp are often berried but I just assumed none would make it. I was very surprised to see that little fellow. So small. My Molly is about to give birth right now. I have two fry from her previous batch. It seems everything is doing fine but the khuli loaches. Even my nerites keep laying eggs. My plants are growing like crazy.

Should I order a KH test kit? I was told by another member that if I got the CO2 indicator I wouldn't need any more test kits than what came with my API Master Test kit.
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Old 04-11-2013, 09:46 PM   #6
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Thats true. That is to messure your co2, whats your BPS?
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:16 AM   #7
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Around 3 bpm as far as I can tell. It is a diy setup. Photo below. I have the line fed directly into an extra power head from an underground filter. The power head pulls the CO2 in a direct stream. I didn't set up a bubble counter. I know I should. Could the CO2 have killed the loaches? One of them is still going strong. I don't know if I should try to get some more or return the other one. I know they like to be in schools.
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:21 AM   #8
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Trying to peice everything together, you said your ph was low and you talked about co2. Did you mean 3 bubbles per second? Or 3 bubbles per minute. If its the 3 bubbles per minute. That will not change your ph. Maybe a .1
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Old 04-12-2013, 01:51 PM   #9
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This is just a guess but I would say 3 bubbles per minute. I am going to set up a bubble counter tonight. The CO2 indicator is dark green which according to the color chart means the right amount of CO2. I have the line attached to a diverter valve that allows me to slow down the flow. I usually shut it off at night and the PH rises back up to 7.2. During the day, with the flow continuous, that is when the PH will get so low. I can tell when it is because my fish start acting erratic and falling on their sides. I have just been adding baking soda and getting it back up. The fish are fine then. It doesn't do it every day but I am away a lot and I am afraid it will do it one day when I am gone and the fish will die. All the loaches but one died. The one left looks fine. Its' color is good and it is active when the lights where off. The ones that died had red gills that looked like blood veins showing through and tjey were staying at the top of the water.

I am not too worried about the CO2 right now. I will keep working until that is lined out. I really would like to figure out why the loaches died. I would like to get more but not until I get a better QT filter and figure out why the others died.

I wonder if them being bottom feeders, they died from cyno bacteria poisoning or maybe low PH? My nitrates jumped to 80 too for a few hours. It was fine in the morning then, later in the day, the fish started acting funny. I tested the water again and the nitrate had jumped way up. It went from 20 to 80 in a few hours with no rise in ammonia or nitrite. I didn't know that was possible. My test solutions are all new. Except for the PH one. I have been replacing the individual tests as they run out. I test a lot because I am paranoid.
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Old 04-12-2013, 09:58 PM   #10
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This is my suggestion. The indicator is great to see if you have enough co2. To my understanding how that works correct me if i am wrong. The solution in there is constant it never changes. So it would be at 4 kh and what ever the ph is. This does not messure your ph or kh of the water, just the amount of co2 being exchanged from the water to air and air to water. You have said your ph is around 7.2 with no co2 but would drop low as 6 with co2. That tells me two things, you are either putting too much co2 in the water or you have very low kh and ph changes very easy.
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Old 04-13-2013, 12:38 PM   #11
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Our water supply used to dump loads of lime into our water. So much that if you boiled it you got a whiter powder. My Ph was around 7.6 then and no problem. They have for some reason stopped adding large quantities of it. Our faucet water is better but the my PH won't stay up with the CO2. I have added crushed and whole seashells and eggs shells from local raised chickens. When I was looking for a solution I was told that coral or cuttlefish bone would help. Things not easy to locate where I live. After more research I discovered that egg shells had a lot in common with coral. Lots of calcium and a few trace elements. My seashells are dissolving. They were very old shells I collected from local pond (freshwater clams) and the beach. So I would think that my water now has plenty of calcium. What else should I do for it? It will be a couple of weeks before I can order a KH test kit. I should have ordered it sooner I guess. Everything in my aquarium is growing. My christmas moss has tripled in size in two months.

I have one khuli loach left. It looks fine
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