So I did about a 70% water change a few days ago, and dosed again with GC. Seems that there really isn't any improvement in the Keyholes. Still some small black spots, scratching, and white feces. Any other ideas of what I can try?
Looks like Black Spot. Treatment options?
- Thread starter Khazmachi
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jlk
Aquarium Advice Addict
I am sorry to hear there has not been much improvement. Unfortunately, your remaining options are pretty harsh. You can try either Clout or copper or dimilin. They will kill any inverts and possibly affect plants. They may also affect fish, especially scaleless or sensitive ones. These meds are toxic and are difficult to remove from a tank once added so use with caution. Copper should only be used in conjunction with a copper testing mean to monitor levels.
One other less harsh option (if you don't have inverts, scaleless fish or plants) that's worth a shot before pulling out the big guns is increasing the salinity very gradually to .3-.5% and maintaining this for along with frequent big wcs for 1-3 weeks. You can also try (if you haven't already) a product that is uses formalin/malachite green or methylene blue as the main ingredient (typically found in ich meds). Caution with these as they may affect good bacteria. Just figured I would throw that out there as well because I really am not an advocate of using Clout (DTHP) or copper or dimilin unless every other avenue has been exhausted. Good luck!
One other less harsh option (if you don't have inverts, scaleless fish or plants) that's worth a shot before pulling out the big guns is increasing the salinity very gradually to .3-.5% and maintaining this for along with frequent big wcs for 1-3 weeks. You can also try (if you haven't already) a product that is uses formalin/malachite green or methylene blue as the main ingredient (typically found in ich meds). Caution with these as they may affect good bacteria. Just figured I would throw that out there as well because I really am not an advocate of using Clout (DTHP) or copper or dimilin unless every other avenue has been exhausted. Good luck!
The only meds I have tried is the General Cure. I'll look into those other medications that are not as extreme first. If that doesn't' work I'll try the copper. I don't' have any scaleless fish, and I won't be heart broken if I lose my snails, but I don't like the idea of putting stuff in that I can't remove so that'll be a last resort. I can stop by the LFS on my way to work and see what they carry.
Still battling this illness. I picked up some API Super Ick Cure (active ingredients per packet: 3.6mg malachite green and 60mg Nitrofurazone) at the LFS. I'm doing a large water change then I will dose after. I picked up two packages so I could have at least two doses. I just plan on using as directed on the package. One dose, wait 48hrs, second dose, wait 48hrs, then water change and add carbon to remove it. Does that sound like a good plan?
jlk
Aquarium Advice Addict
Ok, it's MG and an antibiotic. Let's see how things look after following the recommended dosing schedule and go from there! Keep us posted!
Fishfur
Aquarium Advice Addict
Sorry to see you are still having problems but this has been a very educational thread for me. Interested to see how it turns out, hopefully to the good.
Thanks Fishfur. Its been a bit frustrating, but I glad to have it all out where others can learn from it.
I've gone through the recommended dosing schedule for the API super ick cure. It took one day longer because I've had a crazy busy week. And it looks like it didn't do much more than color my water green. The two of the keyholes have more black marks than ever. The other one doesn't have much for black spots, but hasn't eaten in a while, and is starting to look malnourished. The Severum had some white stuff appear on its fins, but that only lasted a couple days and is now gone. The other fish have a black spot here or there, but are still looking very healthy on the whole.
I'm doing another large water change (about 70%) and will add carbon to my canister to remove the rest of the MG. I'll observe them for a couple days before trying any other medication. I've been reading articles on fish disease to see if I can find any clues that might help me identify the problem correctly. I took a magnifying glass to them to make sure I wasn't missing anything (like lice) but it just looked like larger black spots. I'm thinking I might have to try Coppersafe. I read it can be nasty stuff, but I don't think any of my fish are sensitive to it. I have Keyholes, Angels, a Severum, and Lemon tetras. My snails will be toast, but I'm not too attached to those. They just hitched hiked in on plants I picked up about 5 years ago.
I guess I haven't tried salt yet either. Should I try salt before resorting to Coppersafe?
I'm doing another large water change (about 70%) and will add carbon to my canister to remove the rest of the MG. I'll observe them for a couple days before trying any other medication. I've been reading articles on fish disease to see if I can find any clues that might help me identify the problem correctly. I took a magnifying glass to them to make sure I wasn't missing anything (like lice) but it just looked like larger black spots. I'm thinking I might have to try Coppersafe. I read it can be nasty stuff, but I don't think any of my fish are sensitive to it. I have Keyholes, Angels, a Severum, and Lemon tetras. My snails will be toast, but I'm not too attached to those. They just hitched hiked in on plants I picked up about 5 years ago.
I guess I haven't tried salt yet either. Should I try salt before resorting to Coppersafe?
jlk
Aquarium Advice Addict
I wish I had a definitive answer here for you! It sounds like the MG had zero effect or may have even made things a bit worse. If you opt for copper, try Seachems Cupramine over copper safe- its more stabilized form of copper and hopefully should be a bit more forgiving. I am not sure salt will have any effect at this point as what your dealing with seems to be unaffected by actual meds. Good luck!
Fishlover3578
Aquarium Advice FINatic
Super ick is workin for my dad and another lady I suggested it to
I found Cupramine a couple of days ago. Definitely looks like a better option than Copper safe after reading the labels, so thank you very much for that suggestion. I went ahead and dosed as instructed by the label. I read it close to make sure I got it right, and its a good thing because the amount they list is for saltwater. They note to do half the dosage for freshwater. It said 16 drops per 10.5 us gallons. So I did 8 per 10.5 and it came to about 57 drops. Then it instructs a second dosage after 48 hours so I will be doing that today when I get home from work. I got home late last night so I didn't get to really see how the fish were looking because the light had been off for a few hours already.
The instructions on the Cupramine bottle say to keep a specific concentration for two weeks following that second dosage. I assume I should continue with weekly water changes and replace only the amount of Cupramine removed each water change? I have to pick up the copper test kit still to make sure I get the concentration correct. I'll prob get a chance to do that tomorrow. Are weekly water changes enough, or do I need to do them more often? Also any other tips are greatly appreciated.
Thanks for sticking with me through this.
jlk
Aquarium Advice Addict
Basically follow the directions as suggested. Keep an eye on parameters and do wcs as needed replacing only the removed copper to maintain a steady level. Let us know how everyone is doing when you are able to observe them and their behavior for bit!
Well its been about 2 weeks since I started using the Cupramine and things are looking good. I bought the Seachem copper test to keep an eye on the levels. It was easy to use, but didn't find it real easy to compare the sample to the color chart. It always seemed to be a bit on the less concentrated side even though I ended up adding more drops than it initially instructed. I made sure to remove all the carbon, but it seemed to start to slowly disappear over time anyway. It didn't even totally kill off the snails. I still saw one in there yesterday...
Anyway the fish are looking much better. I haven't seen any scratching, and all are eating. One of the keyholes is still acting kinda shy, and only eats a little, but it is an improvement for sure. I'm going to keep an eye on things for a little bit longer, but if everything continues as it is right now I'll once again have a heathy fish tank very soon!
Anyway the fish are looking much better. I haven't seen any scratching, and all are eating. One of the keyholes is still acting kinda shy, and only eats a little, but it is an improvement for sure. I'm going to keep an eye on things for a little bit longer, but if everything continues as it is right now I'll once again have a heathy fish tank very soon!
jlk
Aquarium Advice Addict
That's great news!!! Glad to hear you are seeing steady improvement and something is finally helping! 
