My betta and his fin rot

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Xr3

Aquarium Advice Apprentice
Joined
Dec 29, 2016
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I currently have a dragon scale betta male that I've had for roughly a month now. about a week or so I noticed he was sticking around the filter and hiding a lot more than usual, I kept a close eye on him and started to notice his fins were rotting, I didn't know what this was at first as this is my first betta and I'm really new to this hobby. I have added salt to the water and I'm not sure what else to do, I can't get any medicine for about another week and it seems pretty far advanced. I have been doing water changes on the tank about once every two days and before I noticed something was up I was doing it about once every one to two weeks. his tank is 2.5 gallons with a filter and heater for anyone wondering.
 
Make sure the filter is not overpowered and isn't causing more stress. Seachem paraguard, stress guard, and kanaplex would be what I recommend purchasing to have on hand. Until then change most/all the water daily with the addition of aquarium salt
 
Make sure the filter is not overpowered and isn't causing more stress. Seachem paraguard, stress guard, and kanaplex would be what I recommend purchasing to have on hand. Until then change most/all the water daily with the addition of aquarium salt



I just removed the filter and I'm doing a 100% water change Daily along with adding 3tsp of salt with the 2.5g water. Any other ideas?
 
There's not too much you can do, my fish died this morning from fin rot. Watch for other things as well, make sure he is eating. It is fairly common for fish with fin rot to develop cotton wool (white tufts on fins).
 
I just removed the filter and I'm doing a 100% water change Daily along with adding 3tsp of salt with the 2.5g water. Any other ideas?

First let's figure out what stage on fin rot he's at: how much of his fin has he so far lost: 1/3, 1/2, almost completely, or does it look to actually have reached and damaged his actual tail? Can you attach a photo?

Also taking extreme bunnies comment into account. Does the fin rot you describe end in a black edge or are there visible white pathes( look like little fluffs of cotton). The first description is almost certainly a bacterial infection while anything resembling white cotton fluffs could possibly be fungus or possible that both are present. I have successfully treated fish with both and a combination of the two. There's no guarantee but don't lose hope yet.
 
First let's figure out what stage on fin rot he's at: how much of his fin has he so far lost: 1/3, 1/2, almost completely, or does it look to actually have reached and damaged his actual tail? Can you attach a photo?



Image1483064774.228774.jpghere is lotus
 
This is actually not as severe as I thought. His fins are clamped, which you should always be on the lookout for as this is generally the first warning they give that something is amiss. However the actual "fin rot" does not look severe so there is every reason to be hopeful. Here's what I would recommend:

-for now remove all the gravel from his tank. Leaving it in will only serve as more places for waste to accumulate and thus foul the water
-continue with the daily, even as much as twice daily, water changes. This may be a silly question but you are using some sort of tap water conditioner yes? Assuming you are, also make sure that the replacement water is a match for the water you're replacing. It's doesn't have to be an exact match but the closer you can get to it the better. For example I keep my betta tanks at 78°. i fill a one gallon jug with tap water. I then pour out 2 1/2 cup into a microwave save container and microwave that for 1 min 30 sec. I then add that back into my one gallon jug and shake which gives me the temperature of 78° that I'm looking for. Your microwave wattage and starting temp tap water may be different so you might need to experiment to get the right temp for you
-continue adding the salt. Salt a) will help to fight and heal the infection b) makes it easier for fish to absorb oxygen through their gills.

When you can make it the fish store the first thing I would buy is Seachem's Paraguard. This is the first thing I reach for when I'm unsure of what I'm treating as it's gentle and will treat a broad range of illnesses.

Let me know if you have any questions
 
This is actually not as severe as I thought. His fins are clamped, which you should always be on the lookout for as this is generally the first warning they give that something is amiss. However the actual "fin rot" does not look severe so there is every reason to be hopeful. Here's what I would recommend:



-for now remove all the gravel from his tank. Leaving it in will only serve as more places for waste to accumulate and thus foul the water

-continue with the daily, even as much as twice daily, water changes. This may be a silly question but you are using some sort of tap water conditioner yes? Assuming you are, also make sure that the replacement water is a match for the water you're replacing. It's doesn't have to be an exact match but the closer you can get to it the better. For example I keep my betta tanks at 78°. i fill a one gallon jug with tap water. I then pour out 2 1/2 cup into a microwave save container and microwave that for 1 min 30 sec. I then add that back into my one gallon jug and shake which gives me the temperature of 78° that I'm looking for. Your microwave wattage and starting temp tap water may be different so you might need to experiment to get the right temp for you

-continue adding the salt. Salt a) will help to fight and heal the infection b) makes it easier for fish to absorb oxygen through their gills.



When you can make it the fish store the first thing I would buy is Seachem's Paraguard. This is the first thing I reach for when I'm unsure of what I'm treating as it's gentle and will treat a broad range of illnesses.



Let me know if you have any questions



Thank you so much! I've been panicking for a while now as I live two and a half hours away from the nearest pet store.. thanks for all the info I'm going to start that asap! I have a 37g tank that's been cycling about 8 days would adding him into that later on help? If so how soon?
 
I understand what it's like to be limited to what you have available. Amazom prime is my best friend.

As to your question about moving him to 37 gallon: my advise would be against. Though there are many who might disagree with me I'll try to give my reasoning here:
1) Bettas really are accustomed to small spaces. While I don't advocate putting them in a vase or anything like that placing them in large volume tanks can actually stress them out, especially if the tank contains other live stock. This is because they will spend a lot time and energy trying to "patrol" a larger territory and their large flowing fins just don't accommodate that well
2) the water flow that will be necessary to maintain that size tank will be a greater flow rate than they prefer.
 
I understand what it's like to be limited to what you have available. Amazom prime is my best friend.



As to your question about moving him to 37 gallon: my advise would be against. Though there are many who might disagree with me I'll try to give my reasoning here:

1) Bettas really are accustomed to small spaces. While I don't advocate putting them in a vase or anything like that placing them in large volume tanks can actually stress them out, especially if the tank contains other live stock. This is because they will spend a lot time and energy trying to "patrol" a larger territory and their large flowing fins just don't accommodate that well

2) the water flow that will be necessary to maintain that size tank will be a greater flow rate than they prefer.



Alright sounds good, I'm looking to stock the tank in a week or two when the cycle is complete any ideas?
 
Since you mentioned it and because I've found it to be helpful I'm going to paste a copy of the fishless cycle instructions written by Diana on the plantedtank forum. You can do a search with her member name on that forum and read all the threads she's posted or commented on. She is a pro among pros

Here is the fishless cycle.

You can add the exact species of bacteria you are trying to grow and this makes the fishless cycle go faster. Look of Nitrospiros species of bacteria. All other products have the wrong species. Do not waste your money.

The fishless cycle as posted here will raise a large enough colony of bacteria to FULLY stock an African Rift Lake tank. These are traditionally overstocked to address some of the aggression issues. So when your fishless cycle is complete go ahead and stock! To add less than a full load is to allow the bacteria to die off.

Fishless Cycle
You too can boast that "No fish were harmed in the cycling of your new tank"
Cycling a tank means to grow the beneficial bacteria that will help to decompose the fish waste (especially ammonia). These bacteria need ammonia to grow. There are 3 sources of ammonia that work to do this. One is fish. Unfortunately, the process exposes the fish to ammonia, which burns their gills, and nitrite, which makes their blood unable to carry oxygen. This often kills the fish.

Another source is decomposing protein. You could cycle your tank by adding fish food or a dead fish or shellfish. You do not know how much beneficial bacteria you are growing, though.

The best source of ammonia is... Ammonia. In a bottle.

Using fish is a delicate balance of water changes to keep the toxins low (try not to hurt the fish) but keep feeding the bacteria. It can take 4 to 8 weeks to cycle a tank this way, and can cost the lives of several fish. When you are done you have grown a small bacteria population that still needs to be nurtured to increase its population. You cannot, at the end of a fish-in cycle, fully stock your tank.

The fishless/ammonia cycle takes as little as 3 weeks, and can be even faster, grows a BIG bacteria population, and does not harm fish in any way.

Both methods give you plenty of practice using your test kit.

How to cycle a tank the fishless way:

1) Make sure all equipment is working, fill with water that has all the stuff you will need for the fish you intend to keep. Dechlorinator, minerals for GH or KH adjustments, the proper salt mix, if you are creating a brackish or marine tank. These bacteria require a few minerals, so make sure the GH and KH is at least 3 German degrees of hardness. They grow best when the pH is in the 7s. Good water movement, fairly warm (mid to upper 70sF), no antibiotics or other toxins.

2) (Optional)Add some source of the bacteria. Used filter media from a cycled tank is best, gravel or some decorations or a few plants... even some water, though this is the poorest source of the beneficial bacteria.
Bacteria in a bottle can be a source of these bacteria, but make sure you are getting Nitrospiros spp of bacteria. All other ‘bacteria in a bottle’ products have the wrong bacteria. (This step is optional. The proper bacteria will find the tank even if you make no effort to add them). Live plants may bring in these bacteria on their leaves and stems.

3) Add ammonia until the test reads 5 ppm. This is the non-sudsing, no surfactants, no-fragrance-added ammonia that is often found in a hardware store, discount stores, and sometimes in a grocery store. The concentration of ammonia may not be the same in all bottles. Try adding 5 drops per 10 gallons, then allowing the filter to circulate for about an hour, then test. If the reading isn't up to 5 ppm, add a few more drops and test again. (Example, if your test reads only 2 ppm, then add another 5 drops) Some ammonia is such a weak dilution you may need to add several ounces to get a reading.

4) Test for ammonia daily, and add enough to keep the reading at 5 ppm. You probably will not have to add much, if any, in the first few days, unless you added a good amount of bacteria to jump start the cycle.

5) Several days after you start, begin testing for nitrites. When the nitrites show up, reduce the amount of ammonia you add so the test shows 3ppm. (Add only half as much ammonia as you were adding in part 4) Add this reduced amount daily from now until the tank is cycled.
If the nitrites get too high (over 5 ppm), do a water change. The bacteria growth is slowed because of the high nitrites. Reducing the level of ammonia to 3 ppm should prevent the nitrite from getting over 5 ppm.

6) Continue testing, and adding ammonia daily. The nitrates will likely show up about 2 weeks after you started. Keep monitoring, and watch for 0 ppm ammonia, 0 ppm nitrite and rising nitrates.

7) Once the 0 ppm ammonia and nitrites shows up it may bounce around a little bit for a day or two. Be patient. Keep adding the ammonia; keep testing ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.
When it seems done you can challenge the system by adding more than a regular dose of ammonia, and the bacteria should be able to remove the ammonia and nitrite by the next day.
If you will not be adding fish right away continue to add the ammonia to keep the bacteria fed.

8) When you are ready to add the fish, do at least one water change, and it may take a couple of them, to reduce the nitrate to safe levels (as low as possible, certainly below 10 ppm) I have seen nitrate approaching 200 ppm by the end of this fishless cycle in a non-planted tank.

9) You can plant a tank that is being cycled this way at any point during the process. If you plant early, the plants will be well rooted, and better able to handle the disruption of the water change.
Yes, the plants will use some of the ammonia and the nitrates. They are part of the nitrogen handling system, part of the biofilter, they are working for you. Some plants do not like high ammonia, though. If a certain plant dies, remove it, and only replace it after the cycle is done.

10) The fishless cycle can also be used when you are still working out the details of lighting, plants and other things. If you change the filter, make sure you keep the old media for several weeks or a month. Most of the bacteria have been growing in this media (sponges, floss etc).
 
Since you mentioned it and because I've found it to be helpful I'm going to paste a copy of the fishless cycle instructions written by Diana on the plantedtank forum. You can do a search with her member name on that forum and read all the threads she's posted or commented on. She is a pro among pros



Here is the fishless cycle.



You can add the exact species of bacteria you are trying to grow and this makes the fishless cycle go faster. Look of Nitrospiros species of bacteria. All other products have the wrong species. Do not waste your money.



The fishless cycle as posted here will raise a large enough colony of bacteria to FULLY stock an African Rift Lake tank. These are traditionally overstocked to address some of the aggression issues. So when your fishless cycle is complete go ahead and stock! To add less than a full load is to allow the bacteria to die off.



Fishless Cycle

You too can boast that "No fish were harmed in the cycling of your new tank"

Cycling a tank means to grow the beneficial bacteria that will help to decompose the fish waste (especially ammonia). These bacteria need ammonia to grow. There are 3 sources of ammonia that work to do this. One is fish. Unfortunately, the process exposes the fish to ammonia, which burns their gills, and nitrite, which makes their blood unable to carry oxygen. This often kills the fish.



Another source is decomposing protein. You could cycle your tank by adding fish food or a dead fish or shellfish. You do not know how much beneficial bacteria you are growing, though.



The best source of ammonia is... Ammonia. In a bottle.



Using fish is a delicate balance of water changes to keep the toxins low (try not to hurt the fish) but keep feeding the bacteria. It can take 4 to 8 weeks to cycle a tank this way, and can cost the lives of several fish. When you are done you have grown a small bacteria population that still needs to be nurtured to increase its population. You cannot, at the end of a fish-in cycle, fully stock your tank.



The fishless/ammonia cycle takes as little as 3 weeks, and can be even faster, grows a BIG bacteria population, and does not harm fish in any way.



Both methods give you plenty of practice using your test kit.



How to cycle a tank the fishless way:



1) Make sure all equipment is working, fill with water that has all the stuff you will need for the fish you intend to keep. Dechlorinator, minerals for GH or KH adjustments, the proper salt mix, if you are creating a brackish or marine tank. These bacteria require a few minerals, so make sure the GH and KH is at least 3 German degrees of hardness. They grow best when the pH is in the 7s. Good water movement, fairly warm (mid to upper 70sF), no antibiotics or other toxins.



2) (Optional)Add some source of the bacteria. Used filter media from a cycled tank is best, gravel or some decorations or a few plants... even some water, though this is the poorest source of the beneficial bacteria.

Bacteria in a bottle can be a source of these bacteria, but make sure you are getting Nitrospiros spp of bacteria. All other ‘bacteria in a bottle’ products have the wrong bacteria. (This step is optional. The proper bacteria will find the tank even if you make no effort to add them). Live plants may bring in these bacteria on their leaves and stems.



3) Add ammonia until the test reads 5 ppm. This is the non-sudsing, no surfactants, no-fragrance-added ammonia that is often found in a hardware store, discount stores, and sometimes in a grocery store. The concentration of ammonia may not be the same in all bottles. Try adding 5 drops per 10 gallons, then allowing the filter to circulate for about an hour, then test. If the reading isn't up to 5 ppm, add a few more drops and test again. (Example, if your test reads only 2 ppm, then add another 5 drops) Some ammonia is such a weak dilution you may need to add several ounces to get a reading.



4) Test for ammonia daily, and add enough to keep the reading at 5 ppm. You probably will not have to add much, if any, in the first few days, unless you added a good amount of bacteria to jump start the cycle.



5) Several days after you start, begin testing for nitrites. When the nitrites show up, reduce the amount of ammonia you add so the test shows 3ppm. (Add only half as much ammonia as you were adding in part 4) Add this reduced amount daily from now until the tank is cycled.

If the nitrites get too high (over 5 ppm), do a water change. The bacteria growth is slowed because of the high nitrites. Reducing the level of ammonia to 3 ppm should prevent the nitrite from getting over 5 ppm.



6) Continue testing, and adding ammonia daily. The nitrates will likely show up about 2 weeks after you started. Keep monitoring, and watch for 0 ppm ammonia, 0 ppm nitrite and rising nitrates.



7) Once the 0 ppm ammonia and nitrites shows up it may bounce around a little bit for a day or two. Be patient. Keep adding the ammonia; keep testing ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

When it seems done you can challenge the system by adding more than a regular dose of ammonia, and the bacteria should be able to remove the ammonia and nitrite by the next day.

If you will not be adding fish right away continue to add the ammonia to keep the bacteria fed.



8) When you are ready to add the fish, do at least one water change, and it may take a couple of them, to reduce the nitrate to safe levels (as low as possible, certainly below 10 ppm) I have seen nitrate approaching 200 ppm by the end of this fishless cycle in a non-planted tank.



9) You can plant a tank that is being cycled this way at any point during the process. If you plant early, the plants will be well rooted, and better able to handle the disruption of the water change.

Yes, the plants will use some of the ammonia and the nitrates. They are part of the nitrogen handling system, part of the biofilter, they are working for you. Some plants do not like high ammonia, though. If a certain plant dies, remove it, and only replace it after the cycle is done.



10) The fishless cycle can also be used when you are still working out the details of lighting, plants and other things. If you change the filter, make sure you keep the old media for several weeks or a month. Most of the bacteria have been growing in this media (sponges, floss etc).



Thank you I have been currently cycling the tank with one guppy that I plan to move after the cycling to a smaller tank, what are some good fish that work well and fit in a 37 gallon tank? I'm still pretty new to the hobby and not sure on all the fish that would work.
 
Haha so I totally get your new to this, which is cute. I might suggest though that you take the one guppy out and instead go with Dian's method reason being is that right now you are building up a bacteria,l colony for only that one fish meaning any other fish you wish to add would have to be done one at a time to allow to allow the bacteria culculture to catch up. With fishless cycling the time is greatly reduced reducing and you can add everything all at once FULLY STOCKED SAME DAY

As far as stocking recommendations I'm probably not the best to ask as I specialize in nano fish. I would say however that either a very large school
Of cardinal tetra or porkchop rasbora would make a stunning tank
 
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