Shubunkin hanging nose up at surface

[Athena18]

Hey all,

I'm rather new to the fish care world. I found out I got some bad advice at the start and ended up with an overstocked goldfish tank. I had 3 koi, 2 shubunkin, 3 comets, 2 fantails, and a pleco all in a 45 gal tank. I've had the fish a week now and just today moved the 3 koi and 2 shubunkins to another 46 gal tank. I took the week to try to slowly match my two tanks pH levels. I moved them when I thought the tanks stabilized around 7.6.

The koi fish seem happy now and the one shubunkin seems ok. The other shubunkin is spending a lot of time nose up on the surface. It's not really gasping much though. Do you think it'll be ok? Should I be worried? It swims normal for a bit, then sits at the surface, then laid on the bottom and kinda repeats. It's fins look a bit ragged at the tips but ok, no redness or anything.

The original goldfish tank still tests high for ammonia, but is basically ok on nitrites and nitrates. I'm guessing that's because the bacteria cycle hasn't started yet. I added some Topfin ammonia remover and a bacteria supplement to that tank. I'm planning on doing a water change this weekend, but apparently my water is acidic, so I think I have to pretreat before adding/exchanging. Am I doing the right things?

I just need a sanity check as I've overloaded myself with info from the web. Thanks!

 

[jlk]

Welcome to AA!!!

Unfortunately, you have been offered some very poor advice on your fish. Koi simply are not suitable to home aquaria unless you have an indoor pond. Shubunkins and comets are also best suited to pond environments though can be kept in large tanks with lots of water changes.

Do you have a decent liquid test kit for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and ph? What do these numbers read?

The best solution in the interim until you decide what is the best solution for your present stocking situation is lots of water changes. Your fish's behavior indicates a very serious issue with water quality. Minimum 50% with temperature matched, properly conditioned water on a daily (or more frequent) basis. A good water conditioner such as Prime will help to limit the effects of toxins between water changes. Please read the link below and feel free to ask any questions!

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/artic...g-but-I-already-have-fish-What-now/Page2.html



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[Athena18]

Thanks jlk

I think it was more from stress/shock after moving them to the new tank that day. They're all acting more normal now and it's been 48 hours since I moved them. I know I'm a bit screwed with the tanks, but I have no good way to make myself a pond. I'm doing the best I can at the moment with what I have. Each of my shubs, koi, and comets are roughly 3" long so I think I'm ok on tank size for the moment. Though I'm new, so I'm not sure.

I do have liquid and strip test kits. The koi/shub tank has a pH of 7.6, the ammonia is safe thus far as are the nitrites and nitrates. Although I think the tank is just starting to cycle.

The goldfish tank's pH is too high at about 8.0, ammonia is too high at 4.0, nitrites are in the caution, and nitrates are safe. I'm adding ammonia remover and I cycled the water on Saturday. The fish all act fine in that tank, so I'm just crossing fingers and trying to slowly get it under control. It originally had all the goldfish including the kois.

The cichlids tank has a pH of 7.4, ammonia is too high at 4.0, nitrites are caution, and nitrates are safe. I'm adding ammonia remover no cycling the tank. The fish all act fine in that tank too.

I don't think there is much else that I can do at this point. I think I just keep testing and doing what I can until the tanks finish cycling. I'll look into building a koi pond for when they're bigger, but I think it gets too cold in NJ for that.

Any more suggestions or am I on track?

 

[jlk]

A ph of 8 is perfectly fine for fine goldfish and koi. Do not try and alter this. What is a major issue here is the level of your toxins. Did you read the article link I posted for you above? Right now and until your tanks are fully cycled, you need to do daily water changes. In the case of your tanks with a reading of 4+ppm of ammonia, you will need to do multiple water changes over the course of day until you are able to bring your toxin levels (ammonia and nitrite) below .25ppm. With a high ph, ammonia is very toxic. Water changes are going to be your best friend for the next few months and will continue to be your best friend in the future.

Expect the koi tank to spike very high in ammonia very shortly. With a proper diet and tons of water changes, these guys will be a foot (or larger) in less than six months. I would look on craigslist/classifieds for a stock tank (livestock water trough) to keep them in until you can properly house them. Yes, you can keep them in a pond in NJ (I reside in Philly) but it needs to be sufficiently large, minimum of 3-4ft deep and run with de-icers and circulation pumps in order to see them safely through our winters (though this is not a guarantee).

Is your pleco a common pleco (type sold in most chain stores)?

 

[Athena18]

Wow, only 6 months until they're a foot long?! How the heck can pet shops and aquariums even sell them to people at that kind of growth rate?

I did read the article, but I was hoping the ammonia removal and the fish's current behavior meant I was ok on water changes. Won't that frequent of water cycling mess up the bacteria growth from the tank cycling? Also are we talking just 10-15% or more like 25-50%? My tap water is very acidic, about a 5.0, so I have to be careful about my water changes. At least I think I do and did my last one by adding baking soda in small amounts to up the pH (match the tank) before adding.

My plecos are bristlenoses. I have one in the cichlids tank and one in the goldfish tank. I think both of them are doing ok although the golds seem to eat all his food. I almost think the one in the cichlids tank is doing better.

Thanks for the help.


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[Athena18]

A nevermind, I Re-read the article. I guess I better start water changing. ****. I do not have time for all this, but I'm an animal lover which includes fish. Guess I better make time.


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