Sick Platy with redness, enflamed scales, and lethargic

[xstream]

I came home today to find my Barb Platy with redness and grating to her scales and they are enflamed. She is usually all over the tank, but today she is hovering at the bottom.

I have some pics.


I tested my water and Ammonia is 0, Nitrite 0, and Nitrate is around 5 ppm. Ph is always around 8.4-8.7. It is a 10 g tank with two other Platys and a couple of ottos.



Anyone have any ideas? I have some pimafix and some aquarium salt.

 

[Noviceafter2yea]

One of my platys has the same red-looking scales and her some of her scales seem to be fading into an iridescent color. She swims around a lot! But I do catch her hanging out at the top (not gasping for air).

I am interest to see what feedback people will give you. My readings are not as good as yours. I've been struggling to correct that. All my other fish are not showing any signs of distress.

Sorry I can't give you useful feedback.

 

[J.Mcpeak]

Possibly it's the pH, salt will increase the pH. Do not use it. Not to fix this.
I think your pH may be at the upper limit for this fish, perhaps a little too high.

How long have you had this tank?

 

[xstream]

I am pretty sad to say she isn't looking any better. Since I have been home I have been watching the tank and I had to separate her into a breeding pen.

I am not sure which came first the illness (which was sudden) or my Ottocinclus going for her slime coat. I hope could they have harassed her without my noticing? It has only been a day or two without zucchini and they ate their fill of it before I took it out on day three.



I'm not sure how she will do in the pen... I know it could stress her more, but the Ottos wouldn't leave her alone and the the shrimp were following her around.

 

[xstream]

The tank is 15 months and pH has always been at that level. I only add two teaspoons each water change for slime coat, and have since I started the tank....

 

[xstream]

Here is a pic now that she has been separated.

 

[xstream]

And I am sorry, I just realized I was looking at the wrong number. I always get a brown color on high pH. So like 8.2.

 

[Noviceafter2yea]

Is the top fin a little mangled?

 

[xstream]

She has kept them all tucked in, but I believe so. Her fins on the sides are looking rough. She did not look like this last night.

I am really worried that it is the Ottos. I have watched one begin to harass one of the other Platys now. There is zucchini in the tank.

 

[Noviceafter2yea]

I am not even close to an expert and would take what I say as just something to consider. When I was researching about my own red gill issue, most of my findings indicated it was probably an issue with ammonia. My ammonia is NOT 0 so it could be the cause of mine. If ammonia reading is at 0, my research suggested it might be a parasite, a nitrate problem, or chlorine intoxication. It could be an infection caused by a wound.

I wish I could be of useful help, but I am passing along what I read. Hopefully someone who actually knows what he is doing will give you useful information and advice.

 

[J.Mcpeak]

Epsom salt is the market name for hydrated MgSO4 and adding 1 milliliter of it per 10 liters of water will increase the permanent hardness by roughly 70 mg/L CaCO3.
Salt should only be added to treat certain conditions, stress reduction associated with physical damage and/or high nitrate, hydra control, ulcer disease and aids in the removal of leeches.
Copied from;
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/plecostomus-has-bloated-stomach-283923.html

First we will discuss poor water quality. Poor water quality consists of many water perimeters. Each fish we keep requires different water perimeters and thrives in a different type of water setting. Ammonia and nitrite poisoning are the two most common types of erroneous water quality. This stems from un-cycled tanks and housing too many fish with too great of a bio-load that the filter can not hold. When water perimeters are consistently above acceptable levels the fish has an increased stress level as it is harder for them to even do the very basic swimming and hovering around the tank after extended times. Poor water quality causes the fish to become lethargic and the slime coating of the fish begins deterioration. Nitrates, gh, and kh can also be causes of poor water quality.
Copied from;
Protecting your fishes vital slime coat

Could be a really high GH? Could be the trouble from the Ottos? It seems funny that they've just turned on the fish?
Is all of your stock old? When was the last thing added to the tank and what was it?

Im not sure really but I'm thinking about it. I assume you are using Epsom salt?

 

[UABsleeperSRNA]

The top fin IMO looks like fin rot.. How much water are you changing each time when your adding two teaspoons of salt.. It could be that with each water change you are increasing the salt concentration .. How frequently are you doing water changes and adding the salt?..? Have you had this fish since you started the cycling process? Could be that that the salt is actually doing more harm than good

Ottos actually don't like salt so it is likely your stressing them out also.. If you just now saw the Otto sucking on your platies slime coat it's likely it's been happening for a while and stressing out your fish..

Fin rot is caused by a bacterial infection and the redness is likely from a bacterial infection also 2nd to to the Otto sucking off the slime coat.. Also looks like his gills are inflamed could be to to high salt or if you have recently had high ammonia .. May consider melafix and cut back the salt likly your stressing all your fish I would change my water and not add any more salt only 15 to 20 % as not to stress your fish to much this is just my opinion though

 

[xstream]

Thank you all for your replies. The tank is over a year old and has been cycled after the first few months. We have had zero readings of ammonia and nitrites ever since. Nitrates creeped up on me one time but water was changed around 20 ppm (you know how hard the API liquid test can be to read for Nitrates).

I have a tetra HOB filter that is rated for 20 gallons on my 10 gallon tank. I do weekly water changes of close to 6 gallons of water which means I only leave about 2" of water in the tank and replace the rest.

I vacuum along the surface of the gravel with each water change and vacuum into the gravel once a month.

I am using API aquarium salt. Like most things in the aquarium hobby it appears that it depends on who you speak with about aquarium salt. I have been told that it promotes good health in Platys and that low of a concentration would not be bad for my Ottos.

Most of what I have read about pH has said that the high reading is not as troubling as it needing to stay consistent. I live in an area with hard water and it has been the same every time I have tested it.

Trying to think if I left anything out... I use Prime when adding fresh water. I add four drops to each three gallon bucket, and let them sit while I drain/vacuum and then I add the water.

The last thing added to the tank was one of the ottos but that was a month ago or so.

I woke up to find her floating in the breeding tank. I am about to remove her and change the water. I guess I won't add salt anymore.

Oh yeah, she has had the red gills ever since I got her. I had a sunburst Mickey Mouse when we first got the tank and that had red gills as well. My other two Platys are dark and I cannot tell if they have red gills.

 

[xstream]

Should I put anything in the tank in case of some disease?

 

[UABsleeperSRNA]

Should I put anything in the tank in case of some disease?

To answer this if your other fish look healthy then no i would not add anymore salt as this will only stress the fish more.. and since we don't know exactly what the fish had it is probably pointless to try and treat as many meds target a specific type of organism.. i would stop using the salt frequent water changes will replace the minerals they need and the use of prime will help add slime layer.. plus otto's hate salt

Trying to think if I left anything out... I use Prime when adding fresh water. I add four drops to each three gallon bucket, and let them sit while I drain/vacuum and then I add the water.

It could be that your Poisoning your fish with chlorine if you change 6 gallons which i think is rather large changing 60-70% of your water every time adding 4 drops for 6 gallons of water could be your problem.. Prime says 1ml per 10 gallons right.. 1ml= ~20 drops if you do the math that's 2 drops per gallon of water.. 4 drops would only be adequate for chlorine load of 2 gallons of water.. thus a 2 gallon of chlorinated water introduced to your tank with every water change.. could explain the death.. your not going to hurt your fish by giving slightly more than needed.. for ex on my 10g qt i treat with 1.2 ml of of prime every time regardless if i'm changing 1 g or 5g.. b/c treating the volume of the tank your getting the benefit of neutralizing any ammonia nitrite or nitrate.. in the tank plus the slime layer for the tank!
Hope this was helpful

 

[xstream]

Thanks. I changed three gallons this morning and did not add salt. I have always been unclear as to how much Prime to use, but after reading your post I see that the bottle says that 10mL will treat 1000 gallons. So you are right, 1 mL for the whole tank. I currently put four drops per 3 gallon bucket. You are suggesting 2 drops per gallon? So I have been missing it by only two drops. Or are you suggesting 1 mL every weekly water change? That isn't a problem for me, I use a medicine dropper.

I don't think it is chlorine though. I have tested chlorine a few times bot in tank and just fresh water and I have never had a reading. I have always treated my water with Prime just in case.

So here is what I am going to change.

Weekly water changes down to 3 gallons with 20 drops of Prime, and no weekly salt added to the tank.

Thanks again for your help. I hate to think I have been stressing my fish out by following what I thought were good good, healthy practices for them.

 

[UABsleeperSRNA]

Thanks. I changed three gallons this morning and did not add salt. I have always been unclear as to how much Prime to use, but after reading your post I see that the bottle says that 10mL will treat 1000 gallons. So you are right, 1 mL for the whole tank. I currently put four drops per 3 gallon bucket. You are suggesting 2 drops per gallon? So I have been missing it by only two drops. Or are you suggesting 1 mL every weekly water change? That isn't a problem for me, I use a medicine dropper.

I don't think it is chlorine though. I have tested chlorine a few times bot in tank and just fresh water and I have never had a reading. I have always treated my water with Prime just in case.

So here is what I am going to change.

Weekly water changes down to 3 gallons with 20 drops of Prime, and no weekly salt added to the tank.

Thanks again for your help. I hate to think I have been stressing my fish out by following what I thought were good good, healthy practices for them.

1st I do think you have been under dosing your prime! two Drops could make a big difference especially with a solution such as pime which is highly concentrated.. It's better dose a little bit over rather than under..

2nd are you getting your water from city water or well water? If city water i'm about 95% certain they are using either chloramine or chlorine.. chloramine i don't know if it was show up on a chlorine test..? never done that type of test.. 2nd if chloramine the under dosing could be even worse i would think.. it breaks down into ammonia.. if well water it could could have a high content of metals which could irritate your fish i am not sure on this point if prime helps with heavy metals or not

3rd Yes i would suggest doing smaller water changes 3-4 gallons max.. and with water changes add full ~20 drops(consistently sized) which is 1ml it would be more accurate(but not essential) if you could get a 3cc syringe or 5 cc syringe but i'm a nurse in grad school so it's readily available.. Dose based on the full volume of your tank you will get ammonia neutralization for the entire tank, add slime layer and ensure your getting all the ammonia..

4th don't worry we have all overdone stuff when we were stress about our fish.. at least i have.. and that's how we learn.. yes the salt not necessary for your fish platy can do ok with or without salt dosen't need it.. Oto can be harmful extended periods of time as this fish is scaleless and can have increased sensitivity to salt.. if you had just molly's they are brackish water fish which means they like some salt in their water it would be a different story.. but even those don't require salt i would only use it if i was treating ich for example.. i typically use salt and higher temps.. i do not however combine this with meds.. as increasing temp and extra salt decrease o2 concentration in your water.. add meds which also decrease it and you can kill your fish

Hope you found this helpful and if you have any other questions feel free to ask.. don't know if i could help but someone prob could

 

[xstream]

Thank you. I do not have well water and I guess it could be chloramine. I don't think those tests tested for that. I have added the extra Prime to my tank and I will use 1 mL with every future water change of 3 gallons. As long as Nitrates do not rise to quickly (and I do not believe they will) I think that will do.

 

[xstream]

Thank you all so much for your help. Wanted to post an update.

I have started changing only 2.5-3 gallons per week, no more salt, and I have increased Prime to 10 mL each water change. And everybody is doing fabulous! I have noticed my sunburst Platy's gills have gone down and are less red. Before I had not really noticed it due to his coloration, but now I have seen a difference.

I have not added another Platy to the tank because I wanted to rule out anything else. For now I am going to wait a while.

Thanks again. I feel awful that I have slowly poisoned my fish over the past year... But I am glad to know what I was doing wrong.

 

[UABsleeperSRNA]

Thank you all so much for your help. Wanted to post an update.

I have started changing only 2.5-3 gallons per week, no more salt, and I have increased Prime to 10 mL each water change. And everybody is doing fabulous! I have noticed my sunburst Platy's gills have gone down and are less red. Before I had not really noticed it due to his coloration, but now I have seen a difference.

I have not added another Platy to the tank because I wanted to rule out anything else. For now I am going to wait a while.

Thanks again. I feel awful that I have slowly poisoned my fish over the past year... But I am glad to know what I was doing wrong.

Are you using 10ML of prime?? is their a reason that's way to much all you need for a 10 gallon tank is 1ml total.. your overdosing prime by about ~900% Each 1ml of prime treats 10 us gallons so treating with 10 ml is enough to treat a 100 gallon tank prime is pretty concentrated.. you do not need more than 1-1.2 ml to treat your whole 10 gallon tank