need sump help for 150g tank

[OscarGal]

Ok so I have this 150g tank and stand in my living room. I bought it two months ago fixed the stand, made room for it by taking out some built in shelving and there it sits. Its 5' tall on the stand. I also have a series of plastic tubs ranging from 20g to 40g. I would like to use one of those to build a sump. I am going for simple, effective and low priced.

I kinda get the idea of a sump as I have been reading since the first of the year. What I am having a hard time with is what size/type of pump to buy. I cant seem to wrap my head around the math for it. I have read the charts ect and i have conflicting opinions from the LFS...which I know to not ever listen to them if I can help it so meh. I have had some people tell me a 750gph pump would work. On the other hand the LFS folks have said that isnt enough power. I have a feeling they were trying to upsell me though. I am also going to need some guidance on the size of pipe to use and maybe a few pointers on an overflow. I have a couple of basic ideas but nothing set in stone.

My one major obsticle is money. I need to do this right the first time without wasting money. That is why I havent jumped right in yet. I am overly thankful for any information anyone can help me with.

Also: My oscars are itching to get in this tank. They are around 5 inches and already starting to get a little fed up with their current set up.

Now for the initial embarassment of posting the plans I have drawn out so far.

1) I dont know if a strait shot up from the pump would be to hard on it or even work for that matter? Would it be better to make a few slight turns so its not a strait shot?

2) I have no clue what size pump or pipe to plumb it with.

3) the over flow will be behind the tank, I just cant draw it that way. I have the design I want figured out but I will need some help on calculations for size so it can keep up with whatever pump I get.

4) I am also thinking I might do a spray bar on the return pipe instead of just dumping the water right in. Would that change any of the calculations?

 

[CaptainAhab]

No need for embarrassment, check out this link. Melevsreef.com | Acrylic Sumps & Refugiums

In a nutshell, your return pump has equal your overflow volume (+/- any headloss). There is a link for a headloss calculator also. So if you have a 600 gph overflow your return pump must be able to return 600 gph (give or take) to the display. If it's too low the sump overflows, if it's too high the sump drains dry. It's a zero sum game. There are a ton of nuances along the way. There are a few good threads on here about sump building and calcs. 1" pipe drains approx 600 gph, bigger more or you could get a 2 drain overflow. See lots of options.

Reef Central Online Community

Take a look at the links, get aquainted and then ask away.

Ok so I have this 150g tank and stand in my living room. I bought it two months ago fixed the stand, made room for it by taking out some built in shelving and there it sits. Its 5' tall on the stand. I also have a series of plastic tubs ranging from 20g to 40g. I would like to use one of those to build a sump. I am going for simple, effective and low priced.

I kinda get the idea of a sump as I have been reading since the first of the year. What I am having a hard time with is what size/type of pump to buy. I cant seem to wrap my head around the math for it. I have read the charts ect and i have conflicting opinions from the LFS...which I know to not ever listen to them if I can help it so meh. I have had some people tell me a 750gph pump would work. On the other hand the LFS folks have said that isnt enough power. I have a feeling they were trying to upsell me though. I am also going to need some guidance on the size of pipe to use and maybe a few pointers on an overflow. I have a couple of basic ideas but nothing set in stone.

My one major obsticle is money. I need to do this right the first time without wasting money. That is why I havent jumped right in yet. I am overly thankful for any information anyone can help me with.

Also: My oscars are itching to get in this tank. They are around 5 inches and already starting to get a little fed up with their current set up.

Now for the initial embarassment of posting the plans I have drawn out so far.

1) I dont know if a strait shot up from the pump would be to hard on it or even work for that matter? Would it be better to make a few slight turns so its not a strait shot?

2) I have no clue what size pump or pipe to plumb it with.

3) the over flow will be behind the tank, I just cant draw it that way. I have the design I want figured out but I will need some help on calculations for size so it can keep up with whatever pump I get.

4) I am also thinking I might do a spray bar on the return pipe instead of just dumping the water right in. Would that change any of the calculations?

 

[gzeiger]

A straight shot return is easier on the pump than putting bends in the line. Curves cause friction, and the pump has to work harder to overcome it.

 

[CaptainAhab]

But by no means should be a determining factor in your design. Pumps are built to handle 'head loss' , which is the aforementioned friction from couples, verticle and horizontal length etc. Just account for it in your pump size calculation.

Some day you're going to have to get in there and work on that sump/pump. Building it too tight will make that day much more aggravating than it will already be. I use flex tube back to the display with slack built in. Needed a bigger pump though

 

[OscarGal]

ok so I did a little reading yesterday and today and I think that I have a little better of a grasp on what I need. I know for sure that I wont be able to do a straight shot like I was thinking. Just by looking at the stand with a clear head I will at least have to have a couple of turns.

Someone here said that a 1" pipe is around 600gph so wouldnt a 1.5" be around 900gph? Is my thinking way off on that?

I am thinking the overflow will be around 900gph. I have found a design that I like that I am planning on building...its much cheaper than buying it. Then I have found two pumps on ebay that are reasonably priced. There isnt a name brand but one is 1100gph and one is 1550gph. Would it be better for me to just go with the 1550gph and adjust the flow with a ball valuve or would that be way to powerful? They are about the same price give or take a few bucks.

I put the calculations in the calculator from the link and used a pump with a 1200gph rating and it came up to about 921 gph. I know that most pumps are different so I am concerned that the 1100gph may not be enough. Any thoughts on that for those who have experience?


Also I just wanted to add that I did a little handy work last night and made a filter with the pump from a small pool filter and got my oscars into the 150 today. It isnt one that can hold up long term but its enough to get them in there and give them more space for now. So far it is working well. I just couldnt live with myself keeping them in the 29g even one more day.

 

[gzeiger]

Your thinking on pipe diameters is way off. A 1.5" pipe has a little over double the flow area of a 1" pipe (the area of a circle is proportional to the square of the radius), so is expected to have a little over double the flow capacity. It will have less headloss too.

 

[OscarGal]

Your thinking on pipe diameters is way off. A 1.5" pipe has a little over double the flow area of a 1" pipe (the area of a circle is proportional to the square of the radius), so is expected to have a little over double the flow capacity. It will have less headloss too.

Thanks, I didnt see anything on that in my googling quest. Now I have more thinking to do.

 

[CaptainAhab]

1.5 pipe is about 1300 gph..

Stand pipe Size Gravity Flow Rating ¾" 330 gph 1" 600 gph 1¼"910 gph 1½"1300 gph 1¾"1800 gph 2"2350 gph 2¼"2960 gph 2½"3650 gph 2¾"4450 gph 3"5280 gph