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Old 09-20-2005, 02:10 AM   #1
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Real & Virtual Aquarium - Rebuilt

Hi. Too bad I found this forum this late. I decided many things on this project too fast and on 3rd october it must be complete.

Here's the concept: a 840 liter fresh water aquarium with a 120cmx70cm auto-stereoscopic plasma screen right behind its back. The idea is to place 3d stereoscopic film inside the aquarium without the need for any 3d glasses. Real fish swimming with virtual fish.

I made a test with a small aquarium and the images somehow seemed more "substancial" in water than on air, which was a surprise to me.

Does anyone have any idea of the effect TV has on fish? The auto-stereoscopic plasma frequency is only 56Hz.

I'm getting a Malawi cichlid community and I wonder how much affected will they be by the film in the background. They won't be able to see stereoscopically because they will be too close.

Here's one of my virtual fish (this one will not be in this film, it would be out of place). I haven't even started modelling the african cichlids because I'm waiting for the shop to tell me what species they will get.
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Old 09-20-2005, 10:21 AM   #2
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I honestly can't say what the affect would be on them. The only thing you might consider is aggression. If the live species you put in the tank views the virtual species as tresspassors or even possible mates you could run the risk of injuries to the real fish as they try to engage the virtual fish.

Just a first thought.

Looking forward to updates and some pictures!
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Old 09-20-2005, 03:49 PM   #3
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I don't think aggression will be an effect because they are too close to be able to see the stereoscopic effect, they'll only see a blur that changes as they move, which I think will be difficult for them to identify. But this weird effect you get when you are moving in front of the plasma screen is disturbing, even if for a few seconds. They will be continuously exposed to that.

I hope it doesn't "stupidify" them or make them psychologically unbalanced (tv has this effect on people).

I already know what will be the community:

Aulonocara baenschi benga
Aulonocara sp. nyassae (hansbaenschi red flush)
Copadichromis azureus
Copadichromis borleyi red kadango
Protomelas sp. steveni taiwan reef
Protomelas steveni eastern
Protomelas nemalange red empress
Protomelas marginatus
Sciaenochromis ahli

These species are organized in couples or small harems of adult fish. There will be an assortment of younger fish. This is meant to be an exhibition tank so it will be fuller than I would like. For me this aquarium would be great with just 8-12 fish.

I'll post pictures of the final result. Since this aquarium will be placed at a picture exhibition, I'm going to put two paintings behind the aquarium, on each side of the plasma screen.

I expect to post some images of the virtual fish within the next days since I'll begin modelling them in my free time.

If anyone has any information on the effect of prolongued exposition to TV on fish, please let me know.
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Old 09-25-2005, 06:11 PM   #4
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That sounds really neat, can't wait to see the complete thing.

Sorry I can't help with the effect it will have to the fish...
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Old 09-26-2005, 09:41 AM   #5
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I think it will be somewhat "new ground" but also sounds like it will be up for way too short of a period to get any accurate data from to form a real conclusion. The only thing I can think to add would be that if the display behind the aquarium contained a lot of fast movement and changing images, even though the fish won't be able to focus on it, it could cause some stress. I notice from my aquariums over the years the fish to react to movement outside the tank. While some of their reaction may be from transfered vibration through the floor to the stand and tank, some may also be from movement.

I'm also looking forward to seeing the final "product" as well as your conclusions! Good luck!
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Old 09-26-2005, 11:36 PM   #6
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The fish will arrive in Lisbon today and will be shipped here in a 3 or 4 days. And then they will be on the tank without video for less than 48 hours. From then on, the plasma will be on from 9:00 till 18:00.

Since it's a large community all at once, I think maybe there won't be many killings.

I suspect they will be a bit "stupidified" too. Like fish in petstores or in places where there's too much movement.

But it's just for two weeks. I think they will recover their old sefves when they leave the exhibition.

For some time, I wanted to do this in a large public aquarium, so this will be a test to the idea.
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Old 09-26-2005, 11:54 PM   #7
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I agree, it's a very short amount of time to draw any conclusions if it's due on Oct 3, but I would think the fish would be scared at first, but will soon adapt to the virtual fish.

Good luck
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Old 09-27-2005, 04:58 PM   #8
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you should do a tank with it take some tests and then if it works sorta make it real and sell a tank ready for it. if it has no adverse affect on the fish then sell it. but if you do a long term experiment you should tells us cuz that is a cool idea.
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Old 09-27-2005, 05:11 PM   #9
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For now it's just a two week experiment. If it works I will adapt the idea and maybe sell it to a small local public aquarium. But the technology will be completely different.
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Old 09-30-2005, 10:20 PM   #10
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I installed the aquarium yesterday and the fish arrived today... all 21 of them were in good condition. In the few hours I watched them, they were as peacefull as a goldfish aquarium. No aggression at all yet.

To encourage aerobic bacterial grouth I installed a 60 liters/min air pump. That thing looks like a geyser and the fish avoid the area. I had reduce the air flow to less than half, but even so, they don't like it very much.

I recieved the salts with the fish and while they were floating in their bags already on the aquarium I used one full container of salts which was labbeled for 600 liters. Since the aquarium has a capacity of 850, I thought there would be no problem.

When I measured the PH it showed a bright violet - a colour not listed on the color table, so my guess was that it was well above 9.

I started making water changes (which was quite painfull, since I'm installing it in a museum and I had to make 200 meters runs with a bucket between floors) and it dropped slightly. Any sugestions about controlling this?

The fish seemed fine... they showed good appetite when I tempted them with a little food, considering they've been making a succession of flight trips for a week.

I have a filter already installed and another working in an old aquarium. I was thinking about installing this last filter on the new aquarium when I start noticing the amonia levels raising. Is this a good plan?

I'll post some pictures next monday.
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