Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Community Forum > Aquaria Off-Topic

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
Old 07-07-2012, 10:02 AM   #11
Aquarium Advice Addict
Malawi Freak's Avatar
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Vernon, NJ
Posts: 1,237
I love wild caught, if it weren't still a possibility our breeds would become overbreed and slowly start to create deformities. When I was breeding saulosi I noticed the original breeding group was from a stressed mother and I had to shut down the whole tank. My chailosi are F1 and their colors are more beautiful than most pictures I look up on the breed.

It is also a great way to keep hybridization down with wild caught, but that too happens in the wild at times.

Malawi Freak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 11:02 AM   #12
come get me tang police!
jetajockey's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: In a swamp near you /Pensacola, FL
Posts: 12,047
This is a great topic. This one hits close to home because I collect native fish from time to time. I'm not sure what would constitute it as cruel since it'd be a bit hypocritical to call wild caught fish keeping cruel and then happily keep a house full of domesticated animals. If we placed all creatures on the same level then it is selfishness by us to keep animals as pets, but that again is another ethical question. I believe we have dominion over animals and should be their caretakers both in the wild (to the best of our ability) and in our families.

I agree with the OP, the real pressure on wild species is encroachment/habitat destruction. There are some species in aquaria today that no longer exist in the wild, and it's not because of overcollecting/overfishing. So in those instances, fishkeeping actually saved some species that would have gone extinct.

There are many people who make a career out of keeping tabs on different wild species and putting laws in place to help maintain or flourish those most affected for whatever the circumstance is.

Dont Forget to Join my FREE weekly Plant Giveaway.
Click Here!
jetajockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 11:05 AM   #13
Great white snark
DragonFish71's Avatar

Tank of the Month Award
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Longmont, Colorado
Posts: 6,563
I'm mixed on this.

I love native species fish and have 3 dedicated tanks for their well being. I'm hoping that I can get them breeding so I can advance the hobby out here. Mind you, these aren't Colorado natives, so to us they're exotic.

I have found that the wild caughts are hardier than their captive raised cousins.

Take for example killies. I have both tank raised and wilds, the wilds have better colors, are more forgiving if I can't get to the water changes promptly, and just all around seem to adapt better.

The down side is that I do worry about over collecting.
Jamie.... "The fingers of natural selection are hovering over the delete button."
AA community rules: http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums...ork&page=rules

DragonFish71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 11:49 AM   #14
Aquarium Advice Addict
HUKIT's Avatar

POTM Champion
Tank of the Month Award
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 42.2411°N/88.3161°W
Posts: 6,843
Originally Posted by DragonFish71 View Post

I have found that the wild caughts are hardier than their captive raised cousins.
Good point, I think that's a popular misconception with wild caught but in my experience they are drastically hardier than captive breed. I'm sure the daily struggles in the wild have a higher risk value than the lazy life in our tanks. My biggest challenges has always been acclimating to processed foods and overcoming their shyness, once that's done there really are no differences.
Those Who Lack The Courage Will Always Find A Philosophy To Justify It.
Please Support The Cares Preservation Program <---Click Here For Information.
HUKIT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 12:00 PM   #15
Aquarium Advice Addict
Gboy66's Avatar

POTM Champion
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Cali baby
Posts: 6,826
Originally Posted by HUKIT
I've been a freshwater guy for 30 years and have never really given much thought to the salty side of this question, but something I would be interested in hearing.
In saltwater, the breeding of fish is just so much more crucial to the hobby.

For example, i was at the lfs the other day in the salt sections. We were curious and asked, out of all the fish there and 30ish tanks how many of the species were bred in captivity. He said 1 species. The clowns. Can you imagine how many of these fish were just swooped in on and captured? And considering that saltwater has grown alot, i cannot begin to think about all the wild caught fish in the hobby.

Im not really sure where i stand on this topic. Yes im in the hobby..so saying "anything taken out of the wild is bad" is a bit hypocritical. I am also in the section of the hobby where so much is plucked from the wild. That being said, i always pay extra if i have the option of a tank-bred fish, or self propagated coral. Of course the parents of these fish and the mother colony of this coral had to be wild...but hey, better than nothing!

Nice topic hukit
Gboy66 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 12:01 PM   #16
Aquarium Advice Freak
MrPillow's Avatar

POTM Champion
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Corpus Christ, TX
Posts: 396
I find it no less ethical to extract specimens from the wild than it is to force a specimen to live in an artificial environment, regardless of origin or bloodline. There must come a point where a line is drawn - non sentient organisms are not privy to the rights created by humans. If they are granted any extension of these rights is purely up to the caretaker.
MrPillow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 12:05 PM   #17
AA Team Emeritus
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,462
Subjective depending on the care quality of the supplier(s). Were fry overcrowded, underfed, imbreeding involved, exposed to high NH3 concentrations, QT'd for parasites/disease (what meds/methods). For those preferencing wild caught as hardier, is this based simply on purchasing fish from a local lfs or online supplier (knowing well they have culled any dead prior to opening for the day) of which may or may not still have underlying illnesses.
Innovator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 02:44 PM   #18
AA Team Emeritus
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Whitby, Ont,Canada
Posts: 2,753
this topic has several facets, and is far from clear cut.While there are more than a few extinct species being kept in aquaria, does it really matter that much? they are no longer existent in the wild. Some species that are endangered, can profit from being kept by hobbyists and species preservation programs in zoos. regardless, these fish will not be returned to the wild.
captive bred fish cheaply and readily available can be detrimental to the long term existance of their wild counterparts. An example of this would be the Cardinal tetra.Some 84,000,000 are harvested annually for the pet trade. this is a number that is, apparently sustainable. because the locals make their living from their capture, they aren't burning down rainforest to try and farm. the result is a preservation of the habitat and the ensured survival of the Cardinals, the forest, and the people who call it home. If a cheap source of cardinals were to become available, perhaps from the far east, the collecting might stop, and the resultant degradation of the habitat, created by the need for local peoples to survive, by any means necessary, could result in loss of fish and the forest habitat. So, in this case, wild caught is beneficial to the species and any other species in the area.
Of course, every case is different, and some fish have quickly become at risk shortly after their discovery.
As far as whether it is ethical to remove an animal from the wild, place in a carefully cultured environment, ensure it is free from parasites, and provide a steady supply of food, I will leave it up to the individual.
If you look at what is happening with frogs, and the Kettrick fungus, the only hope for most of them is that they are caught in the wild and removed to a carefully tended environment, and bred, hopefully, over time, with some resistance to the fungus.
Join a fish club. Don't have one in your area? Start one.
BillD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 03:02 PM   #19
Aquarium Advice Addict
Community Moderator
aqua_chem's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Baltimore, MD
Posts: 6,936
Bill touched on another point that I would like to flesh out a bit. There is a strong economic argument for wild caught over captive bred. If we were to transition to captive bred only, prices for many difficult to breed fish would skyrocket. Imagine trying to produce 84,000,000 cardinals, a species which is difficult to breed. Same thing with otos, SAE, and several other tetras (among others). We would quickly find that our selection of economically viable species would dwindle. Wild caught fish are essential to the hobby, ethical or not.
Algae creates 75% of the world's oxygen, so really we're all just doing our parts...
aqua_chem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-2012, 03:23 PM   #20
AA Team Emeritus
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 3,462
^^^One of the primary reasons we don't see captive breeding on such a grand scale...money talks. Even such ventures overseas involving fish/amphib culturing can and is obstructed by unwillingness for whatever reasons, government-wise down to local inhabitants.

Innovator is offline   Reply With Quote

breed, cap, question, wild

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

» Photo Contest Winners

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities

Copyright 2002-2012 Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:16 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.