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Old 03-29-2015, 03:11 PM   #151
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+1 to Mebbid with the addition that you can get replacement trace elements supplements for SW to add back to the water for the fish while in FW, none or not many exist to my knowledge.

As for the LFS which didn't change water for 3 years, I am assuming that was in a display tank? If it were in their system, they must be adding water to it replace the water they take out when they sell a fish so they are doing some water changing. If it's their display tank, I can tell you from experience that it does, long term, screw up the fish by not changing water. Unfortunately, way back when , I too didn't get into the habit of water changes in my marine tanks and no fish I ever traded in survived. ( It was the 70s, we didn't know better yet ) I was always taking small fish and raising them to a larger size before trading them in for small fish again so I would have these fish for months and sometimes years with no problems so I couldn't understand why they would be dying in the new water. I did some research into it and found that the fish would acclimate to the bad conditions but have a really bad time adjusting back to the good water. I can't recall the exact terminology for this but it's the same as when you take a fish from a higher salt level and reduce the salt level too quickly ( sometimes even multiple days is too quickly ), the fish dies from the "shock" of the change. Once I started doing my routine water changes, the trade ins did much better. That was the only difference to my fish keeping so there had to be something to it.

As for the article and fish in cycling, you have to remember that ammonia is natural and there are toxic and non toxic versions of it. Again, way back when, ( Now I'm talking the 1960s ) all we did was fish in cycling, without killing fish. I had many fish that became successful breeders even going through this "fish in "cycling so they were not damaged by the process. You can't automatically condemn someone for doing that style of cycling if it is done under the right conditions.

Hope this helps.
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Old 03-29-2015, 03:15 PM   #152
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I didn't mean to condemn fish in cycling (i do it to depending on the tank), I was merely condemning it when using fish that are incredibly overstocked. I understand fish in cycling using danios or other small fish in a 10 gallon but it is ridiculous to fish in cycle 3 medium size goldfish in the same size tank.
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Old 03-29-2015, 03:47 PM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icydeath View Post
I didn't mean to condemn fish in cycling (i do it to depending on the tank), I was merely condemning it when using fish that are incredibly overstocked. I understand fish in cycling using danios or other small fish in a 10 gallon but it is ridiculous to fish in cycle 3 medium size goldfish in the same size tank.
I was actually talking more about Cool Guys " This might make you blow a gasket" comment. "RULES" are not always the norm when it comes to fish keeping. As we now know, rules such as "1 inch of fish per gallon of water " is not an accurate measurement as it all depends on how many fish those inches take up (eg: 10- 1" cardinal tetras vs 1- 10 oscar). What some of those posters do is just playing "Russian Rhoulette" with their tanks. Yes, they may go for quite some time with no issues but one day.......... BANG!!!!!!! it will hit them like a ton of bricks. Overstocking is subjective. In my experience, the water chemistry tells me more when my tanks are overstocked than their appearance does. I had to laugh at the comment against the posters in the article who uses the sight method of fish keeping. I reached a point before when I too stopped testing water as the water didn't change with the routines I was following. HOWEVER, I also was 20+ years into my fish keeping ( and now that number is 50 years ) so I have a pretty good handle on it. lol ( But I do have a current test kit on hand just in case. )

As for what fish to use to cycle a tank, I've done all but the most sensitive. It's all about HOW you do it.
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Old 04-01-2015, 11:33 PM   #154
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Well said Andy.
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