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Old 10-18-2005, 02:43 PM   #51
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Im not sure, it does have to do with the Van O' Death and the dumpster cemetary. It also concerns a dog shelter that was run by peta members that was actually euthanising the dogs and putting the money from the shelter in thier pockets. I will again say all these incidents involve certain members and not the beliefs or will of the entire group although it was enough for me after researching it a fair bit to not want any further involvement as a "member" of that group. Hopefully before I leave I can help them tone this war against aquariums down a bit and wake up to reality some.

Although Ill give you an example of why I am a member of peta and why I feel thier core beliefs are of great value. A few hours ago a contractor that does sub contracting work for our company came in to get a pay check for some recent work. I was talking with him and he said he was having some problems with deer eating his shrubs at his home. He then said he had the problem taken care of though. I inquired to what steps he had taken to stop the deer from eating the shrubs - a common occurance in this rural area. He said and I quote - "I put the lead to them with a .357 magnum." I inquired to whether or not he kills them and harvests the meat and he said no - "I shoot them in the guts so they can suffer good before they die." He then bragged that a doe and fawn were at his shrubs and he shot the doe but missed the fawn, although assumed without a mother the fawn would perish.

This type of disrespect towards nature sickens me to the absolute core!! I should notify the MD state natural resource police of his behavior and press charges so he can be charged on many counts of poaching which is a criminal offense!!
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Old 10-18-2005, 02:59 PM   #52
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Terrible story. But it doesn't make me change my mind about PETA. Though I don't think that was your intention. I do believe you should report that.
It's not just PETA members that would take issue to that story, though. That is more an example to someone actually performing a cruelty to animals out of some sick pleasure and a small amount of annoyance to shrubs being eaten. Any decent person out there would stand against your contractor.
Correct me if I am wrong (seriously); it seems to me that PETA's core beliefs lie on the equalizing of animal rights to human rights. And the problem created is that some members of PETA would wrongly place animal rights OVER human rights. The later can be dangerous.
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Old 10-18-2005, 03:05 PM   #53
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T
It's not just PETA members that would take issue to that story, though. That is more an example to someone actually performing a cruelty to animals out of some sick pleasure and a small amount of annoyance to shrubs being eaten. Any decent person out there would stand against that.
Yeah that is true. I agree also that many peta members place animals above humans. I feel that animals - as inhabitants of the Earth should have rights governing thier treatment and the quote I have here on AA that was made by Ghandi I believe to have superior signifigance. I, as well as many non-peta members, believe all the world could do far better in thier treatment of animals and in the end society would gain for that. Like I said before I could probably right a book (maybe someday I will) about what I like about peta, how I feel about animal rights and so on and so forth - but I dont really think here is the place to conduct a detailed discussion about it. What angers me is many people make comments about "non-profit" groups that have serious stances on issues of society betterment with little or no education about the said group or issue.

As for turning in the person who made these comments, my best friend's step-dad is a MD NR officer and I spoke with him about the issues. That same person has gone fishing by throwing dynamite in the water and seeing how many fish bubble up!!
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Old 10-18-2005, 03:42 PM   #54
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What angers me is many people make comments about "non-profit" groups that have serious stances on issues of society betterment with little or no education about the said group or issue.
Yeah, I feel your pain there: I'm a Christian. But I'll be the first to say when James Dobson just needs to shut his pie-hole. PETA falls into a category that some Christian groups have rightfully fallen into as well; the "we force our beliefs on others" category. PETA has taken it a step further (some Christians have as well) buy TARGETING certain people or groups and screaming the hell and ****ation speech. Now in a growing population of people who believe in living the way they want to live, that can be offensive. And that feeling grows in this movement of political correctness.
People are also growing concerned that PETA may become too radical . . . which leads to the obvious. They certainly seem to be stepping (SLOWLY) in that direction and if it does happen it will start with that one nobody member who is just a little too radical. PETA will make an initial public statement that says he acted alone, but the statement will not completely condemn the action. This will inspire more . . .
It's the same way Abortion clinics take heat (and bombs) from "Christians".
And wow . . . we are off topic again. My fault!!
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Old 10-19-2005, 01:38 PM   #55
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well guys I got a final letter back from karin at peta and the bottom line is
Peta is against aquarium ownership 110% and wont back aquarium keepers. what a shock ... LOL!
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Old 10-19-2005, 05:24 PM   #56
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And wow . . . we are off topic again. My fault!!
Not just you're fault. We are wandering considerably off topic again.

Let's stay on target please.


So macman... if PETA is 100% against aquariums, which is no surprise, it means they are against this entire site and everyone on it...

That membership card of yours... need scisors?
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Old 10-19-2005, 05:39 PM   #57
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well like I said earlier BillyZ I wont be renewing my membership to Peta in '06, mainly due to some other instances. Of course this situation has not made me any more caring of the group, my appreciation for thier efforts was dwindling quickly involving some other issues long before this came up.

I am not suprised my thier position however, and I thought Karin from Peta was very respectful - her point in the last letter I recieved from her is that the reason they will not support aquariums or aquarium owners "even responsible ones" is because the aquarium industry encourages wild capture killing tons of fish with transit and shipping - so on and so forth. While this is true I tried to explain to Karin from Peta that the aquarium industry gives poor fishing folk a reason to preserve fish and the natural reefs where they live. Otherwise these fisherman would harveset the coral reef likely killing countless fish in the process.

Peta should really get on Reef Central's forum and talk to Steve Corosoe aka Cortez Marine who works in the collection industry about these issues. Anyway they arent budging and Im done writing.
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Old 10-19-2005, 05:42 PM   #58
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by the way here is that letter

Hi Jeremy- I think my previous email might have confused the issue. The bottom line (for the fish) is that the aquarium industry kills thousands (many even millions?) of fish every year. There's no way to get around that fact. As for fish that are taken from the wild, it's painfully obvious that they would rather be left alone as compared to being captured, shipped across the world (however delicately that might be, fish suffer from motion sickness and other stress that just can't be avoided).

I became a vegetarian because I knew I could live a happy healthy life without causing animals to suffer and die for my lunch- it was a way that I could eliminate some of the cruelty that exists in the world. It seems that aquariums are a similar issue-- even if an individual aquarium keeper is kind and provides an amazing environment for his or her fish, buying those fish still contributed to the suffering and death of many other fish.

Thanks again for your email, and I do hope that you continue to support our efforts.

Sincerely,


Karin Robertson, Manager
Fish Empathy Project
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Old 10-19-2005, 06:01 PM   #59
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I refuse to feel bad for owning a fish tank!!! The way I see it you have two choices.....stay with PETA the way someone on birth control continues being Catholic or ditch PETA for another organization that promotes animal welfare without getting nuts. I wouldn't take any of it too seriously. Doesn't Pamela Anderson have dogs???? There are always gonna be extremists on every issue in any group. I'm sure most PETA members are animal lovers and therefore I'd bet money that most have pets...All I know is that if my dog could read the Peta website she'd have some strong disagreements with their stance against dog ownership!
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Old 10-19-2005, 06:12 PM   #60
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Her letter did have a holier than thou attitude.....if you want to make her mad write her back and ask her if she thinks humans should live in houses because after all housing developments are affecting animals as well. Urban sprawl is a real problem! Probably more so then fish tanks. Maybe she should give up her house and live in the wild.....Does she drive a car....cause that too has affected animals on our planet.....Even farms where her vegetarian vegetables come from have probably changed landscapes and affected wildlife! Tell her you don't think she's gone far enough in her commitment to animals...maybe humans should be completely wiped off the face of the planet! When she commits herself to her cause a little more you'll consider giving up your fish tank
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