Best substrate for my situation?

[Visionist]

All my tanks currently are saltwater, but I have an extra 20g long that I want to set up a a freshwater planted tank. I would like to have it heavily planted and plan on buying a dual t5 fixture to support high light plants with driftwood/java moss etc. The only livestock I have somewhat set in stone currently is a blue ram or some kind of ram.
There are 3 decent fish stores locally, none of them sell anything other than gravel/silica sand/fluval stratum(overpriced crap). I work at petsmarthttp://www.petsmart.com and the only different thing we sell is laterite, a tiny box for a outrageous price(its just cat litterhttp://viglink.pgpartner.com/mrdr.p....com/search.php/form_keyword=cat+litter&mode= isn't it?).
I've read eco-complete is one of the best, but it would cost too much to get shipped in. I also want this tank to look nice so no really messy substrates preferably.
What are my options? Sand/soil mix of some kind? Any suggestions?
Thanks

 

[flitabout]

As far as the laterite goes kitty litter is a type of latrite. If you actually look at it's red not gray like kitty litter. It provides iron to the substrate. I got it and you need such a small amount that I still have some after doing 3 tanks. While you can do the whole substrate in laterite it's used more like a soil amendment. Depending on how cheap you want to go you can do the whole substrate for under $10. You can go the play sand route or you can do a dirted. I am a total dirt fan. Both of mine are dirted and heavily planted. One is capped with standard gravel and the other in play sand. Inert substrates like the sand or gravel can work just fine but I have personally seen explosive growth with dirt. Any of the types can be messy and once set up dirt isn't messy at all. Here is a pick of my 36g bf that I set up on Christmas. I don't see it as messy at all. This was 7days after set up.

Here is my 37g dirted.
Also with the rams they really appreciate a mature tank so give it at least 4-6 months after cycling. They have great personalities and I love mine! She's been a great addition to my group. For cheap decent lighting I would suggest these Odyssea T5 Aquarium Lighting

 

[Visionist]

As far as the laterite goes kitty litter is a type of latrite. If you actually look at it's red not gray like kitty litter. It provides iron to the substrate. I got it and you need such a small amount that I still have some after doing 3 tanks. While you can do the whole substrate in laterite it's used more like a soil amendment. Depending on how cheap you want to go you can do the whole substrate for under $10. You can go the play sand route or you can do a dirted. I am a total dirt fan. Both of mine are dirted and heavily planted. One is capped with standard gravel and the other in play sand. Inert substrates like the sand or gravel can work just fine but I have personally seen explosive growth with dirt. Any of the types can be messy and once set up dirt isn't messy at all. Here is a pick of my 36g bf that I set up on Christmas. I don't see it as messy at all. This was 7days after set up.

Here is my 37g dirted.
Also with the rams they really appreciate a mature tank so give it at least 4-6 months after cycling. They have great personalities and I love mine! She's been a great addition to my group. For cheap decent lighting I would suggest these Odyssea T5 Aquarium Lighting

Thanks for the help, are there any decent guides around on dirted tanks?

 

[Abrams96]

Dustins Dirted Tank Guide.
There is a hardcopy and digital version on amazon.

 

[flitabout]

I just watch his videos on youtube. There is also enough information out there on the web on how to do it. On top of the fact that is super easy. All you need is organic potting mix. Most people use miracle grow, but any brand will work as long as it's organic. You CAN add the laterite or some red potters clay but it is no way necessary and what ever you choose to use for a cap.
STEPS:
1) Add potting mix about 1-2 inches
2) Wet the potting mix. Think dry mud pie, not runny mud.
3) Add cap in a 50:50 ratio.
4) Use crumpled newspaper, paper towels, or an upside down plate or bowl to diffuse the water flow. Slowly fill the tank. Don't worry about dechlorinator or warm water at this point.
5) Drain 100% of the water.
6) Repeat steps 4-5 until the water runs clear.
7) Once the water runs clear empty it back out and place your hardscape, driftwood, rocks and such. Using your diffusion method fill the tank 1/4-1/3 full. Do your planting.
8) Once you are happy with your planting add your filter(s), heater, and water conditioner. Finish filling your tank.
9) Let everything settle for about an hour and then turn on your filters.
You are now ready to cycle the tank. You may notice for a couple of weeks that you will have tiny bits of dirt up toward the top edges of the tank. It's totally normal a bit annoying but if the water level is up high enough then you may well never even see it. I had it with my gravel cap for like a month. In the sand I just went and looked and it's completely gone already and I never saw it like I did with the gravel in the first place. If you use sand just make sure wash the sand really well and you are good to go!
Just remember even with the dirt you will still need root tabs for you heavy root feeders like crypts, swords, and wisteria. With high lights you also need to think about co2 or high dose glut (excel). I get metricide 14day solution from amazon for around $20 a gallon and then you can mix at a 50/50 ration with distilled or RO water and it makes the equivalent of 2 gallons of the name brand excel. Also some plants have a sensitivity to glut.

 

[Visionist]

One problem, I dont really know what plants im getting yet nor do I really have a 100% plan on what im doing yet. Can I set up the dirted substrate and add plants later?

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[flitabout]

You definitely can. But personally I would just get everything ready to get it done in one shot. Start looking for plants online or in the store. Look at tanks online to figure out what you like. Feel free to ask about what different plants need here. If you do it to start with and then add the plants later on just remember that with any type of substrate you will need to do a water change every time you either move, plant or remove plants.

 

[Visionist]

How much substrate should I use? You say 1:1 cap/dirt, would that mean roughly 10lbs of each for a total of 1lb of substrate per gallon?

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[Abrams96]

My 65 is dirted with a sand cap. I used less then one bad of MG organic and less then one bag of PFS. And that gave me about 4 inches total of dirt and sand.
So a 20 wouldn't take much. Id do about an inch of soil and an inch of cap since you dont have much height to work with in a 20 long.

 

[Visionist]

New idea, what about dirt capped with seachem red fluorite gravel? I love the red look and after seeing some of Dustins videos he pretty much only uses gravel.

 

[Mebbid]

Dirting is absolutely not necessary for an aquarium. Perfectly healthy and heavily grown tanks can be done on nothing but plain sand. My 55g is currently planted with black diamond blasting sand and root tabs.

Dirting a tank is more of a specialist thing that hardcore planted tank owners do. It's also practically pointless for a low light planted tank.

One of the best non dirt options for a planted tank is Eco complete. It's not terribly expensive and comes in black.

 

[Visionist]

Problem being is I cant get ecocomplete where I live. Its not going to be low light...I am getting a dual t5 HO light for the tank.
My only options are:
Sand
Gravel
Fluorite gravel
Dirt

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[Mebbid]

Problem being is I cant get ecocomplete where I live. Its not going to be low light...I am getting a dual t5 HO light for the tank.
My only options are:
Sand
Gravel
Fluorite gravel
Dirt

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Have you thought about buying it online? Through Drs foster and smith you can usually get free shipping on orders.

I would like to point out that I'm not saying to NOT do dirted, but it's not generally something that a newcomer to planted tanks jumps into.

Is this tank going to be a 20 long or a 20 high?

 

[Visionist]

It is a 20g long. I live in Newfoundland, canada. The cost to ship ecocomplete makes it a very poor choice in regards to $/substrate

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[Mebbid]

dual t5ho over 20g long is going to give you very high lighting. Have you thought about what you are going to do for CO2 or fertilizers?

 

[Visionist]

Was thinking diy co2 or root tabs. If t5ho is too much i can just do regular t5.

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[Abrams96]

I dont see the sense in spending the money on flourite when the dirt is providing the nutrients needed. If its just the colour you are after then you probably can find aquarium gravel or rocks that are similar.

But if you are set on flourite then yes its fine to use as a cap.

 

[Visionist]

I dont see the sense in spending the money on flourite when the dirt is providing the nutrients needed. If its just the colour you are after then you probably can find aquarium gravel or rocks that are similar.

But if you are set on flourite then yes its fine to use as a cap.

I think now I am going to use just fluorite as it seems much less hassle for similar if not better results that dirted. Dustins physical book is very overpriced, his ebook is useless as it isn't the same as the physical book...got mine refunded.

 

[Abrams96]

I think now I am going to use just fluorite as it seems much less hassle for similar if not better results that dirted. Dustins physical book is very overpriced, his ebook is useless as it isn't the same as the physical book...got mine refunded.

His book is very over priced I agree. Diana walstads ecology of the planted aquarium is probably the best book out there. Its much more scientific then dustins but it has excellent info..I believe the ebook is only around 10 dollars. I use dirt and its been totally hassle free. Only downside is if you often move your plants around, even then its not that bad. Your choice but its worth a read anyway. Good luck with whatever you choose.

 

[misterc007]

I use flourite I don't have any complaints. Your going to have to use root tabs in anything you use anyway. Flora max is cheaper and I think its the same thing. I just saw it for 8.64 a bag