Dosing liquid C02, will dwarf hairgrass or dw baby tears be best?

[cebalrai]

20 gal long moderately heavily planted tank. Threadfin rainbows, white clouds, and pencilfish... And a few RCS. I'd like to get a carpet going without a Co2 system, just Flourish Excel (and other ferts if I might need them). Will either of these plants work? Will one work better? Neither? Thanks.

Edit: Oh and I have a FugeRay Planted+ light, Eheim 2211 cannister...

 

[ImACoolguy]

From my understanding baby tears NEED co2 to succeed.


Caleb

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[cebalrai]

From my understanding baby tears NEED co2 to succeed.


Caleb

Sent via TARDIS

Rats.

And what about dwarf hairgrass?

 

[ImACoolguy]

Rats.

And what about dwarf hairgrass?

With good lighting and ferts it might work. I'll let the planted peeps verify this though.


Caleb

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[azmodan]

Skip the HC, it's not worth the frustration without co2. I've seen DHG succeed for certain people in lowtech tanks but this was under very specific conditions (EI ferts, dirted tank, very high light). Even if it did work for you I'd imagine the growth to be very very slow. Micranthemum monte carlo or Ranalisma rostrata would probably work for you if you start dosing ferts. If you could get some coming from a lowtech tank already it might give it a better chance but assuming your glut dosage is high enough and your ferts are on point I'd give it a shot.


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[cebalrai]

Skip the HC, it's not worth the frustration without co2. I've seen DHG succeed for certain people in lowtech tanks but this was under very specific conditions (EI ferts, dirted tank, very high light). Even if it did work for you I'd imagine the growth to be very very slow. Micranthemum monte carlo or Ranalisma rostrata would probably work for you if you start dosing ferts. If you could get some coming from a lowtech tank already it might give it a better chance but assuming your glut dosage is high enough and your ferts are on point I'd give it a shot.


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Thanks for the advice. Out of MMC or RR are their any significant differences or variables I should know about?

 

[azmodan]

Not really, both should have similar requirements although the RR is likely the easier of the two. Fert wise I'd say they probably need more than your average liquid ferts. A dry fert regiment of something like PPS pro will ensure that they're getting enough nutrients. I would look to dose a reasonably high amount of glut from the start too.

Do you have any plans to go pressurized or Diy co2 in the future?

 

[aqua_chem]

To get a good carpet effect, you almost always need CO2. True, someone always can think of that one example of someone that did it under XYZ circumstances, but for each case like that there's a multitude of spectacular failures that leaves someone feeling rotten.

 

[cebalrai]

Not really, both should have similar requirements although the RR is likely the easier of the two. Fert wise I'd say they probably need more than your average liquid ferts. A dry fert regiment of something like PPS pro will ensure that they're getting enough nutrients. I would look to dose a reasonably high amount of glut from the start too.

Do you have any plans to go pressurized or Diy co2 in the future?

Hmm, the MC looks a bit more attractive IMO.

As far as CO2, the tank is on a counter and while our kitchen is rather large, I'm prefer not to have a CO2 tank in sight.... I don't know much about CO2 systems though, is there one that's small (only 20 gal here) and presentable?

 

[aqua_chem]

You can get smaller ones, but they'll need to be filled more frequently. Alternatively, you can stash it somewhere out of sight and have a long line running to it from your hidey hole.

 

[cebalrai]

You can get smaller ones, but they'll need to be filled more frequently. Alternatively, you can stash it somewhere out of sight and have a long line running to it from your hidey hole.

The problem is that I don't really have a hidey hole because it's on a countertop. I have an Eheim 2211 next to it and sort of behind it and it's not too bad...

Can you or anyone else recommend a small pressurized CO2 system with a good reputation?

 

[azmodan]

Aquatek mini paintball regulator with a 20oz paintball tank would be a solid option.

 

[ImACoolguy]

Aquatek mini paintball regulator with a 20oz paintball tank would be a solid option.

That's what I use. Worked flawlessly so far.


Caleb

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[cebalrai]

Thanks. How long does a tank last you?

 

[azmodan]

I have 24 oz cans and on my 29g it lasts probably 3-4 months. I just always keep one spare can filled so there's always a full one on hand.

 

[ImACoolguy]

Really depends on how much u dose. My 20oz lasted me 4 months on a 75g moderately planted.


Caleb

Sent via TARDIS

 

[cebalrai]

Looks like there's a place that sells CO2 near me actually.

Okay so I'd need a paintball CO2 tank, regulator, and what else?

 

[azmodan]

If you go with the Aquatek mini paintball setup it'll come with a bubble counter and co2 tubing (depending what site you buy it from). You'll also need a diffuser and a drop checker with 4dkh solution. The drop checker and solution I'd just buy on eBay. For the diffuser I'd just go with a Fluval ceramic diffuser from Amazon. They're really cheap but also pretty effective, and once you get the hang of things you can always then get a fancier one. I like the Atomic diffusers myself.

Aquatek mini paintball regulator (w/ bubble counter and co2 tubing) - $90
Paintball tank - $20 (I keep an extra handy that's always filled)
Diffuser - $5.50 (for the Fluval)
Drop checker and solution - $10 on eBay

I refill my tanks at Sports Authority, costs about $3.50 for my 24 oz tanks.

 

[cebalrai]

If you go with the Aquatek mini paintball setup it'll come with a bubble counter and co2 tubing (depending what site you buy it from). You'll also need a diffuser and a drop checker with 4dkh solution. The drop checker and solution I'd just buy on eBay. For the diffuser I'd just go with a Fluval ceramic diffuser from Amazon. They're really cheap but also pretty effective, and once you get the hang of things you can always then get a fancier one. I like the Atomic diffusers myself.

Aquatek mini paintball regulator (w/ bubble counter and co2 tubing) - $90
Paintball tank - $20 (I keep an extra handy that's always filled)
Diffuser - $5.50 (for the Fluval)
Drop checker and solution - $10 on eBay

I refill my tanks at Sports Authority, costs about $3.50 for my 24 oz tanks.

Thanks. How do you know how much CO2 to use?

 

[Vlado21]

Thanks. How do you know how much CO2 to use?

Start at lower rate (30 bubbles/ min), then you can speed up if necessary...

To know whether you are "in range", use "indirect" method : measuring pH and KH, then chek the table: How to measure co2 in a planted tank | Aquariums Life (just note, that the legend bellow the table is wrong: red means "not enough CO2" in the water, yellow means "too much CO2").

or you can measure CO2 in water it directly, using a drop checker (the same link +
Carbon Dioxide Systems - Aquarium Advice )