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Old 03-11-2018, 07:23 PM   #1
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Gonna stop using excel

From what I've read on many forums excel really does not add as much co2 as atmospheric pressure produces, plus excel in this document is shown to harm fish and actually break down cells in plants leading to killing the plant itself, In short it's wasting money as excel adds about 2 ppm where as doing nothing adds 25 times that, maybe this is incorrect but I want your all opinions on it.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1c8F...JFOGfoGUl/view
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Old 03-12-2018, 04:59 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Potluck View Post
From what I've read on many forums excel really does not add as much co2 as atmospheric pressure produces, plus excel in this document is shown to harm fish and actually break down cells in plants leading to killing the plant itself, In short it's wasting money as excel adds about 2 ppm where as doing nothing adds 25 times that, maybe this is incorrect but I want your all opinions on it.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1c8F...JFOGfoGUl/view
Even if plants can't use the carbon the excel provides, what it does do is help degrade some protein/algae film that builds up over plant leaves, thus allowing them to utilize the carbon dissolved in from the atmosphere.
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Old 03-12-2018, 05:04 PM   #3
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Even if plants can't use the carbon the excel provides, what it does do is help degrade some protein/algae film that builds up over plant leaves, thus allowing them to utilize the carbon dissolved in from the atmosphere.
But in that pdf the science shows it breaks down cells in fish and plants causing them harm
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Old 03-12-2018, 06:37 PM   #4
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I use it but 'unconventionally' to say the least.
I get the metricide [2 or 4 times stronger then excel] and either install it with a syringe/turkey baster or with a spray bottle !
I spray some plants and the glass when I drop my water level on big water changes in some tanks.
I am either using it to kill algae or as a sterilizer/sanitizer as mild as it may be...
I let it sit on glass or plants a couple minutes then I just fill the tank up.
Never had a problem with this method.
As for killing algae ,oh yea this stuff kills !
I look at its use like a med. The stronger the dose the larger the form of life you will eradicate .
I am not certain but it sounds like they really pushed the amount on fish test and if they think fish farms are soaking the eggs and their fry like they tested they are either ignorant or lied to IMO..I am sure they use a broadcast method where overall dilution is much larger [like I do with a spray bottle ] . I have seen where fish farms treat their eggs for fungus for under 2 minutes and then they go into clean water with nothing...
It is a sterilizer ..
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Old 03-12-2018, 07:19 PM   #5
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I have been trying to make sense of it, yeah they could of over exposed when doing studies as they usually do, but I don't have algae and excel really does not add carbon in a high enough amount to benefit the plants as far as growing, I've been discussing this all morning and planted tank hobbyists are like you CB as they only use it to spot treat algae not to supplement co2, thrive is coming out with a new fert with liquid carbon source in it that is not glut, it's non harmful to fish, plants /inverts, it's not been released yet as it's still in the testing process, I ran across 2 people that are very close to Tom Barr and actually work for nilcog, you should see their low tech tanks I mean what in the..... They are absolutely crazy and they don't inject co2 they use Citric acid which is an alternate?? I understand that excel does help break down algae but I'm just worried about the health of me, my fish and the plants.
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Old 03-12-2018, 07:46 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Potluck View Post
I have been trying to make sense of it, yeah they could of over exposed when doing studies as they usually do, but I don't have algae and excel really does not add carbon in a high enough amount to benefit the plants as far as growing, I've been discussing this all morning and planted tank hobbyists are like you CB as they only use it to spot treat algae not to supplement co2, thrive is coming out with a new fert with liquid carbon source in it that is not glut, it's non harmful to fish, plants /inverts, it's not been released yet as it's still in the testing process, I ran across 2 people that are very close to Tom Barr and actually work for nilcog, you should see their low tech tanks I mean what in the..... They are absolutely crazy and they don't inject co2 they use Citric acid which is an alternate?? I understand that excel does help break down algae but I'm just worried about the health of me, my fish and the plants.

At risk of sounding like an enlightened preacher as a former user of this stuff Iíd like to say that a) this stuff helps plants grow, no question but b) it kills stuff. Iíve pushed it and pushed it and canít really say for certain it did any harm but theres the snag. I canít be certain. Only since I stopped certain practices have I really seen what it is like to have a truly healthy tank and I now intend to keep it that way. No more glut for me....even for algae control. Stuff is not for aquariums.
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Old 03-12-2018, 08:10 PM   #7
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They are absolutely crazy and they don't inject co2 they use Citric acid which is an alternate??
You mean this stuff ?!!


There are several different ways to carbon dose safely and cheaply.
I vodka dosed a reef tank for over a year and now am in the process of starting vinegar dosing on my newly moved reef. I gave the vitamin C a shot a couple years ago but I don't think I understood it completely back then. I used that product in picture [still have it].
Most in reefs use these tools for nitrate and some PO4 reduction with focus on nitrate. Most fresh water people have only looked at these same product as a nitrate reduction tool instead of a plant 'supplement' . Most just conceited that water changes were easier then dosing a small amount like 15ml per 100g once or divided into twice a day.. ?
Like I said before I am not the plant guy but I still use many of the same tools in different applications . The dosing is an easy learning curve and I can link you what the reefers do with vinegar...
Kind of funny to me after you find out some add vinegar [or vodka] to their tanks daily when others are nervous they didn't rinse their new tank well enough and the may be some 'residue' !
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Old 03-12-2018, 09:03 PM   #8
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I beleive the citric acid mentioned is referring to the method of DIY CO2 generation (citric acid + baking soda as opposed to yeast + sugar). I have yet to try it but if I were to do DIY CO2, I would use that method.
Some may remember AA member Rivercats: she ran a 220g high tech densely planted tank solely on glut. The plants grew well despite the lack of CO2 (though down the road pressurized CO2 entered the picture).
When I ran a planted tank I used glut as a carbon supplement but primarily as an algaecide.
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Old 03-12-2018, 09:15 PM   #9
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I beleive the citric acid mentioned is referring to the method of DIY CO2 generation (citric acid + baking soda as opposed to yeast + sugar). I have yet to try it but if I were to do DIY CO2, I would use that method.
Some may remember AA member Rivercats: she ran a 220g high tech densely planted tank solely on glut. The plants grew well despite the lack of CO2 (though down the road pressurized CO2 entered the picture).
When I ran a planted tank I used glut as a carbon supplement but primarily as an algaecide.
Yes it's the same thing, Citric acid and baking soda, these tanks are totally beyond my imagination for low tech no co2, had no idea they could be this amazing
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Old 03-12-2018, 09:18 PM   #10
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You mean this stuff ?!!


There are several different ways to carbon dose safely and cheaply.
I vodka dosed a reef tank for over a year and now am in the process of starting vinegar dosing on my newly moved reef. I gave the vitamin C a shot a couple years ago but I don't think I understood it completely back then. I used that product in picture [still have it].
Most in reefs use these tools for nitrate and some PO4 reduction with focus on nitrate. Most fresh water people have only looked at these same product as a nitrate reduction tool instead of a plant 'supplement' . Most just conceited that water changes were easier then dosing a small amount like 15ml per 100g once or divided into twice a day.. ?
Like I said before I am not the plant guy but I still use many of the same tools in different applications . The dosing is an easy learning curve and I can link you what the reefers do with vinegar...
Kind of funny to me after you find out some add vinegar [or vodka] to their tanks daily when others are nervous they didn't rinse their new tank well enough and the may be some 'residue' !
Lol I hear you, remember when I cleaned my lids with vinegar I was freaking out haha, I have the tutorial on Citric acid + baking soda I just don't really trust things I know it works but I also don't know what it does to the fish.

They actually told me with my kh being 6 it would not be a good idea to introduce co2 or anything acidic
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