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QuantumCranker

Aquarium Advice Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2005
Messages
39
Location
Rocky Mount, NC
Or anyone else that knows.

First of all, your 125G is absolutely amazing. My question is, How do you keep your PH up for cichlids but also keep co2 up enough for the plants? My PH is 6 out of the tap and my kh is 1 deg. I have a 55 gallon planted tank with pressurized CO2 . I want to keep my PH at around 7 but still want to keep my CO2 level around 30 ppm. Can you explain how this is possible?
Tanks,
Randy
 
That's a good question. I buffer my water using sodium bicarbonate. This puts my initial water conditions around 8.0-8.1 pH with a KH of 12-14 prior to CO2 injection. CO2 supplementation drops the pH down to around 7.2 but does not affect the KH so I end up with pH 7.2, KH 12-14, and CO2 right in the 25-30 ppm range.

I don't have the formula for sodium bicarb and its effects on pH and KH. I use 4 TBLSPNS of baking soda in 1000 mL of water. Each 100 mL increases my KH by approximately 1 dKH in my 125G.
 
Great, so I'm on the right track. I've added 1 tsp every 2hrs for a total of 4 tsp. I do it by filling a tumbler glass with water from the tank, addidng the baking soda to the glass and stirring it up well, then pouring it back in my tank. So far it's at 6.4 roughly. I'll test my KH shortly. One more Q, When it comes time for the weekly 40% WC (I use a Python) , Whens the best time and whats the best way to add it back to avoid a crazy flux?
 
I use a Python as well. I add the premixed bicarb as I am putting the water back in to keep the pH/KH from spiking or dropping too much. I've been doing it for over a year now and haven't had any problems :)
 
Well I have gradually after what seemed like 20 or more teaspoons of soda, raised my PH to 6.6. But my Kh is now 16 8O I don't get it, According to the gadd calculator, thats about 128 ppm of co2. This cant be. Let me just say I haven't added ANY chemical buffers of ANY kind to the tank, I haven't even used stress-coat. EVER. What gives? This stuff doesn't make any sense! What am I missing? I was going to shoot for 6.8-7.0 but not now. I thought they would both (kh and ph) rise in the same scale, keeping the co2 content basically the same. I started with Kh 1 and pH 6. 30 ppm CO2. Could it be the phosphate in the fleet enema I use? PO4 is usually kept at 1.0-1.5 ppm
HELP!
 
At this point I would definitely not add any more baking soda. I think you should do some testing with your tap water using smaller (but proportional) amounts of baking soda to find out how it affects the pH/KH outside of your tank so you don't put your fish and plants at risk.

The parameters you list could indicate a few things: 1] You have a bad pH test kit or incorrectly calibrated pH controller and are not getting accurate readings. You might try having you pH tested at your LFS to verify your test results; 2] You really do have 128 ppm CO2 (but this is unlikely because your fish would be surface gasping or dead) and the readings are accurate; 3] As you suspect, you may have other buffering agents in your water column that are skewing the results, although I don't think 1 ppm of PO4 is going to cause any issues with phosphate buffering throwing them off.

This is a strange one for sure. If anyone else has any comments or suggestions please feel free to contribute.
 
See, this is really bumming me out. I don't understand it. I will try tonight to narrow the cause down. I know that the fish in there now , mollies,gambusia,and otto are all absolutley in perfect health so I just don't see the CO2 being 120 ppm . and I am absolutely positive i have No PH/buffer additives. Just flourish,greenlight,and fleet. I'm thinking/hoping bad test kit. If anyone knows how to mix a quick reference with baking sodaand distilled water, let me know so I can check my kit.
 
One source of the problem could be that Travis was talking about Tablespoons (TBSP) and you were talking about teaspoons (TSP)!!
 
That has absolutely nothing to do with it. Look at the numbers. A ph of 6.6 with a KH of 16? I doesn't matter if I had used cups of soda, the numbers shouldn't be that out of whack. Travis' tank is almost 2.5 times the size of mine. I SHOULD be using TEAspoons to do my measuring for better control in my volume of water,IMO .
Sorry if that came off as harsh, but this is frustrating enough.
 
Yikes 8O That was a little harsh. :wink:

Look, I didn't go in depth into your problem, I just noticed that you were both using different units of measure. Since you weren't doing it blinding, but monitoring your ph and kh changes, then you are correct it doesn't matter. Good luck.
 
They make tests that test for CO2 directly. Rather than use the chart try testing directly. In my case, the CO2 direct test usually is within a few PPM of the chart readings.
 
Well, I think I may have found the problem. My wife, bless her heart, :oops: (she hasn't had a planted tank before.), said she added a cap full of stress coat on the last water change. I was out of town and she couldn't reach me to ask. (my fault) So I looked at the stress coat bottle, "Neutralizes heavy metals" Could this be the cause? I just checked my PH kit and it seems to be accurate. on my tap water. 6.0. Added a pinch of baking soda to the glass and it shot to 7.6
 
That can not be the problem.

The chemical formula for baking soda is NaHCO3. It does not contain any heavy metals (copper, lead, mercury, chromium, cadmium, arsenic, etc.).
 
Have you considered turning down your CO2 (if its preasureized turn down the bubble count and if it DIY bleed off some of the CO2 being produced)?
I would assume you have that much CO2.. (work with the what is maybe the least likely, I dont think its impossible by the way you can still have plenty of O2 in the water and have high CO2 consentrations, yet workable problem)
 
I wasnt trying to say that really high CO2 cant have a bad effect on your fish, I was asumming that your fish have only been exposed to it for a couple of days tops and that there is time to fix it before the ill effects of high CO2 take in.. HTH

Ive read about high CO2 causing very strange behavior in fish, if it continues you might see something strange.. like vertical fish. I hope you get the problem sloved in time :?
 
czcz said:
There is no pH controller?

On the Christmas list with the wife! 8)

Well, I bumped the BPM WAY down yesterday as soon as I read your advice. Today is WC day so, we'll see what happens. I'm only gonna do about 25% and I'm gonna do it really slow because I have now gotten my tanks PH to 6.7 and the kh still tests at 11. But the tap water here is 6.0 at 1 deg. KH I'm hoping to bring the KH down a bit but still have it at a good buffering capacity, say 5 or better, but still keep my PH as close to 7 as possible. The scary thing about acidics is the dilution rate needed to neutralize them. When I was in HazMat technician school, I learned that to bring the PH of 1 gallon of sulfuric acid to a PH of 6 would require around 16,819,200 gallons of water, depending on the PH of the water. 8O Just a little trivia.
 
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