Quartz Crystal?

[monsteridea]

Does anyone have any experience with putting quartz crystals in your planted tanks? I know that there is research on how it purifies the water...

Just want to wait a couple weeks with the Fluval before putting anything live (other than plants) in there, to make sure the plants are well acclimated and there aren't any kinks going on with the water or setup.. one of the crypts seemed a bit down. I put in a couple quartz crystal points in there and it did seem like some of the plants perked up.

I'm also doing small WCs every couple days, and adding a little Flourish Excel.

 

[PB_Smith]

Uhmmm, just did a search for it and only came up with New Age, witchcraft malarkey.
do you have any real scientific research for this?

They at least look pretty in a tank, but I have serious doubts that they impact water quality one way or another.

 

[monsteridea]

Yeah, upon a simple Google search you do get the sites that pay to be first and not extremely scientific.

Of course, I'm not talking about some "magical" property, but the components of the rock itself. It's been studied in geology, mineralogy, radiology, etc.

Preparation and characterization of TiO2 photocatalysts supported on various rigid supports (glass, quartz and stainless steel). Comparative studies of photocatalytic activity in water purification

Quartz-rich fluids play an important role in slow earthquakes that last for hours to days.

The Legacy of Marcel Vogel

Effect of Quartz Sand Coated with Water-Treatment Residuals as Arsenic Adsorbent

Dissolution and rheological behaviour of hematite and quartz particles in aqueous media at pH 1

Reversible water weakening of quartz

Molecular modeling of interactions between heavy crude oil and the soil organic matter coated quartz surface

 

[PB_Smith]

Hmmm, ok how do I go about this without sounding like a complete jerk????

Did you read any of the articles/abstracts you linked?
Not a single one has anything to do with quartz purifying water.
shall I break it down?

this one;
Preparation and characterization of TiO2 photocatalysts supported on various rigid supports (glass, quartz and stainless steel). Comparative studies of photocatalytic activity in water purification
is about coating different materials with Titanium Dioxide. It's the Titanium Dioxide that is doing something, not the quartz.
these ones are along the same lines as quartz is merely being used as a substrate for some type of coating;
Molecular modeling of interactions between heavy crude oil and the soil organic matter coated quartz surface
Effect of Quartz Sand Coated with Water-Treatment Residuals as Arsenic Adsorbent

these are about how quartz breaks down or is affected by water/water pressure;
Reversible water weakening of quartz
Dissolution and rheological behaviour of hematite and quartz particles in aqueous media at pH 1

this one is about how areas with high concentrations of quartz influence the behavior of earthquakes;
Quartz-rich fluids play an important role in slow earthquakes that last for hours to days.

and this one is complete fringe science and far from actual science, regardless of the credentials of it's author;
The Legacy of Marcel Vogel

So I ask again, any science supporting the idea that putting quartz crystals into water will purify it?



ps. if you are going to post links to support an argument, it is usually a good idea to make sure they actually support your premise and always assume the other guy will actually check them out.

 

[PB_Smith]

Yeah, upon a simple Google search you do get the sites that pay to be first and not extremely scientific.

Of course, I'm not talking about some "magical" property, but the components of the rock itself. It's been studied in geology, mineralogy, radiology, etc.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0926337395000267
http://www.livescience.com/46386-what-causes-slow-slip-earthquakes.html
http://www.vogelcrystals.net/legacy_of_marcel_vogel.htm
http://www.scientific.net/AMR.663.1064
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0263876214001105
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0012821X13002938
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0045653514007668

you entered them all as one link and it only goes to the first one. I was able to check each link via my email notification. My links are the same as yours, but not in the same order as you posted.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say it was the fertilizers you added that perked the plants up, not crystals.

 

[monsteridea]

Maybe I was wrong to use the word 'purify.'

Those articles are NOT all specifically talking about water purification (which, I mentioned, was probably the wrong term for it), but rather a process/catalyst/effect that quartz has on its environment. I tried to explain that in the post with the links but apparently wasn't as clear about it.. Sorry.

Excel itself did not perk up the plants, as they were doing "just okay" before. Sure, I suppose it could be a coincidence. At the very least, the added rocks could be acting as a buffer as it did lower the hardness quite a bit from just yesterday.

IN Addition: What is Quartz? Silicon Dioxide/silica. So... as simple as it is, it's definitely not "unfounded" to think that it does something helpful for plants/water, seeing as how it's used in and naturally found in pretty much everything. Not to mention it being used in gardens, supplements, etc.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I thought on Diatom's feed on silicon as well? And in a round about way, they do "purify" the water. Hmmm...

 

[PB_Smith]

Maybe I was wrong to use the word 'purify.'

Those articles are NOT all specifically talking about water purification (which, I mentioned, was probably the wrong term for it), but rather a process/catalyst/effect that quartz has on its environment. I tried to explain that in the post with the links but apparently wasn't as clear about it.. Sorry.

Excel itself did not perk up the plants, as they were doing "just okay" before. Sure, I suppose it could be a coincidence. At the very least, the added rocks could be acting as a buffer as it did lower the hardness quite a bit from just yesterday.

IN Addition: What is Quartz? Silicon Dioxide/silica. So... as simple as it is, it's definitely not "unfounded" to think that it does something helpful for plants/water, seeing as how it's used in and naturally found in pretty much everything. Not to mention it being used in gardens, supplements, etc.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I thought on Diatom's feed on silicon as well? And in a round about way, they do "purify" the water. Hmmm...

Well generally silica is considered a nuisance in a tank because diatoms do "feed" on it, so that theory isn't very solid.

Quartz crystals do posses some unique qualities, but those qualities all relate to it's electrical, sound, visual and mechanical properties.

There is lots and lots of speculative New Age theories concerning crystals, but quite frankly I have NEVER seen any research or science to actually support such claims, and I do check out stuff like this.

When you speak of it being a process/catalyst/effect could you be more specific as to exactly what you think the crystals are actually doing to "purify" or alter the water?

Quartz crystal will not break down and contribute any buffering (wrong type of mineral) nor will it break down/dissolve at the temps and pressures in a home aquarium.

 

[monsteridea]

Well, the statement of diatoms feeding on silica IS solid and confirmed. Sure, it's maybe a nuisance to some, but algae and other microbugs do 'clean' the water.

It's still open for debate, in my opinion. There may be anecdotal evidence for using the larger pieces of quartz in this way, but it seems that it may not be as much of an effect as it's smaller parts like in silica sand or powders which can be more easily "fed" on.

Obviously, light refraction and focus may also play a part.

 

[dalto]

It's still open for debate, in my opinion. There may be anecdotal evidence for using the larger pieces of quartz in this way, but it seems that it may not be as much of an effect as it's smaller parts like in silica sand or powders which can be more easily "fed" on.

In order to have a debate, it would helpful if some actual information was presented. The only thing I have seen thus far is the theory that quartz leaches silicates into the water which causes diatom bloom which is good for aquarium water.

Although I understand what you are saying, I am not sure I follow the logic behind diatoms helping plant growth.

Obviously, light refraction and focus may also play a part.

Huh? What are light refraction and focus playing a part of?

 

[aqua_holic]

IN Addition: What is Quartz? Silicon Dioxide/silica. So... as simple as it is, it's definitely not "unfounded" to think that it does something helpful for plants/water, seeing as how it's used in and naturally found in pretty much everything. Not to mention it being used in gardens, supplements, etc.

Most sand is made of Quartz. So by that rational, using normal sand (as opposed to calcium based) would be beneficial to the water.

 

[PB_Smith]

Well, the statement of diatoms feeding on silica IS solid and confirmed. Sure, it's maybe a nuisance to some, but algae and other microbugs do 'clean' the water.

It's still open for debate, in my opinion. There may be anecdotal evidence for using the larger pieces of quartz in this way, but it seems that it may not be as much of an effect as it's smaller parts like in silica sand or powders which can be more easily "fed" on.

Obviously, light refraction and focus may also play a part.

again, the problem is that quartz WILL NOT leach anything into the water at the temps, pressures and ph that are present in aquariums.
If you had actually looked at the articles you linked you would have noticed that one of them dealing with the breakdown/leaching of quartz started with a solution with a ph of 1 and mixing/agitating at between 600-1000 RPM's, and temps ranging from 25c-100c, that is friggin HOT!!!.
I pity the fish that live in that tank;

"In this study we investigate isothermal, atmospheric acid dissolution behaviour of quartz and hematite minerals which constitute two of the predominant host gangue phases of typical low grade limonitic laterite ores. Batch dissolution tests were carried out on 57 wt.% solid dispersions for 4 h at pH 1 and 25 and 70 °C to establish the influential role of oxide mineralogy/chemistry on rheology and leaching behaviour. The results show that the two minerals displayed a weakly temperature and time-independent, non-Newtonian rheological behaviour with low shear yield stresses (<4 Pa) and viscosities (9–17 mPa s). Hematite dissolution rate was significantly higher compared with that of quartz under similar conditions. Quartz dissolution mechanism was substantially volume diffusion controlled at lower agitation rate (600 rpm) whilst for hematite it was both volume diffusion and chemical reaction controlled. These mechanisms reflected activation energies of 17.7 ± 0.9 and 28.5 ± 1.4 kJ/mol, respectively, for quartz and hematite. At 800 and 1000 rpm, dissolution of both minerals was chemical reaction-controlled with similar activation energies (32.6 ± 1.7 and 32.2 ± 1.6 kJ/mol). The findings underscore the need for higher agitation rates and elevated temperatures, to overcome both volume diffusion and chemical reaction limitations for enhanced acid leaching of these two fairly refractory oxides studied herein"


But if you like the way the crystals look in your tank, go or it, but they are not doing anything one way or another.

 

[Sk3lly]

Such a pointless discussion........ IMO


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[dalto]

Such a pointless discussion........ IMO

Any thread in which the second post contains the phrase "New Age, witchcraft malarkey" has to at least be upgraded to from "pointless" to "amusing"

 

[PB_Smith]

Any thread in which the second post contains the phrase "New Age, witchcraft malarkey" has to at least be upgraded to from "pointless" to "amusing"

 

[Sk3lly]

Any thread in which the second post contains the phrase "New Age, witchcraft malarkey" has to at least be upgraded to from "pointless" to "amusing"

Very true lol


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[Delapool]

Following. I can't think of any way except as a quartz sand bed (with underground filtration) and that's really mechanical filtration. I can't even think of anything as devils advocate.

 

[Brookster123]

I think my heater has some quartz in there?? Water is nice and warm!! Filters works pretty good for water quality

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[PB_Smith]

To be fair I honestly was curious if there were some method of utilizing quartz as a water purification treatment. I'm always open to new things.
But when I tried to look for anything relating to the topic I came up with two main results, one being a company that sells water purification systems named "Crystal Quartz", numerous sites/articles/links for New Age, Wiccan, and various other metaphysical or fringe science uses of crystals, and finally water treatment facilities/equipment that do use quartz either in set-ups described in my above post or utilizing quartz's unique properties relating to pressure and electrical conductance.

So I was eager to dive into the links the OP provided in the hopes of learning something new, but alas I was thoroughly disappointed whenever it became apparent that all the OP did was enter quartz and water into a search engine and grabbed the best sounding links without actually checking them out. All I did was actually read the links provided and explain them.

Had a similar "discussion" with someone a few years ago on another site, HubPages, in which he did the same thing, grabbed sensational "headlines" but never actually bothered to check them and assumed I wouldn't either........big mistake.

But quartz crystals do look cool and I could envision some pretty cool décor using them in a tank, so don't let me prevent you from using as many crystals in your tank as you want, monsteridea, after all, it is your tank.

 

[BillD]

Quartz in the form of silica sand,(either bought as blasting sand or Pool Filter Sand) is commonly used in aquariums as a substrate. Whether it adds to diatom growth is debatable, as it is basically inert and doesn't dissolve in the water.