snail experience???

[happygirl65]

It would seem that I had some common pond snail hitch hikers on my plants....one plant looks unbothered, one is starting to get holes in what appear to be perfectly healthy leaves. Are the snails the culprit? It is a red wendtii crypt that has gotten a bunch of new leaves since I put it in a few weeks ago.

I have a 55 gal with low light and am looking to plant lots more plants this week.

Should I get a loach of somekind?
What are your recommendations to take care of the snail problems? I know that clowns get too large.

What are your recommendations?

 

[plecoperson]

You need to find out what kind of snails you have in your tank-can you post a picture? Some will eat plants and some won't (most don't).

 

[bs6749]

You will probably hear "don't just buy a fish to get rid of the problem" from some members on this forum. I tend to disagree. If you buy a fish to get rid of your snails, then it has done its job. You could either keep the fish, give it away, or try selling it, it is your choice.

Their argument may be that you should not own a fish unless you like it. I have 4 danios, that I do not really like and the only reason I bought them was to try to prevent my GBR's from constatnly picking on one another and hopefully go for the danios some of the time. This didn't work and since I purchased the 6, 2 have died, which didn't bother me one bit. I look at them as a sort of feeder fish and they do not seem to be all that smart or interesting in my opinion. The only nice thing about them is that they are constantly moving.

Sorry for getting off topic. You will want to buy some sort of a loach if you want no snails at all. I suggest yo-yo loaches (also called Pakastani loaches) to do the job. I have had great success with them clearing out snails in the past and they do it fast. They only get about 3 inches long or so and are one of the more active species of loach. Depending on how bad your snail problem is, and the number of other tank inhabitants, I would purchase between 2-5 of them for a tank that size. My snails (heavily infested 29 gallon tank) were ALL gone within a week after introducing 2 yo-yo loaches.

Just to ensure compatibility, please list the types of fish in your tank, if you have any at all.

 

[happygirl65]

Here are some pictures of the first snail I pulled out. I put it in a jar in order to get a better look at it.

I dont mind having snails IF they dont eat my plants, I just want to know whether they will or not, and I suspect they are since there are some holes in one of my plants.

An internet search seems to indicate that this is the physa acuta snail. As the pictures on the net seem very similar to the ones I have pulled from the tank.

I dont mind adding loaches as a permanent addition.

I do have a few cherry barbs and some lemon teras and 4 cory paleatus. That is it.

I am still debating on angels or gouramis and how many but definitely have flexibility room.

 

[Mosaic]

I would think holes in the middle of the leaves would be more of a deficiency problem, where as nibbles on the edges of the leaves would be someone eating it.
I have not had any problems with physa snails eating my plants, although when I had your particular species I didn't let them stick around too long (so they wouldn't compete with my MTS).

 

[GlitcH]

I am a proponent of pond snails.
I personally think they are responsible for my 20G low tech success.

Here is a discussion on snails that you may find helpful:
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/viewtopic.php?t=87197&pc_tzo=-18000&pc_d=20061113&pc_t=18052

 

[7Enigma]

I'm another member that has no problems with snails. I'm breeding the common pond snail (what it appears you have) and MTS as well in my 10gallon QT tank. They will not multiply rapidly nor to a large number if the tank is properly taken care of (ie not a lot of detrius on the substrate).

They will clean the tank of some algae, will eat uneaten food that might be missed, and will give something for the fish to be curious about (in my QT tank I have a single barb that is constantly checking the snails out). They are also very interesting IMO to watch as they have quite the personality for such "low-brained" inverts. Cruising along the glass, mating, floating around the tank, and supplying supplimental food for your fish high in protein and fat (your species is egg laying).

I also believe the holes you are seeing is a nutrient deficiency and not from the snails. All snails are voracious eaters, and can quickly decimate their food source. I would guess if the ones you had were, you would not see leaves with small holes, you'd see stems without leaves!

 

[happygirl65]

Thanks for giving me the positives! It is all really good to know. I really do think they are kind of cool critters too and te kids love to watch them and try to "find them".

Apparently I blamed the poor little guys for something that wasnt their fault. The three leaves with holes are the older leaves that were original to the plant. I have since gotten MANY new leaves that seem unaffected.

I am still trying to figure out this whole fert thing. I have been using up my "leaf zone' until I figure out the dry ferts and get more plants in my tank. I didn't want to over do it and have the algae go nuts.

7, I got all the dry stuff you suggested from gregwatson.com but now have no clue what to do with it. I was reading some of the stickies last night but didnt have the brainpower left at that point in the day to continue. I will revisit them today and see if it makes more sense.

I have a BUNCH of plants coming on Wednesday so I better get this all figured out soon!

So for now, I will not worry about the snails. Thanks again!

 

[7Enigma]

Potassium sulfate (this is for potassium dosing), can be dosed without fear of causing problems (I like to keep the levels between 20-30ppm). Chuck's planted tank calculator (google for it), is a small program that will calculate dry fert dosing for you. You just plug in your tank size and the target level you want (say 20ppm), and it will tell you how much to dose. Very handy!

Potassium nitrAte is used for nitrAte dosing. ~20ppm is a good concentration to shoot for, but you need to measure nitrAte levels as your fish might produce more than your plants need (and thus you wouldn't want to add any more).

CSM+B is your trace (iron) fert. This is tricky to dose since its very concentrated. Many people dose it in liquid form (dissolve it in water then add a little bit from that stock solution). I personally add it in dry. People on here will help you decide how much to dose.

Potassium phosphate is your phosphate fert. VERY LITTLE is used, as general levels of 1-2ppm is normally recommended. Your food may have a lot of phosphate in it, so this needs to be monitored similar to the nitrAte. Phosphate should NEVER be dosed on the same day as the CSM+B as they will react with each other and make it useless.

Please note: All of these ferts have 2 components to the powder. When dissolved in water these dissociate and you need to always make sure your accounting for them. By that I mean DON'T use potassium nitrAte for potassium dosing, as you will overdose on nitrAte. Same thing with potassium phosphate. You'll be hating the PWC's if you dose 30ppm phosphate!

So to reiterate (with commonly recommended tank levels):

potassium sulfate is for potassium (10-30ppm)
potassium nitrAte is for nitrAte (20ppm)
potassium phosphate is for phosphate (1-3ppm)
CSM+B is for iron (traces) (0.2ppm)


HTH

 

[happygirl65]

Thanks 7, that DOES help me. And it does make much more sense in the light of day for some reason...lol.

Do you reccommend a specific test kit for ptassium, phospahtes, and traces?

Do you use the EI?

Or do you test and then add what is needed according to your own schedule?

 

[rich311k]

No kit for potassium and it is not needed anyway. You cant really dose to much. The Seachem phosphate kit is very good for a hobby grade kit.

I use EI and only test for KH and PH to keep tabs on my CO2 production.

Some folks do test regularly for nutrients and aim for levels. It seems like a lot more work to me with no appreciable gains. Many times it doesn't work at nearly as well as EI.

 

[7Enigma]

For kits, as mentioned, you don't need one for potassium. Dose enough frequently enough and never be worried a deficiency symptom is coming from potassium. It's a great feeling to know that you are certain one fert is not the problem. For iron, again there is no inexpensive reliable test. Most of us dose 0.2ppm every other day or so (iron will readily become unusable by plants). For phosphate I have the AP test kit but keep hearing that the Seachem is superior. I'm relatively pleased with mine, and frankly no longer frequently test for it since I dose small amounts every other day.

I use a modified EI approach. That is I monitor my levels and add accordingly but I don't skip a dosing. If I measure too little I obviously add an appropriate amount (say my nitrAte level is showing between 10-20 which is pretty inaccurate on the AP test kit, I'll dose 5-10ppm nitrAte). If I measure within range (for instance phosphate), I will still add a very VERY small amount. I've seen deficiency symptoms (such as GSA) even when my tests show adequate amounts, so I always add in small amounts even when close to proper levels.

One exception would be if I have a very high nitrAte spike such as after a major trimming/rearrangement. In this situation if it makes sense to do a large PWC I will and redose all ferts, otherwise I'll ride out the excessive nutrients until it lowers naturally (say phosphate for instance).

It really is not a cut and dry science because we don't have extremely accurate testing equipment, and just as important you can detect ferts that are in a form NOT usable by plants. Precipitates (still in solution) such as complexed iron/phosphate, might be detected by our kits since many use caustic reagents that can break apart these molecules that your plants could not otherwise use.