Starting a Heavy Planted tank...question

[Raimeiken]

I'm going to start a planted tank soon on my 50 gal. Will the plants survive without a Co2 system? I can't afford that stuff, i'm just going to rely on light.

BTW do you guys know where i can buy driftwoods for a cheap price or at least good price?

 

[MantisX]

I like getting my driftwood from www.floridadriftwood.com. If you are going to do it without c02, I recommend some pretty good light and nutrient system.

 

[Raimeiken]

cool, because i thought the plants won't survuve without a Co2 system. Anyway, I don't really know anything about the fertilizers and plant foods or whatever. Can you enlighten me with your knowledge. Like what's the best fertilizer or plant food.

BTW thx for th link.

 

[Bearfan]

You can go with a simple Hagen CO2 system for cheap and it's better than no CO2.

 

[tkos]

I grow plants like crazy without CO2. You want to keep your lights below 3 wpg (but above 2). More than 3 and you really have to think about getting a CO2 system running. There is CO2 in your water already, extra just helps the plants grow faster. Just make sure to not over fertilize either. Plants require a balance of ferts, light and CO2 to grow. If these get out of wack you usually end up with extra algae growing in the tank.

If you do decide to go with a small hagen sytem or else a DIY popbottle and yeast method, make sure to get your water fully tested so you know the pH, and hardness. CO2 can be really affected by these and can really hurt your water quality fast if you have things like extremely soft water (my brother found that out the hard way).

Plant choice will also be a big help. Easy to grow plants like Java Fern, Java Moss, Crypts and Water Sprite (for example) are good starters.

As for driftwood, well I collected it off the beach, boiled it very well and it is now part of my tank with some lovely java fern growing on it.

 

[Guest]

Aquatic gardeners grew plants for decades without additional CO2. CO2 injection is a relatively new idea in planted tanks. Of course they did not grow some of the demanding plants that we grow now.

 

[Raimeiken]

Awesome info guys. So the fertilizer has to be balanced and stuff.....umm how do i know how much fert to put in the tank? and i have a 48" hood right now, where can i find a 48" 110 watt flourescent bulb? do they even make 110 watt bulbs that are 48"?

 

[Fruitbat]

Raimeiken...

As far as I know there's no such beast as a 110 watt fluorescent that's 48 inches long. What is the wattage of the bulb you have now?

A couple of things to consider:

1) Unless you have VERY high light (3 watts per gallon or more) you won't need additional CO2. The only reason for a CO2 generator is if you have so much light available that the plants are photosynthesizing at a phenomenal rate. Otherwise, plants will do quite well with the carbon dioxide that is naturally present in the tank (absorbed from the air and released by fish).

2) If you add a CO2 generator and the plants are NOT growing at a very fast rate (like under lower light conditions) then the CO2 tends to build up in the water and combine with water molecules to make a weak acid called carbonic acid. This can have adverse effects by lowering the pH of your water.

3) Not ALL plants like high light levels. If you've got your heart set on growing high-light plants then you're probably going to have to make a custom hood to house the additional lights you'll need. Keep in mind that there are PLENTY of very attractive moderate to low-light plants that you can grow at light levels of 1.5 watts per gallon.

4) Do your research and decide what kinds of plants you'd like to have in your tank BEFORE you go out and spend a whole lot of cash on bulbs and CO2 generators. There are plenty of resources on the internet with good information and pictures. Try a google (www.google.com) search on 'Aquarium plants' and see what you can find.

5) Keep in mind the types of fish you intend to put in the tank. Some fish will nibble your plants down to a nub. Tinfoil Barbs, Barbus schwanenfeldi, come to mind. There are plenty of others. South American cichlids are substrate-diggers, by and large, and will quickly uproot most plants you put in the tank with them. African Rift Valley cichlids like very hard, alkaline water. Not a whole lot of plants will do well in a tank like that.

6) Plan....plan....plan!!! You'll save yourself a lot of time and aggravation in the long run (not to mention...cash!).

 

[Guest]

If you want 110 watts in a 48" fixture then go to www.ahsupply.com and get a 2x55 watt upgrade kit.

 

[malkore]

2) If you add a CO2 generator and the plants are NOT growing at a very fast rate (like under lower light conditions) then the CO2 tends to build up in the water and combine with water molecules to make a weak acid called carbonic acid. This can have adverse effects by lowering the pH of your water.

That's not exactly the case...even under 4watts per gallon, adding CO2 lowers the pH...the carbonic acid occurs regardless of light levels.
Most of use CO2 injectors determine our CO2 levels by looking at a chart, where you take carbonate hardness (Kh) and pH, and where the two cross is your CO2 level. This works because in a tank like mine with Kh of 8 degrees and pH of 7.8, I inject CO2 until my pH has dropped to 7.0~7.2, which gives me ideal CO2 levels.
You are correct in saying that a low level light tank, you don't need near as much CO2..getting levels to 15ppm should be beneficial enough..at 3wpg, you'd want 20-35ppm.

 

[Fruitbat]

Yes....the chemical combination of CO2 and water occurs regardless of the light level. HOWEVER...if the plants are using much of the CO2 as fast as it is being released then the carbonic acid doesn't become as much of a problem. In lower light situations...where the CO2 is allowed to build up because the plants aren't using it quickly...the problem with pH drop is much more dramatic.

 

[Raimeiken]

So i can't have just any plant that i want in the tank? So it's going to be like strictly medium light plants and nothing else? anyway, i'm putting peruvian puffers in the tank, which aren't herbivores.

I already checked the AH supply website and thought of getting that 2x55 too. Right now i have the standard light and hood that came with the tank with a 40watt bulb Then i saw one with the same brand but it can hold 3 bulbs for only $99 [including bulbs]. So that'll be like 120watts. Unlike the AH supply, 2x55w is like $64 not including the stupid bulbs, which costs$19 i think. so if you add that up it goes up to $100+ and then i still have to build the freakin hood 8O 8O 8O

Anyway, i was thinking of putting a plant that'll cover the substrate like Glosso, but then i think that stuff is hard to maintain. Then i saw stargrass i'm not sure about this one :? any suggestions?

 

[Punkymom]

Yeah, I went the AH Supply route and it's worth every penny and here's why: I paid $18.99 each for the 55watt 6700k bulbs I needed. They had them at a LFS for $47.99 a piece. You can buy the complete hood all set up ready to go for 55watt bulbs, but it'll probably cost you upwards of $300.00 to do that. I just got my kits put together for my tank and it's by no means done professionally...it's just kind of thrown together actually...but it works! And I saved my single mother self a whole lot of money!!!

 

[Raimeiken]

Yeah, I went the AH Supply route and it's worth every penny and here's why: I paid $18.99 each for the 55watt 6700k bulbs I needed. They had them at a LFS for $47.99 a piece. You can buy the complete hood all set up ready to go for 55watt bulbs, but it'll probably cost you upwards of $300.00 to do that. I just got my kits put together for my tank and it's by no means done professionally...it's just kind of thrown together actually...but it works! And I saved my single mother self a whole lot of money!!!

$300 8O i don't think so, the replacement blubs are only $18 also. heres the link
http://www.petsolutions.com/cgi-bin/cgiitmls?m=ThisP&p=1051.230000&l=1

 

[Raimeiken]

So which substrate should i use. Eco-complete or flourite? I Was thinking of buying eco-complete, but my LFS is selling it for $33 20lb. I'll just buy it online when i decide which one i will buy. Will 2 bags of that be enough for a 50gal 48x12x19

 

[Guest]

Go with the one that has the color you want. And two bags is not nearly enough. You will need a minimum of four bags of either one to get a decent amount of substrate.

 

[betowess]

The AH Supply lights are INDEED about 60% brighter than most all name brand PCs. All because of their reflector.bulb placement design. And it ain't that hard to put a nice box together... They are worth every penny.

You'll be spending some serious penny's on freight for online substrate. Of course you can save a little on sales tax outta state, but the freight usually makes the LFS an option on substrate. HTH.