upgrading!!

[mommytron]

here is what i have now:

tank
20 gal high
tetra whisper 30 internal filter
18" fluorescent strip light w/ 15w 6500k bulb
weekly dose of Flourish Excel (with PWC)

stock
fish:
9 cardinal tetras
6 neon tetras
1 pitbull pleco

plants:
java fern
anubias barteri
anubias barteri nana
crypt wendtii


this is what we will be upgrading:

• replacing existing light fixture with a 24" 48w T5-HO fixture ( Aquarium Lighting T5 Fluorescent Light Fixture: AquaticLife T5 HO Dual Lamp Light Fixtures )
• replace existing filter with an AC50 ( Aquarium Filters: Hagen AquaClear Power Filters )
• instead of dosing excel, i'd like to set up some DIY CO2. i'm thinking 3 juice bottles--two filled with sugar/yeast/tank water mixture, one empty. run a line from each filled bottle into the empty one, then run a line from the empty one into the tank. this is where my first Q comes up
• remove the DW that the two anubias plants are attached to and place them in our other tank. this will free up more room for new plants and possibly a group of 6 corys (still pondering this, i'm thinking with the new filtration it will be doable)

Questions
1.) what would be the best way to diffuse the CO2 into the tank? i know there are glass diffusers you can buy, but i know there are other solutions. i'm just not sure how to go about it.
2.) the new light fixture would put me at 2.4 wpg. would DIY CO2 be sufficient enough to balance the amount of light?
3.) does 2.4 put me at medium light? i'm thinking since the low-light plants are doing so well right now, that 3x the light will allow me to put in medium light plants.
4.) what do you think would be some good medium-light options for this set-up? i'd like to attempt some sort of carpeting plant, some tall background plants, and some sort of moss or floating plant.

this is the tank right now.

 

[fort384]

My answers in blue...

Questions
1.) what would be the best way to diffuse the CO2 into the tank? i know there are glass diffusers you can buy, but i know there are other solutions. i'm just not sure how to go about it.

There are a few different options... a simple airstone can work, or a bubble ladder. I personally would recommend a small glass CO2 diffuser. You can get them very cheap on Ebay.


2.) the new light fixture would put me at 2.4 wpg. would DIY CO2 be sufficient enough to balance the amount of light?

On that size tank, yes, it would work out just fine. The best route would be to do as you described... 2 yeast generator bottles with a gas separator in between. Change out 1 of the bottles per week, alternating weeks so you keep a consistent flow of CO2. The big problem with DIY co2 is keeping up with the mixture changes... unstable CO2 below 20PPM is worse for algae than just having none at all.


3.) does 2.4 put me at medium light? i'm thinking since the low-light plants are doing so well right now, that 3x the light will allow me to put in medium light plants.

I would call it medium to medium high being that it is T5HO over a 20gal tank. I think you could grow medium light plants with no trouble.

4.) what do you think would be some good medium-light options for this set-up? i'd like to attempt some sort of carpeting plant, some tall background plants, and some sort of moss or floating plant.

I would recommend some stem plants for the back... pogostemon species or rotala species. Maybe something with a little color. For the front, I would go with lilaeopsis. It would do a little better imo than HC since you are on the verge of high light. I would worry that the HC would grow up instead of out under that lighting (not high enough to get it to spread horizontally).

What are you planning to dose? I think you will see a requirement for 1 or more of the macros and a good trace mix when you up the light that much.

Good luck!

 

[neilanh]

I agree with all Fort said - good advice right there. Except 48W of T5HO on a 20T tank I don't think you'll have any problems with HC growing out.

Once you venture up into this realm, ferts are going to become necessary very quickly, so just be ready for that as well in addition to the CO2.

 

[fort384]

Except 48W of T5HO on a 20T tank I don't think you'll have any problems with HC growing out.

Yes, Neil is probably right... That is a very good amount of light over a 20.

 

[mommytron]

awesome.

oh! and that was another question i failed to mention. how am i going to know which ferts i will need to dose and how much? should i start with nothing, then see what the plants do, and take it from there? or is there some way to find out what i will need?

also, which test kits will i need in addition to the basic 4 (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, pH)?

i will probably use liquid ferts because it will be easier for me at first. once i am comfortable with those i may venture into the dry ferts to save some money.

 

[fort384]

If you are going to go with liquid ferts, I think that a trace, Potassium, and probably Nitrogen are going to be a must... Phosphorus might become a requirement later on.

You can probably get by without any additional test kits... Potassium (K) is hard to over dose. You already have the Nitrate test kit (N is fertilized via adding Nitrates in the form of KNO3).

I have used a lot of different ferts... I think flourish is the best for the money. I would recommend picking up flourish N, flourish K, and flourish Trace.

Freshwater Planted Aquarium Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Trace Elements Supplement
Freshwater Planted Aquarium Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Nitrogen
Freshwater Plant Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Potassium

However, you may want to relook dry ferts... they aren't difficult and cost just a fraction of what you pay for liquid ferts... with liquid ferts you are paying mostly for water.

You can get dry ferts in a few places... I have used both links below and find them both to be reliable:

http://www.bestaquariumregulator.com/ferts.html
http://www.aquariumfertilizer.com/index.asp

 

[mommytron]

Freshwater Planted Aquarium Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Trace Elements Supplement
Freshwater Planted Aquarium Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Nitrogen
Freshwater Plant Nutrients: Seachem Flourish Potassium

perfect!!! just added them right to my shopping cart i already have going thanks

also, would it be a better idea to wait a week or so to see how my tank reacts to the new light & CO2 before starting to dose ferts? will the ferts harm anything if i put them in and they aren't needed?

 

[fort384]

Start dosing the trace and potassium right away. Test your nitrates after a week with the new lights and dose it accordingly to keep your tank at 10-20ppm.

The nitrates might not be needed with your current plants but if/when you add some stem plants it will be a must with that light I think.

 

[mommytron]

sounds like a plan! thanks so much for your help. do you have any experience with DIY CO2? how do i measure what is going in the tank to make sure it's not too much or too little?

 

[fort384]

Any time! I ran a DIY system for awhile on my 29Gal tank...

Best method is to get a CO2 Drop Checker for CO2 measurement. Check out this thread below. It has a lot of good info about setting up a DIY system, and a little later it discusses measuring the CO2 you have in the water:

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f20/1-4-diy-3-4-purchased-co2-system-136350.html

 

[fort384]

By the way, I have a couple of mini glass diffusers laying around if you decide that is the route you want to go for diffusion... PM your address and I will ship you one for $5 (priority mail shipping cost).

 

[mommytron]

yes! i was looking at a glass diffuser on fosterandsmithaquatics (actaully already had added it to my shopping cart) but that would be even better! trying to save money wherever i can PM sent

 

[mommytron]

Any time! I ran a DIY system for awhile on my 29Gal tank...

Best method is to get a CO2 Drop Checker for CO2 measurement. Check out this thread below. It has a lot of good info about setting up a DIY system, and a little later it discusses measuring the CO2 you have in the water:

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f20/1-4-diy-3-4-purchased-co2-system-136350.html

wow SO HELPFUL! i just bookmarked this link

also, i've had trouble actually finding a drop checker. i was looking over this thread from another forum DIY CO2 Guide with Pictures & Recipes - DIY Aquarium Projects - Aquatic Plant Central it has directions for a DIY drop checker...

Check Valve Prevention System + Yeast Strainer
In order to keep the Yeast Muck from being released into your tank, A bubble counter or separator is used to catch the muck. This DIY bubble counter also provides a check valve system to prevent water from back siphoning out of the aquarium.

A Syringe from Rite Aid, Long Drugs, Walgreens, etc, can be paired with a standard plastic check valve to make this DIY bubble counter.

1.Take the plunger off
2. Add some glue to the check valve
3. Insert check valve and dry for 24 hours.
4. Once dry, the tubing will fit on the end of the check valve, and at the end of the syringe nozzle.
5. Insert this between the diffuser and your reaction bottle.

think i might give this a shot.....but i'm curious....why is it called a bubble counter? does it literally count the bubbles? (i know, dumb question, but i don't really get how it works )

 

[mommytron]

ok LOL. drop checker and bubble counter are two different things. got a little confused there! still confused though as to what exactly each of them does and why it's necessary (not saying i don't want/need them but i just wanna know WHY i do )

 

[fort384]

I don't think you need anything like this.. especially if you intend to put a gas separator into your system. You can just use a $0.50 check valve from petsmart. Granted, CO2 is corrosive, so the checkvalve has to be replaced about every year or so, but that is pretty low cost/easy to do.

As far as a bubble counter, you are going to fill your gas separator bottle up with water, and bubble the co2 into it, so that will serve as your bubble counter. And yes, it literally will allow you to count the bubbles of co2 that come out... you want your system running at around 1 bubble per second (bps) to get your 20 gal tank to the optimum level... granted, it may be a little more than 1bps right after changing out a bottle, and a little less towards the end of the cycle, but it doesn't have to be exact.

I sent it in the PM as well, but the best place to find drop checkers is Ebay. Just search CO2 drop checker.

 

[fort384]

The drop checker measures the CO2 present in the water (read about it on page 2 of that thread I posted before). It is not hooked into your CO2 system in any way. It is stuck on to the inside of your tank... the little thing in the upper right in this pic of my new tank:

 

[fort384]

Here is my old DIY system... the bottles on the far left and far right are yeast generators... never mind that the bottle looks all fancy... a 2L coke bottle will work fine. The gray thing is something I bought before I knew what I was doing... basically $30 for what could have been any ol' bottle.

In the middle is the gas separator. Notice how on the right side, the co2 coming from the yeast generators enters the bottle, travels down the tube and it bubbles out the bottom. The bubbles then come up through the water (you fill the separator with water almost to the top). It then exits the left side, and goes to the tank.

The gas separator serves 2 purposes: It serves as a bubble counter (hence the reason you don't need to build another one, or buy 1). It also will separate any floccuated yeast that may make it out of the yeast generators, keeping it from getting into your tank and making any kind of a mess.

 

[mommytron]

ok so i found a drop checker on e-bay for $10 shipped. perfect! and it looks identical to the one in your tank.

about the gas separator bottle. i was just going to put a little water in the bottom to keep the bottle steady, but not run the line into the water. will letting the CO2 run through water in the bottle (like in your set up) diffuse any CO2 before it reaches the tank? i'm guessing if it does it is minimal, because it's coming out in such large bubbles, correct?

 

[fort384]

it is minimal, and in the end it doesn't matter... the water can only hold so much CO2... so eventually, because it is a closed system (the caps and seals are air tight, only 1 place for the co2 to go--your aquarium), it will be saturated, and the rest is going into the tank. Make sense?

 

[mommytron]

total sense! thanks dude!! appreciate all the help so much (especially since NO ONE else is chiming in ah who needs 'em!)

i'm getting so psyched about this upgrade! but i do still have a problem.... i don't even know what plants i'm going to get yet! lol