Refugium help

[ctmedman]

I want to setup a refugium to propagate amphipods and copepods for a soon to be aquired Mandarin fish. I wanted to see what people recommend.

Someone recommended I buy an Aqua Clear hang on pump and remove all the bio media and replace with a [acronym:106365eda8="Deep Sand Bed"]DSB[/acronym:106365eda8] and [acronym:106365eda8="Live rock"]LR[/acronym:106365eda8]. I've also seen the hang-on-back refugiums from CPR costing about $100 (kind of pricey).

How big of a fuge would I need? Does it need to have lighting? Can I somehow put it with the sump?

[acronym:106365eda8="Thanks in Advance"]TIA[/acronym:106365eda8]

[afilter]

How long has your tank been up and running?

I have had a mandarin for the last 6+months in my 75gal and it is doing great without a sump or refugium.

I would thing a 72 could support a mandarin if it has been up for 12 months or more. I also supplement feeding with frozen daphnia and cyclopese which my mandarin does accept.

If you are still worried you could expand the size of your sump to include a refugium. 5gal seems a bit small anyway.

Here is a plan I am considering:

http://aquariumadvice.com/viewtopic.php?t=53046

Something to keep an eye on though is your damsels. Thye could be an issue for any future livestock.

[acronym:b2b0152ef6="Hope this helps (or) Happy to help"]HTH[/acronym:b2b0152ef6],

[Gatorfreak]

I have a Mandarin in my 90 [acronym:b881185587="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:b881185587]. Even though I should have plenty of [acronym:b881185587="Live rock"]LR[/acronym:b881185587] anyway, I added a [acronym:b881185587="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:b881185587] fuge. It was actually designed for something else and I just had it so I used it. I put sand and [acronym:b881185587="Live rock"]LR[/acronym:b881185587] rubble in it and some chaeto. It gets plenty of light from my [acronym:b881185587="Metal halide light"]MH[/acronym:b881185587] lights that are over the tank (back of hood is open). The [acronym:b881185587="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:b881185587] fuge has [acronym:b881185587="copepods, amphipods, etc"]pods[/acronym:b881185587] crawling all over the place. My Mandarin is plump but who's to say he wouldn't be anyway without the [acronym:b881185587="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:b881185587]. I also have a sump but I don't see how [acronym:b881185587="copepods, amphipods, etc"]pods[/acronym:b881185587] can go up from the sump to the tank. I think some of the [acronym:b881185587="copepods, amphipods, etc"]pods[/acronym:b881185587] flow out of the [acronym:b881185587="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:b881185587].

[afilter]

[acronym:c8b6a78f64="copepods, amphipods, etc"]pods[/acronym:c8b6a78f64] can travel through the pump from a sump/fuge.

[IndyReefMan]

Consider buying a used aquarium out of the classifieds from your local newspaper. Turn that into a larger sump and then add a drop-in refugium. Maybe something like this--

http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merch...y_Code=Special

[seaham358]

[acronym:1bac2976f9="In my opinion"]IMO[/acronym:1bac2976f9] your going to need to have a fuge. You only have 45lbs of [acronym:1bac2976f9="Live rock"]lr[/acronym:1bac2976f9] in your tank and [acronym:1bac2976f9="In my opinion"]IMO[/acronym:1bac2976f9] that is not enough to support a large enough pod population for a mandarin long term.
There is not guarentee that your fish will eat frozen foods, most people I know that have Mandarins say theres will not eat frozen foods. I have never seen mine eat any kind of prepaired foods.
If you have room under your stand you can have a small 10 [acronym:1bac2976f9="Gallon"]gal[/acronym:1bac2976f9] fuge there. If you don't have room then you may be stuck with a [acronym:1bac2976f9="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:1bac2976f9] type.
I would add more [acronym:1bac2976f9="Live rock"]LR[/acronym:1bac2976f9] to the tank also..

[afilter]

Check out this link:

http://aquariumadvice.com/viewtopic.php?t=53046

I built mine exactly like this scaled sown to a 30gal tank last night and you could easily scale it down to a 20L which would give you a much better/larger sump/fuge provided you have the room.

I am picking up my 90g this weekend and had planned to use a tub for now and build this later and install. When I checked out my stand I realized there was no way I could fit it in after the fact so I jumped in last night. Turned out great and super easy. Once I had the tank, cut glass, and silicon it took about 2 hours and is drying today.

[macman7010]

ctmedman,

looks like the link afilter sent you is very helpful. There are a variety of ways to do a refugium from [acronym:939c34cb2f="Hang On Back"]HOB[/acronym:939c34cb2f] designs, to sump designs, really your imagination is the only limit. A friend of mine designed an above tank refuge that works well. The main thing you want to remember is this is going to serve a two fold process. It is going to eat up nitrates maker your overall water quality better, and its going to harvest co and amphi [acronym:939c34cb2f="copepods, amphipods, etc"]pods[/acronym:939c34cb2f] for your manadrin and other fish.

That said you dont want it to be pretty. Lots of algae, even hair algae and others should be desired. Macro Algae can be added, but the more the better both in the eating up nitrate category and in the copod category since copods love having algae to live, feed, and breed in. One thing you may want to consider also is feeding your refuge, Photo and Zoo plankton as well as live brine shrimp work great for this. I accomplish excessive algae growth by using a 40 flood light that runs 24 hours a day over my refuge.

Live rock rubble, live sand, and Miracle Mud all make great substrates and there is a little of each in my refuge. As for keeping a Mandarin in a tank without a refuge. In my personal opinion it doesnt matter if you have a 500 gallon aquarium, if you want to keep a Mandarin you should have a refuge.