Bangai Cardinal problem/protein skimmer

[dex2369]

I set up a protein skimmer 2 days ago after having my saltwater tank for 2 months. Right after I did, my bangai cardinal quit eating and has not eat anything since. The lady at the local aquarium store mentioned I should try to feed him a treat, but I don't know what that would be. Him as well as my clown fish are hooked on frozen food. I was also wondering if the protein skimmer should take the place of the regular filter I had in there.

 

[Ziggy953]

Can you give us a little more information on your tank? How long has it been set up what are you water parameters? How long have you had the cardinal?

 

[fijiwigi]

I set up a protein skimmer 2 days I was also wondering if the protein skimmer should take the place of the regular filter I had in there.

The Protein skimmer removes dissolved Organics such as fish food/poop etc...The thick stuff. A protein skimmer does little for biological filtration as it has little surface area for the bacteria to grow.. You need a place for bacteria to grow large enough to digest fish waste. A mechanical filter accomplishes this via filter pad to grow the bacteria.
I don't have a mechanical filter at all.
Many saltwater aquarist utilize the Berlin Method of filtration. 1.5-2pounds of live rock per gallon. The Live rock acts as a biological filter. The Beneficial Bacteria grow on the surface areas of the live rock. More rock, more surface area. No need for a mechanical filter. You do need flow however 10x-20x tank turnover. This can be accomplished with a powerhead.

 

[dex2369]

I have had the saltwater tank for 2 months along with the cardinal. My water quality is great so far and I just tested it yesterday. I even have little brittle starfish growing on my live rock and in the sand.

 

[fijiwigi]

, my bangai cardinal quit eating and has not eat anything since.

I have heard bangaii cardinal's can be picky. Have you tried any different foods. The addition of Garlic supplement may make the food more attractive.

 

[Ziggy953]

So you set the tank up 2 months ago and added the cardinal and the clown at the same time? Did you cycle the tank?

I'm thinking you have ammonia and nitrites in the tank. What kind of filtration do you have other then the new skimmer?

You tested your water yesterday. What were your readings? Ammonia NitrIte Nitrate PH?

 

[dex2369]

Of couse I cycled the tank!!!!! Nitrates and ammonia are not the problem and my readings were spot on. I took my regular filter out when I set up the skimmer and have lots of live rock. I'm not worried about the status of the tank because everything checks out fine. And yes, I did add the cardinal and the clown at the same time-it never was a problem. My clown is doing just fine.

 

[roka64]

I would try the garlic guard soaked in the frozen for 20-30 minutes. I also add Selcon and Zoe for added nutrients.

 

[cmor1701d]

Please don't take offense at the question. You did not state in your post all the information about your system. Generally whenever posting a request for help you should supply as much information about your system as possible. Please post actual number for all water parameters. You would not beleive what some people think are 'normal' or 'spot on'. Here is the list of questions I normally ask:
How many gallons is the tank?
How long has it been up and running with fish?
How and when did you cycle the tank?
What type of filter/filtration are you using?
Describe the lighting units (type bulbs, total wattage).
What are the current water parameters? Ammonia, nitirte, nitrate, pH, salinity, temp, calcium and alkalinity. Please post numbers of results.
What is your source water for top off and partial water changes?

Now I have more questions for you.
What is the make/model of the skimmer you added?
Did you clean the skimmer before installing it in the system?
Sometimes there are oils and/or other contaminents that occur during the manufacturing process or while it is being shipped or sitting in stock somewhere. These may not show up in the normal water tests we run but could cause stress to the tanks livestock. Whenever in doubt I start with a 20-25% PWC till I can figure things out.

And btw,

 

[Kurt_Nelson]

Just to tag on more along what cmor1701d mentioned...

Skimmers don't replace filters, so not sure why you took out the existing filter. You say you have "lots" of live rock, but if that "lots" of live rock wasn't enough to start with, that existing filter might've been housing a fair amount of beneficial bacteria. And with that bacteria now missing, you might not be able to keep up with your bioload. That could cause a little ammonia spike which might make your fish a little testy. Just thinking out loud...

Actual numbers (lbs and ppm) really will help folks here help you. I've seen someone on a different forum board think their pH was "spot on" at 7.4! When troubleshooting, you can't assume anything.

 

[land locked]

What type of filter do you Kurt? That blue fuzzy stuff? Because when I switched to LR from my bio balls I got rid of the filter too.

 

[Kurt_Nelson]

Yeah... if you're switching from bioballs to LR, I can see ditching the mechanical filtration that went with the bioballs. I'm assuming the original poster removed some stand alone filter unit. Maybe my assumption is wrong.

My point was that skimmers and filters, while both reducing bad stuff in the water, can serve very different purposes. If you're limited on live rock, a filter can house a good portion of your bacterial population in the floss, sponges, etc. Getting rid of that population could cause issues. But if you have plenty of live rock, the beneficial bacteria in your rock is going to be doing most of the work and the bacterial in your filters is kind of just an added bonus. Mechanical filters can still serve a good purpose in a tank with LR by straining debris from the water column. You just have to keep up on maintaining it.

A skimmer on the other hand reduces dissolved organics by pullling them out of the water via foam, versus trapping the debris in a sponge as mechanical filters do.

Me personally, I have a HOT Magnum 250 and a Biowheel 100 with filter pads for switching over to a quarantine tank. The HOT Magnum gets it's sponge around the carbon cannister swapped out with a new one every week.

 

[land locked]

Got itSorry to interrupt, but thanks for clarifying.

 

[dex2369]

I thought that aquarium advice would help with a couple of problems. I've gotten some nice, simple suggestions so thanks to those who didn't just bombared me with fancy questions and abbreviations. I don't carry my water quality readings with me all the time, I just know they are good. I even took them to the aquarium store and they tested them as well. Obviously I'm new to this, but if my tank wasn't doing good, everything would be dying or dead. I would at least be able to tell a difference, because I pay close attention to it. I wanted friendly help, not a bunch of posts with smart comments that make the beginners look stupid. I'll get help elsewhere.

 

[roka64]

Dex, I don't see any unusual bombardment of fancy questions. They all look standard to me. It is important to know your water parameters and I also don't carry my parameters around with me. If I post a question about issues with my critters, it is very important to let folks know the exact numbers. For example, I'm new, and my water looks clean but I have an issue with one of my fish, I post: ammonia 0.25, nitrItes 0, nitrAtes 5. Folks would ask did anything recently die in the tank or have you checked your water source for ammonia. Then we can proceed to find out the exact problem and how to resolve it. If you feel folks here are asking too many questions, it's only because we care and want to help.
If you don't understand the fancy questions (we were all new and asked the same questions as you, so don't sweat that) simply ask for clarification and we will be happy to answer. You do have another way, find some one that you understand and trust and PM them. I hope you stick around, I think you may find other sites a lot less friendly (that's why I am here, I couldn't stand the other sites that let members bash others).

 

[Kurt_Nelson]

The short, non-caring answer is skimmers don't cause fish to stop eating. And since absolutely everything in your tank is perfect, you just must have a finicky fish.

Agree with roka... good luck asking this same question at some of the bigger "reef" sites.

 

[fijiwigi]

I thought that aquarium advice would help with a couple of problems. I've gotten some nice, simple suggestions so thanks to those who didn't just bombared me with fancy questions and abbreviations. I don't carry my water quality readings with me all the time, I just know they are good. I even took them to the aquarium store and they tested them as well. Obviously I'm new to this, but if my tank wasn't doing good, everything would be dying or dead. I would at least be able to tell a difference, because I pay close attention to it. I wanted friendly help, not a bunch of posts with smart comments that make the beginners look stupid. I'll get help elsewhere.

I agree that the responses if worded differently may have been more helpfull. Sorry dex if you felt bombarded normally its an awesome friendly place for advice. Its easy to forget sometimes after you have been doing this a while what it is like to be new at this.

 

[Ziggy953]

From the information you provided it sounded to me like you set the tank up 2 months ago and added the cardinal and the clown at that time. That is why I asked you if you cycled your tank. You provided very little information about your set up so I was just trying to go through my list of things that it could be. If a fish is doing fine and then suddenly starts acting strange chances are there is something going on in the water.

I'm sorry if you took our questions the wrong way, but we aren't there looking at your tank we have to get the information in written form and it's not always easy to figure out what's going on. I hope you will stay here, other sites are, well they are other sites..