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Old 03-11-2004, 03:31 PM   #31
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Everyone is talking about the waste issue, wich is definately something that needs to be addressed, but in a reef tank you have to supply the corals w/ the nutrients that they need. There are only two ways of doing this. Water changes and supplements. In a reef tank, this is as I'mportant as is removing the waste from the system.

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Old 03-11-2004, 05:01 PM   #32
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If you have a reef and don't do water changes, you should test and add some traces as needed, there are many ways to export nutrients, water changes are but one. While I doubt I will ever be in the "I never do water changes" camp, I believe that through the use of GAC, protien skimming, occasional mechanical filtering and LOTS of water movement, effort on not importing the nutrients in the first place, that a large enough tank can have thriving corals with little or no water changes.

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is there any evidence that you know of to back this up?
Antecdotal, at best, but the more mature a tank is, the more stable it is and it takes abuse better than a new system. For example, My LFS set up a new system a few months ago for growing out nice corals fro fragging and then selling the frags back to the customers. They had some kalk get dumped in the system all at once rather than being dripped as is recommended. They lost all the corals in that tank. While this might also happen in an older tank, I have read many times of people dumping 1/2 to a gallon at a time in similar sized setups that were a few years old and experience no problems from it. Does this mean anything? Not really, but it leads me to believe that an older tank that is well cared for, will resist crashing alot more than a newer tank.
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Old 03-11-2004, 05:05 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by reefrunner69
effort on not importing the nutrients in the first place,
How can you not import the nutrients that will eventually need to be removed? These are put there from everything from the food we put into the water to the very salt that we use (granted that one should be minimal). What nutrients are "avoidable" in your opinion?
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Old 03-11-2004, 05:21 PM   #34
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How can you not import the nutrients that will eventually need to be removed?
Sorry I can see how that would be unclear. Basically the key is effort, make certain that your using as pure a water possible for top off, don't overfeed, wash/soak foods in RO/DI water to remove as much phosphate from them and then drain off the water, don't add garbage to your tank (like most trace supplaments) if you don't know that it is necessary and exactly what it does. If your not doing waterchanges...don't add an all encompassing supplament for traces, add individual traces that you can test for and you know the system needs. Etc...As noted, you cannot avoid adding nutrients to your system, but with a little effort you can minimize this. For example, I got an RO/DI last week with a drinking water kit. The DI was bad and haven't recieved the new one yet. The water out of the drinking water faucet sits in a bladder tank until used, that water reads 16ppm TDS, the water coming out of the DI hose comes out at 11 ppm TDS. Not a huge difference, but if I weren't doing water changes, that 5 ppm TDS, would be enough for me to go to the effort to get my topoff water from the DI hose rather than the faucet. The faucet is easier though and since I do water changes, I am lazy and get it from the faucet.
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Old 03-11-2004, 05:24 PM   #35
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Okay..that makes more sense
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Old 03-11-2004, 06:13 PM   #36
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The only evidence I have is that what I said is exactly how I did it. I was religous about weekly water changes for the first two years. Then it cut down to monthly, then bi monthly, then every three months- six months. I add b-ionic, and on occation when it is needed, stronium and iodide. I use RO/Di water for all top offs. I have claupae in my tank and only feed twice a week in small portions, it is enought to keep the fish healthy.
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:35 PM   #37
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Antecdotal, at best, but the more mature a tank is...
i would love to have the time and money to do some serious research. not just water changes but the whole reef aquarium husbandry thing.

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the more mature a tank is, the more stable it is and it takes abuse better
is this a dsb only thing or all tanks in general?
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Crush two tbs minced mint leaves (no stems) with the juice of two limes, two tbs of sugar and a shot of light rum. Marinade eight cleaned jumbo shrimp for two hours in fridge or overnight (overnight is best). Skewer and salt shrimp. Broil or grill over medium high heat until shrimp become opaque (apx. two and a half min per side). Serve with black beans cooked with garlic, green onions, bacon and topped with a slice of lime.
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:59 PM   #38
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is this a dsb only thing or all tanks in general?
IMO, it's in general, I've never run a DSB in my tanks
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:03 PM   #39
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Would never take that risk!!!!!!!!
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:20 PM   #40
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IMO, it's in general, I've never run a DSB in my tanks
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Peppermint Shrimp:
Crush two tbs minced mint leaves (no stems) with the juice of two limes, two tbs of sugar and a shot of light rum. Marinade eight cleaned jumbo shrimp for two hours in fridge or overnight (overnight is best). Skewer and salt shrimp. Broil or grill over medium high heat until shrimp become opaque (apx. two and a half min per side). Serve with black beans cooked with garlic, green onions, bacon and topped with a slice of lime.
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