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Old 11-23-2008, 12:42 AM   #1
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Ick, help please?

I just added two fish (2 dwarf angels) to my 60 gallon tank on Tuesday. I didn't quarantine them (I know i should have now) because i didn't think my 10 gal QT could handle 2 fish. One of them has ick now, i'm fairly sure. I'm not 100% sure, but i think the other one does too.
1. How long does ick take to spread to the other fish?
2. Should i move them over, or can i just wait it out and change the water often?
3. What should i do?
Oh, and i have a percula clown, damsel, rainbow wrasse, and a dwarf lionfish in there as well.

I have also been putting my fish in my quarantine tank and the last 3 have died. I've been using CopperSafe. What could i be doing wrong?

Thanks for your help!
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Old 11-23-2008, 11:34 AM   #2
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Yikes, that tank is a disaster waiting to happen ( sorry! not trying to be mean but truthful) Your lionfish MAY eat the damsel and clowns. Also two dwarfs in a 60 gallon will more than likely kill each other eventually. They are VERY territorial and do not like their same species in the same tank. You need to return a few of those fish.

Ick can spread fast and kill pretty fast. You can treat it as long as you catch it asap. Please take pictures and post here so we can help you make sure its ICH. ( are they little salt grain sized specs? do the fish flash or rub against things? heavy breathing?) You NEED to get those fish in Isolation and treat them. Ideally I would put the lion in a QT by itself and ideally have one angel with some of the smaller fish in one and the other half of the fish population in the other, or have a LARGE QT ( i'd still keep the lion seperate... )

Once you get them in QT you can either treat with copper or hyposalinity. Just do a few internet searches on either here or google. If you treat with copper be sure to have a copper test kit, you need to have it at certain levels to be therapeutic, but too much will kill your fish. You also need to test the water daily, copper can kill good bacteria.

You need to leave the main tank fishless for 6-8 weeks.

I added my first two fish ever to my tank, they came down wish ich as well. Now you know why QT is a MUST for 2-4 weeks. Ideally closer to 4.


Good luck ,certainly ask if you have more Q's
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Old 11-23-2008, 11:35 AM   #3
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It doesn't take long to start spreading. Another problem is even though you remove the sick fish, some of the Ich can remain in your water column and still infect other fish.

If you don't have any invertebrates the best thing to do is just treat your regular tank with the coppersafe. The coppersafe is the best thing to use, copper is awesome for killing ich, only problem is it will kill any invertebrates also. If your quarantine is normally empty, then you might be getting an ammonia spike when you add fish. The stress from being caught and moved to another tank that has ammonia in it will do more harm than good.
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Old 11-23-2008, 11:50 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BucJason View Post
It doesn't take long to start spreading. Another problem is even though you remove the sick fish, some of the Ich can remain in your water column and still infect other fish.

If you don't have any invertebrates the best thing to do is just treat your regular tank with the coppersafe. The coppersafe is the best thing to use, copper is awesome for killing ich, only problem is it will kill any invertebrates also. If your quarantine is normally empty, then you might be getting an ammonia spike when you add fish. The stress from being caught and moved to another tank that has ammonia in it will do more harm than good.
Personally I would never treat my main. If you plan on keeping it FISH ONLY forever than its ok. You can not ever have any inverts ( shrimp, crabs, corals etc) if you treat your main. Also do not use copper in your main if you have any live rock. It will kill all the good bacteria. Which in my opinion, its easier if copper must be used to do in say a small 10-20gal QT and do PWC than to deal with PWC every day on a 60 gallon, because the copper will kill all good bacteria and possibly cause ammonia spikes no matter where its used. Dont get me wrong, copper is an amazing drug to treat ich, but it needs to be used with caution.

Its best to return some of those fish, QT the others and leave your main fishless for 6-8 weeks. Otherwise you may continue to have constant outbreaks.
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Old 11-23-2008, 09:17 PM   #5
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Could i move my live rock to the QT until i'm done treating the main tank with coppersafe, then move it back?
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Old 11-23-2008, 09:27 PM   #6
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Never treat the main. Always QT your fish. Copper will get in the seals of your tank and cause problems down the road. QT your fish and treat with hypo and let the tank go fishless for two months. Here is some good links Also there is much life that you can not see in your LR and substrate that will perish when introduced back into your main since you will not be able to get rid of the copper.

An Ounce of Prevention is Worth a Pound of Cure: A Quarantine Tank for Everything by Steven Pro - Reefkeeping.com

Marine Ich/Cryptocaryon irritans - A Discussion of this Parasite and the Treatment Options Available, Part I by Steven Pro - Reefkeeping.com

Marine Ich/Cryptocaryon irritans - A Discussion of this Parasite and the Treatment Options Available, Part II by Steven Pro - Reefkeeping.com
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Old 11-23-2008, 11:40 PM   #7
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This is the Fish only forum, so it IS reasonable to talk about treating the main.

SOmetimes it's your only option . If you have a large outbreak of Ich and numerous fish get it at once, and you have large fish , it's not an option to put them all in your little quarantine tank at once . Also remember that ICH releases tomites that are free swimming in your water and can infect other fish even after the infected fish is removed. So, in my opinion, it's definitely an option as a last resort.

Good points about killing some unseen organisms in the liverock , but I don't think copper kills bacteria. At least it never has in any of my tanks. ( not to a noticiable effect anyways)
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Old 11-25-2008, 12:57 AM   #8
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What do you guys think of a UV light to help kill some of those tomites that are drifting in the water? May not get all the ich, but reduce the numbers?
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Old 11-25-2008, 08:33 AM   #9
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What do you guys think of a UV light to help kill some of those tomites that are drifting in the water? May not get all the ich, but reduce the numbers?

I've read somewhere that UV sterilizer is good for killing the tomites, but doesn't harm ich that is already attached to fish.

Don't know for sure, never tried it....
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Old 11-26-2008, 02:15 AM   #10
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The UV light will only kill what small amount of them that flow through it....From my understanding, the tomites don't really float/swim around the surface of the water.
Davidt, if you already treated your main with the copper, it will leach into just about any surface (sand/rock/sealant/plastic/media...with the exception of glass) and will be hard and more of a pain to "try" to "remove" than the other option.
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