launched the 20 gallon fowlr
- Thread starter hc8719
- Start date
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hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
took the crab meat out eailier today after doing my first SW params test
pH: 8.1
Nitrites:0
Nitrates 20ppm
amonia: .50ppm
after seeing the amonia spike, i gave in, and took the crab out.
LR is $5.99/lb and bio spira he said would be $14
maybe the LR would be a better trade
EDIT: how long would it take me to culture my base rock in someone else's established SW tank, and put it back into mine?
pH: 8.1
Nitrites:0
Nitrates 20ppm
amonia: .50ppm
after seeing the amonia spike, i gave in, and took the crab out.
LR is $5.99/lb and bio spira he said would be $14
maybe the LR would be a better trade
EDIT: how long would it take me to culture my base rock in someone else's established SW tank, and put it back into mine?
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
did a 2 gallon water change to try and bring amonia down last night, but is still at .50ppm
melosu, i was thinking of curing it in someone elses tank because i could then put it in my tank, and jumpstart my cycle a bit more
1. also my water is slightly cloudy, a sign of a natural bacteria bloom? how long do they last in salt water?
2. visiting another lfs, they gave me some free samples of TLC. while she said it would do the same thing as bio-spira (she seemed a bit confused as what bio-spira was). this TLC doesnt actually say anything about bacteria on it but that it removes NH3 and N02, reduces fish loss, and purifies water. 100% natural.
if anyone is familiar with TLC for SW Aquariums, give me a heads up
3. ive never really dealt with amonia spikes, but i'd assume the bacteria producing amonia have to starve off with no food source. i am thinking about completely draining my tank, drying everything out, and restarting the tank with the TLC.
i dont know how stupid that last part sounded, but if i can cycle the tank with TLC instead, it might be worth it to rid myself of the amonia and the cloudy bacterial bloom
thanks guys
melosu, i was thinking of curing it in someone elses tank because i could then put it in my tank, and jumpstart my cycle a bit more
1. also my water is slightly cloudy, a sign of a natural bacteria bloom? how long do they last in salt water?
2. visiting another lfs, they gave me some free samples of TLC. while she said it would do the same thing as bio-spira (she seemed a bit confused as what bio-spira was). this TLC doesnt actually say anything about bacteria on it but that it removes NH3 and N02, reduces fish loss, and purifies water. 100% natural.
if anyone is familiar with TLC for SW Aquariums, give me a heads up
3. ive never really dealt with amonia spikes, but i'd assume the bacteria producing amonia have to starve off with no food source. i am thinking about completely draining my tank, drying everything out, and restarting the tank with the TLC.
i dont know how stupid that last part sounded, but if i can cycle the tank with TLC instead, it might be worth it to rid myself of the amonia and the cloudy bacterial bloom
thanks guys
I am not understanding...why are you trying to bring the ammonia down? You are getting in too much of a hurry. Leave it all be and let nature take its course. If you have a nice strong cycle, you wont have problems when you start adding fish.
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
Hara said:
im under the impression i should have no ammonia? and that sw fish are extra picky about water params?
i suppose i had a bad experience with my bacterial bloom in my 55 gallon, and am terrified of it going on... again
if i can stop this whole cycle jumpy params cycle, i will
You have fish in there? If there are no fish in there, yes, those parameters should be jumping all over. HIGH ammonia, HIGH nitrite..all this happens over the period of a month or so, not a few days.
Maybe you are confused a little about the nitrogen cycle.
You might want to read this:
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/article_view.php?faq=2&fldAuto=15
Once again, I will say, shortcuts now will lead to disaster later.
Maybe you are confused a little about the nitrogen cycle.
You might want to read this:
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/article_view.php?faq=2&fldAuto=15
Once again, I will say, shortcuts now will lead to disaster later.
I think you are misinterpreting the whole Fishless Cycle thing. The crab leg as you used instead of shrimp, causes an ammonia buildup. You are by no means supposed to try to stop it. You leave the crab in there to rot, get smelly, and decompose.
Basically Do Not Touch the Tank, for atleast a month. check params to watch the ammonia spike go up, nitrite go up and eventually turn into nitrate. This is the cycle, you have to be patient. Not listening to the experts/veterans on here and trying to cruise through the cycle in a couple days is a bad idea and irresponsible.
If you don't intend to wait, stick a fish in there and pray it lives through the torture of the cycle, and you will eventually do it the right way like you have been told to by EXPERIENCED hobbyists.
Spira/TLC is your shortcut and is not the right way to do things. If you don;t want to listen or read up on proper care of animals I suggest you don't come on here and listen to your LFS.
There is a reason why it's suggested this way and you shouldn't be ignorant, You need to read up on the basics which are posted all over here, and should of before you started.
Either way you will learn the basics, fast, easy, or the right way. Usually the right ways the fastest and easiest and less stressful on your inhabitants.
Basically Do Not Touch the Tank, for atleast a month. check params to watch the ammonia spike go up, nitrite go up and eventually turn into nitrate. This is the cycle, you have to be patient. Not listening to the experts/veterans on here and trying to cruise through the cycle in a couple days is a bad idea and irresponsible.
If you don't intend to wait, stick a fish in there and pray it lives through the torture of the cycle, and you will eventually do it the right way like you have been told to by EXPERIENCED hobbyists.
Spira/TLC is your shortcut and is not the right way to do things. If you don;t want to listen or read up on proper care of animals I suggest you don't come on here and listen to your LFS.
There is a reason why it's suggested this way and you shouldn't be ignorant, You need to read up on the basics which are posted all over here, and should of before you started.
Either way you will learn the basics, fast, easy, or the right way. Usually the right ways the fastest and easiest and less stressful on your inhabitants.
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
i do not have fish in the tank. and yes i have read that article, however is bio-spira/TLC really a bad short cut, isnt it equal to the shrimp method, if not quicker
Bacteria takes time to grow. The only way to make it quicker as far as I know is by adding cured live rock from a mature tank with the beneficial bacteria already cultured on it. Then it still won't be a couple days. When your ammonia nitrite are at 0 and the nitrate is sky high with no trace of your crab legs you are done the cycle.
Devilishturtles
Aquarium Advice Addict
My guess is that this TLC stuff is just like the FW Cycle product. It's bacterial spores (yes still live, but dormant) and not really beneficial for a new tank cycle. I would follow the advice of others and just add your liverock and be patient. Live rock, as it cures, will cycle your tank. You do not need to put it in anyone else's tank. That will cause your tank to recycle. Get it all done at once and it will not take as long and your cycle will be more "efficient", if you will.
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
chill out fargo, im not trying to cut corners, im just trying to be time efficient and effective.
my thinking is, why run 10 miles, when you can just exercise your legs for half an hour at the gym. if it gets you the same results, why not take the quicker route.
in no way did i mean to cheat the system. i was under the impression that TLC would do the same thing as the crab in a shorter time, that it was all just bacteria. i guess not
my thinking is, why run 10 miles, when you can just exercise your legs for half an hour at the gym. if it gets you the same results, why not take the quicker route.
in no way did i mean to cheat the system. i was under the impression that TLC would do the same thing as the crab in a shorter time, that it was all just bacteria. i guess not
lando
Aquarium Advice Addict
I will just echo what has been said here...nothing good happens fast in this hobby. It is actually a blessing in disgise. this hobby is expensive enough, use the time it takes for your tank to cycle to save up money and do research.
CC is not a bad substrate. People have been using it for years with great success. That said, it does have its drawbacks...it requires frequent vacuuming to remove trapped detritus and is not easily sifted by critters. I myself much prefer sand, but CC is not a deal-breaker as long as you understand what is involved in it.
Please, please, please do not waste your money on Bio-spira. It does nothing to prepair your tank for long-term habbitation and gives you a false sense that your tank is cycled and ready to accept livestock. There is absolutley no replacement for good old fashion time when cycling. This in not even a ten mile race, its a marathon.
CC is not a bad substrate. People have been using it for years with great success. That said, it does have its drawbacks...it requires frequent vacuuming to remove trapped detritus and is not easily sifted by critters. I myself much prefer sand, but CC is not a deal-breaker as long as you understand what is involved in it.
Please, please, please do not waste your money on Bio-spira. It does nothing to prepair your tank for long-term habbitation and gives you a false sense that your tank is cycled and ready to accept livestock. There is absolutley no replacement for good old fashion time when cycling. This in not even a ten mile race, its a marathon.
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
you guys understand, the only reason i say what i did was because the lfs told me too. because i lack your experience, i am impressionable that
1) the lfs wouldnt make stuff up
2) TLC works
3) there may be longer and shorter ways to cycle the tank
on another note, is TLC useless? what does it do, if its, live but dormant?
1) the lfs wouldnt make stuff up
2) TLC works
3) there may be longer and shorter ways to cycle the tank
on another note, is TLC useless? what does it do, if its, live but dormant?
Devilishturtles
Aquarium Advice Addict
hc, everyone here just wants to see ya have a successful aquarium. Like Hara said, they are out to sell you anything, whereas we are not. It's a common problem, one you really aren't expected to know!
I can't find any info on this TLC stuff except that it's manufactured in Ohio. Since you are from Ohio, it's possible that maybe it's only distributed locally. I have never seen it in stores. I thought I read once, that if a product doesn't require refrigeration, it's not going to work, which makes complete sense.
As for the Bio-Spira, yes, it may work. But... the problem is when you want to try and add liverock to your system. It is going to possibly re-cycle anyways, unless you get totally 100% cured rock and take it directly from whereever you get it and put it right into your tank. Sinec you are still cycling the tank, it would be more beneficial for you to just get all of your liverock now, let it cure in your tank thus cycling it at the same time. This way, you know for sure your tank will have enough bacteria to support a bioload as heavy as liverock and fish, coral, etc. and you won't have to worry about mini-cycles and such.
This...
1. Saves you money
2. Ensures that your livestock will have NO problem living in your tank.
3. Eliminates the possibility of a mini-cycle by adding liverock later.
Liverock is such an important part of biological filtration. If you still wish to add the product, go ahead. But please also add your liverock at the same time, that will help greatly.
Hope this makes sense.
I can't find any info on this TLC stuff except that it's manufactured in Ohio. Since you are from Ohio, it's possible that maybe it's only distributed locally. I have never seen it in stores. I thought I read once, that if a product doesn't require refrigeration, it's not going to work, which makes complete sense.
As for the Bio-Spira, yes, it may work. But... the problem is when you want to try and add liverock to your system. It is going to possibly re-cycle anyways, unless you get totally 100% cured rock and take it directly from whereever you get it and put it right into your tank. Sinec you are still cycling the tank, it would be more beneficial for you to just get all of your liverock now, let it cure in your tank thus cycling it at the same time. This way, you know for sure your tank will have enough bacteria to support a bioload as heavy as liverock and fish, coral, etc. and you won't have to worry about mini-cycles and such.
This...
1. Saves you money
2. Ensures that your livestock will have NO problem living in your tank.
3. Eliminates the possibility of a mini-cycle by adding liverock later.
Liverock is such an important part of biological filtration. If you still wish to add the product, go ahead. But please also add your liverock at the same time, that will help greatly.
Hope this makes sense.
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
i understand and appreciate your guys's help. if anything im a bit confused, maybe stressed
i replaced most of my cc with some argonite sand, which in fact is just smaller cc im sure.
instructions to set up a sw tank, the lfs gave me, says adding LR after 8 days is recommended. my ammonia is still .50ppm. i also have like 15 lbs of base rock in the tank.
i take it, i shouldnt add LR because of my ammonia, or should i and the LR will take care of the ammonia? or should i just not, just because.
if and when infact i add LR, i think i'll be using the TLC stuff
would adding used filter media from my fw tanks do anything, surely some bacteria must survive from the waste, and debris collected on the media
my tank is a week old on saturday
i replaced most of my cc with some argonite sand, which in fact is just smaller cc im sure.
instructions to set up a sw tank, the lfs gave me, says adding LR after 8 days is recommended. my ammonia is still .50ppm. i also have like 15 lbs of base rock in the tank.
i take it, i shouldnt add LR because of my ammonia, or should i and the LR will take care of the ammonia? or should i just not, just because.
if and when infact i add LR, i think i'll be using the TLC stuff
would adding used filter media from my fw tanks do anything, surely some bacteria must survive from the waste, and debris collected on the media
my tank is a week old on saturday
Devilishturtles
Aquarium Advice Addict
Your ammonia is .5 after the addition of the crab? Or liverock? Did you even add the crab?
Add the liverock in now, before you add life to the tank. When you have all your liverock in there, THEN see ammonia, nitrite at 0, you are good to go.
Good luck with the TLC stuff. Wish I knew more about it to help you. Let us know what you think about it.
Adding filter media from your fw will do nothing to help with your sw tank. Different bacteria. I wish it were that easy!
When do we get pictures?
Add the liverock in now, before you add life to the tank. When you have all your liverock in there, THEN see ammonia, nitrite at 0, you are good to go.
Good luck with the TLC stuff. Wish I knew more about it to help you. Let us know what you think about it.
Adding filter media from your fw will do nothing to help with your sw tank. Different bacteria. I wish it were that easy!
When do we get pictures?
hc8719
Aquarium Advice Addict
sorry, i meant to be more clear
i did add the crab, and have ammonia of .5
i have not added LR, but when i do, i'll use the TLC with it at the same time
i understand that sw and fw have different bacteria, but wont the debris on the fw media be able to grow sw bacteria, or are fish needed for the right bacterial growth?
pictures? as soon as i can get my printer/scanner to not make a 4x6" pictures scanned at 4 pixels. i dont have a digital camera...
i did add the crab, and have ammonia of .5
i have not added LR, but when i do, i'll use the TLC with it at the same time
i understand that sw and fw have different bacteria, but wont the debris on the fw media be able to grow sw bacteria, or are fish needed for the right bacterial growth?
pictures? as soon as i can get my printer/scanner to not make a 4x6" pictures scanned at 4 pixels. i dont have a digital camera...
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