Hello from a newbie to the forum and the hobby.

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BrettMad

Aquarium Advice Apprentice
Joined
Jul 16, 2017
Messages
24
Location
Palm Harbor, Florida
Hello everyone, I also posted in one other forum today, trying to get to know more people who do this and find groups to learn from! It appears that this community is larger and more active, so once I found this community I decided to join here as well.

For a short version, the house I bought two years ago had a 155 gallon bowfront tank built into the wall of the family room, which was empty. It is no longer empty. I have a narrative about the journey to getting to this tank, but I do not know if I should post it here or in the freshwater general section or the freshwater tank showcase section. Any suggestion?

I have taken a couple dozen pictures of specific elements within the tank and of the setup process, but it does not seem like there are albums here so I do not want to flood the photo area. I should probably select a couple so that I can then include them in the posts

Anyways, hello and once I get some feedback on the best place to post my narrative about getting started back into this hobby, or really into this hobby correctly for the first time, I will tell some more about myself and our families fish tank.

Brett
 
There are albums on the website from a PC but the mobile app, never found them. Lol. You are always welcome to post a small novel about your adventures! And perhaps a tank progression series of photos in the introduction.
 
So as I said I am new to the hobby. Well, at least that is what I am claiming. We have had fish in the house before, tried to keep betas a couple times (how incompetent am I when you have trouble keeping your betas around), and had a couple small 10 gallon tanks many years ago when the kids were younger. If memory serves me right we kept common pet store small goldfish in that tank and they lasted a while but eventually passed.

I had sworn that for the good of fish everywhere I would not keep another tank. Besides, I was starting to worry about visits from PETA! :lol:

Then we bought our new house two years ago. Built into the wall downstairs was a massive bow front fish tank, which came with the house. It was built in, and later research said that while this particular tank was from a company that has not existed for years, equivalent tanks could run upwards of $800, not to mention the effort of having built into the wall in the first place! The previous owner was the gentleman who built the house 28 years previously, ran his construction company, and had it set up as a living reef saltwater tank. I asked him how much effort that was and he said not at all, a friend of his ran the service and he just paid his friend to maintain the tank! No help whatsoever, although he did let me know that the amount he paid weekly was well more than I could ever afford for a hobby with two small kids.

Given my aforementioned vow concerning fish we actually looked at the time and effort it would take to convert that into a bookshelf area, but the lure of a tank that big when I was told larger tanks are easier to keep and the waste and shame it seems it would have been to turn such a feature into a simple bookshelf meant we left it there. When we refinanced a couple months back we ended up due to an error with a small check (we were intending just to convert from FHA to conventional, not to cash out).

We decided to go ahead and set up a freshwater tank, as saltwater was well beyond our reach at this point, and honestly not something we were interested in at this stage of our lives. I went to a couple places locally (Tampa Florida) that specialized both in designing/setting up tanks and specialized as a fish store rather than a general pet store. I decided that if we were going to do this, rather than trying to learn enough to set it up myself through forums and advice I would pay the extra for their experience and have them set up the tank. The people I decided to work or phenomenal. Their names are John and Jennifer, a married couple who runs the store, and the store is Fish and Other Ichthy Stuff. (I just wanted to give them a shout out for their help, if I am not allowed to post a link like this to their Facebook page let me know and I will take it down). The store is set up primarily around saltwater tanks and fish but they still handled freshwater tanks – they just did not stock much for freshwater in the store.

They came out and inspected the tank. We discussed things for a while and settled on a planted freshwater tank due to the benefit the planted tank would have as far as helping maintain the tank balance. The eventual goal is not for them to maintain the tank, but for my wife and I to learn to do that ourselves. They are going to do some hand-holding with me over the next several weeks as we complete the plan. We had a three stage plan plus initial work done, and they came out and inspected the tank.

Stage 0: (preparation) John came out and investigated the tank as mentioned above. Apparently, when they disassembled the saltwater system they left some of the piping going outside (a component of the living reef section was actually set up outside the house, I have no idea how common this is. The preparation stage involved removing and sealing up the plumbing from the overflow baffles, closing out the piping going outside which will finally allow me to take down the box outside that held debris from the previous system. This also involved cleaning the tank and testing it with tap water to be sure that the tank did not have any leaks. Aside from a minor leak in one of the baffles that John was able to repair we had no surprises here. This is good because there was no way I could afford to replace the fish tank on top of everything else! Our plan would have come to a crashing halt right there if the tank was unsound.

Stage I: (Set up) In my profile I like to set up a list of everything I have in the tank, I thought I saw references to such a profile when I was reading the forums a couple weeks ago learning about the hobby. However, I cannot yet edit my profile. I have long been a believer in spending a little more when it is feasible on higher quality equipment for anything at first rather than having to continually monitor and upgrade shoddy equipment, and also as a novice in the hobby I was hoping that this would increase my chances of not getting hauled off by PETA! <grin>. Over a course of about four hours John and Jennifer putting a substrate, the various equipment that would be needed, planted the first set of plants, and filled the tank. I will set up another post in the freshwater tank showcase forum where I list the specific equipment used (because that will probably help when I ask for advice later). This is a link to a small photo album that Jennifer created on their Facebook page showing that set up. Again if this is not allowed please let me know and I will remove it. Photos Here. A few of the Amazon sword, the Java fern Trident some crypts and some Anubis.

111369-albums14686-picture71317.jpg


Stage II: (There be fish) A week later some more of the plants had come into the wholesaler and the initial fish. Jennifer came back out and added the additional plants. She told me that it was due to the freshwater plants that we had that start up cycle go so quickly, I seem to remember reading it can take much longer than a week to get a tank ready for fish if you are not using a planted aquarium. (I have since learned that you do not actually accelerate the cycle this way, but the large amount of plants to the number of fish means that the plants will absorb some of the ammonia's and nitrates while the cycle establishes itself. I do not know if we jumped the gun here or not, getting a test kit to start checking levels).

Our plants now include: six Amazon sword, three large and three small; three banana plants; three dwarf onions; six Anubis of an unidentified subtype; five Java fern Trident and eight crypts, two of which are Cryptocorye wendtii ver. Tropica, the other six are smaller and I cannot tell what they are at different sub species or if they just look greener because they are newer growth and the leaves will darken as they grow.

Our starting set of fish were 14 cardinal Tetris, six gold barbs, six neo dwarf rainbow, six boesemani rainbow and four millennium rainbow. When we were first considering the tanks we got a list of a bunch of different possible fish to be featured in the tank and my 10-year-old daughter decided that rainbow for sure her favorite, so that is what we have.

111369-albums14686-picture71319.jpg


Stage III: (final additions) Jennifer is planning on coming back out in about three weeks. At that point we will add some bottom feeders, were still discussing possibilities although clown loach seem to be the leaders at the moment. We might get two different kinds, not sure yet. We also discussed that the tank could probably have additional occupants, such as another school of small fish like Tetris or perhaps another 4 to 6 of another rainbow subspecies. We're waiting to see how well the plants do, how the well the tank establishes itself before deciding.

This is a very long post. I went from probably the least excited about the specifics of the tank, just happy to not have a big black hole in the wall of that room, to really getting into the specifics and details. Both John and Jennifer were extraordinarily patient with me, answering all sorts of questions as I pestered them while they were trying to set up the tank!
 
Nice! Glad to hear you have great coaches. I'm surprised they stocked so much at one time. I have always read it can spike the ammonia while the beneficial bacteria catch up.

Clown loaches get huge. Consider my person favorite Kuhli Loaches and a dozen or so. They are more fun in groups to interact. IMG_0024.jpg
 
I was also surprised at how many fish were added on that first wave.

I picked up a test kit this morning because of my concern with the cycle, which honestly we just did not do. We did have live plants in for a week before the fish started and at least a couple of those had a few decaying leaves which she left in there, but I was quite nervous about this.

The explanation to me was that the plants do a good job, especially considering the ratio of plants to juvenile fish that I have, of removing/reducing ammonia and nitrite while the natural cycle establishes itself.

The fish have been in for five days now, the tank was first planted seven days before that, and here were my first set of readings from this morning:

PH level – just above 7.0, possibly 7.1

Ammonia level – while not at 0 ppm it was closer to that than the next color bar which was 0.25 ppm

Nitrite level – exactly the same as above, while not at 0 ppm it was closer to 0 ppm then to the 0.25 ppm color

Nitrates – 5 ppm – this is the only one that had nearly a perfect color match.

Now this is an initial/1st reading, I thought I remembered seeing her to some sort of test the second day she was here when she put in the second wave of plants and the fish, but there was enough going on and I was unfamiliar enough with the hobby that I could not be certain. If so it was strips rather than the test kit I got.

Brett
 
Those readings sound good. I'm curious what equipment you have for water changes for that big ol' tank. I have a little 29g so buckets are fine for me. Lol
 
Have to get back to you this next weekend with the equipment for changing water, because at the moment I do not have any! The couple that was helping set up has a visit planned end of this week in another visit planned in 1 to 2 weeks after that where we would add whatever we decide to add is the last wave of fish, assuming the tank is ready for them.

The visit later this week or this weekend is to do the first water change and I believe she is bringing the equipment for me. We have not been using tap water, this tank was set up with RO/DI water. That reminds me that later today I should actually test my tapwater with my master test kit to find out what I am dealing with.

Because of the air conditioning and surface area, I lose about - gallons a week through evaporation, which means adding about that much each week to keep the tank full. What I realized reading this forum is that topping up the tank does not equal a water change, the nitrates or other problems are not what is evaporating, so the additional water does dilute the nitrates and other problems, the evaporation just re-concentrates it.
 
Welcome to AA!
I've been busy but will follow your journey and be here to help.
 
An unfortunate update today. All four of my millennial rainbowfish have acquired little white dots. I was on sure if I had seen a dot on one or two of them late Tuesday evening, by Wednesday there was no doubt. I called Jennifer, the wife in the couple that was helping me, and she said that being moved into the new tank was stressful and when stressed fish are more susceptible to the dreaded ICH. None of the remaining 32 one seem to have dots yet, although they are not nicely lining up and holding still so I can check each one of them over.

For treatment they have a medicated flake food, particularly as there are only a few dots on each fish at this moment, they are not covered, I am hoping that this will work. I was told to feed them as much as they would eat, with the normal caveat of not so much that it will letter the bottom of the tank. I think the food is called Metro, although I do not have in front of me and I may be misremembering. Additionally, the Metro may be a shortened form of what it is actually called.

The Wednesday where I was sure all four of them had some white dots marked the seventh day, the end of the first full week in the tank. It is not like we have had these fish for years and are super attached to them, but I would not consider it a good omen if we lose some of the first fish we added the tank so quickly. I am very hopeful that this medicated food both helps prevent the other fish from getting infested and helps these four recover.

In another note, we will be testing the water later today, my daughter is back from her trip and she wants see and help, so I will give an update once I know more about that as well. I had reported my first tests in my thread in the cleaning, but basically, it was pH 7.1, trace amounts of ammonia and nitrites, nitrates at 5 ppm.
 
Don't even think in terms of "omens".

Fish and plants being moved around to new environments will usually suffer casualties.

Even with the best laid plans.
 
Thank you for the reassurance. The omens comment was mostly tongue-in-cheek, echoing back to earlier in the thread when I mentioned how poor my luck was in the past and keeping fish tanks. However, I think I know why based on the reading I have done at this time. I just did not know enough about the nitrogen cycle – nor did I ask anyone or even know to ask anyone – with the smaller tanks. And from what I have been reading here, the smaller tanks is exactly where you need to have a good idea of what you are doing or you are likely to damage or fish even if they survived the initial cycle. This would make them less hardy and more likely to succumb to other parasites or illnesses.

I am just hoping this will work. At a minimum, I am hoping that the medicated food will make the other fish resistant and that my worst-case will be losing the four millennium rainbowfish and nothing else. Obviously, the best case is they all recover.

On the bright side, of 30 separate plants we put in, over half already shown new growth and are clearly starting to thrive and all but one are at least holding their own. I may lose one, but I would consider that a significant win.
 
Even successful, experienced hobbyists have ups and downs. I agree with TMaier. She and I can both tell you there's always something unplanned to ruin a good plan in this hobby.

Your doing a lot of good research, you will get where you want to go in this hobby. I kept fish many years ago (before the internet) and since I got back into the hobby I have learned so much more than I thought I knew before. Don't know how I didn't kill everything I had back then.
 
I believe brettmad's advisors were able to stock so many fish in the new tank was because
Of the shear size of it. The larger water volume allows for more gradual
cycle spikes.
I don't agree with the early stocking of the tetras, but my experiences with rainbow fish have always been good. Hope they all make it.
Nice looking tank. Welcome to AA.
 
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