Hello, New Member Here!

[Mumma.of.two]

Any ammonia in a tank is harmful to fish. Kelley - if you are still getting ammonia or nitrite readings your tank isn't cycled and not safe for any more fish to be added.
Scott - if you choose to cycle with fish you can to a couple of back to back 100% water changes to remove the ammonia from your tank.
Fish in cycling can be done safely without harming a fish. The old method of cycling with fish requires putting a few 'hardy' fish is the tank and praying for the best. Minimal water changes where done because it was believed they would slow or stall the cycle. Those fish suffered through horrific conditions and many died a painful death. These days we know water changes will not hinder a fish in cycle in any way. Large daily water changed are essential to keep the fish from suffering ammonia or nitrite burns or death. I have done many fish in cycles using this method myself using even 'sensitive' fish and have never lost one to a cycling related problem. The key is to stock very lightly in the beginning then waiting until the cycle is complete to add any others. Water changes and testing is a MUST.
http://www.aquariumadvice.com/artic...g-but-I-already-have-fish-What-now/Page2.html

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/fish-in-cycling-step-over-into-the-dark-side-176446.html

 

[scottb]

Mumma - Thanks for the detailed info. I went and checked out two family-owned fish stores today and after talking quite extensively with one of the workers, I have decided to try the fish in cycle once more. I swear this has nothing to do with my impatience of staring at an empty tank haha. I just finished doing a 100% WC and will test my ammonia levels in an hr or so. Also, I purchased some Seachem Stability to aid in the acclimation/cycling of my fish, per recommendation of the worker I talked to. Thanks for the links as well, I will check them out soon. Updates to come...

 

[Mumma.of.two]

As you know, glad to help. I would return the stability. Purely snake oil. It contains the wrong type of bacteria and will do nothing for your cycle. One of our mods has tested it for himself and it doesn't work.

 

[scottb]

Mumma - I read that people dose Prime on a 48 hr basis when Ammonia or NitrIte levels are present, and do partial 20-30% WC when these levels get too high (>0.25ppm). What do you recommend? I just fear of buying fish, and having them die again. As far as I understand, once my tank reads 0ppm for Ammonia, NitrItes and NitrAtes, I can add my fish. After adding fish, I should monitor my water parameters daily, dosing Prime, and doing partial WC when Ammonia/NitrIte levels get too high/dangerous (>0.25ppm). Eventually I should see Ammonia rise and fall, followed by NitrItes rise and fall, followed by the same thing happening to NitrAtes. I will know when my tank is fully cycled when Ammonia and NitrItes read 0ppm, and NitrAtes are readable at a safe level, ideally <20ppm. Please correct me if I have anything mistaken here.

I plan to add either Neon or Cardinal Tetras as my first fish, within the next 2 days. I want to give my tank 24hrs to test for Ammonia, since it takes Prime about 24hrs to dissipate, and I know traces of this can read as Ammonia at very low levels with the API Test Kit. Do you think either of these fish are good fish to start with? I considered Zebra Danios, but I don't really want them in my community tank. Thanks for the help!

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Mumma - I read that people dose Prime on a 48 hr basis when Ammonia or NitrIte levels are present, and do partial 20-30% WC when these levels get too high (>0.25ppm). What do you recommend? I just fear of buying fish, and having them die again. As far as I understand, once my tank reads 0ppm for Ammonia, NitrItes and NitrAtes, I can add my fish. After adding fish, I should monitor my water parameters daily, dosing Prime, and doing partial WC when Ammonia/NitrIte levels get too high/dangerous (>0.25ppm). Eventually I should see Ammonia rise and fall, followed by NitrItes rise and fall, followed by the same thing happening to NitrAtes. I will know when my tank is fully cycled when Ammonia and NitrItes read 0ppm, and NitrAtes are readable at a safe level, ideally <20ppm. Please correct me if I have anything mistaken here.

I plan to add either Neon or Cardinal Tetras as my first fish, within the next 2 days. I want to give my tank 24hrs to test for Ammonia, since it takes Prime about 24hrs to dissipate, and I know traces of this can read as Ammonia at very low levels with the API Test Kit. Do you think either of these fish are good fish to start with? I considered Zebra Danios, but I don't really want them in my community tank. Thanks for the help!

What I do is test everyday and if there is any ammonia or nitrite do a 50% water change. If the ammonia or nitrite is high ,0.5ppm or more, two or more 50% water changes will be needed to bring it down to .25ppm or lower. IMO prime only needs to be dosed when a water change is done. If you stock lightly then your ammonia and nitrite spikes won't be as large. This is a good thing. Means less water changes for you and it's better for your fish because it's not rising as fast between them.

You are correct. Ammonia will rise then fall. Nitrite will rise then fall then nitrate will keep increasing. Nitrate is the end product of the cycle and will continue to rise until a water change is done to bring it down again. In a cycled tank the goal is to keep nitrate 20ppm or less with weekly water changes. If you can't then the changes are too small, not frequent enough or the tank is over stocked.

Neons an cardinals can be sensitive (due to over breeding) so it is expected to loose a couple within the first few weeks even in an established tank. IMO it can be done.

 

[scottb]

Mumma - thanks for the quick response! I will be sure to test my water religiously once I get my first few fish in my tank. If not one of the cardinals, what do you suggest? Perhaps a BN pleco? and if I do decide to go with one of the Tetras, how many do you think is good? I was thinking 3-4.

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Mumma - thanks for the quick response! I will be sure to test my water religiously once I get my first few fish in my tank. If not one of the cardinals, what do you suggest? Perhaps a BN pleco? and if I do decide to go with one of the Tetras, how many do you think is good? I was thinking 3-4.

iPhone app makes it all possible! Lol

36g right?
One large BN pleco or about 6 maybe 8 small tetras IMO. That should give a good supply of ammonia without causing massive spikes between water changes.

 

[scottb]

haha. Any other species you recommend? I will most likely go get fish on Friday. This way I can give my tank at least 48-72 hours to just run and get to my desired temp of 78F, and I can make sure I read all 0's for Ammonia, NitrItes and NitrAtes. I guess I can move my 2 pieces of driftwood around since they're just thrown in there.

 

[Mumma.of.two]

haha. Any other species you recommend? I will most likely go get fish on Friday. This way I can give my tank at least 48-72 hours to just run and get to my desired temp of 78F, and I can make sure I read all 0's for Ammonia, NitrItes and NitrAtes. I guess I can move my 2 pieces of driftwood around since they're just thrown in there.

What fish have you decided on?
Scapings the fun part IMO.

 

[scottb]

Still haven't decided on which fish yet. I have decided to rule out the Neons and Cardinals for a later time. I'm debating between Harlequin Rasbora, Bleeding Heart Tetra, or possibly some Mollies or Platys, since they are pretty inexpensive. What are your thoughts on these?

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Still haven't decided on which fish yet. I have decided to rule out the Neons and Cardinals for a later time. I'm debating between Harlequin Rasbora, Bleeding Heart Tetra, or possibly some Mollies or Platys, since they are pretty inexpensive. What are your thoughts on these?

I love harlequin rasboras. Beautiful little fish. I have 7 in my 10g. Went through 16 to get to the 7 but don't let that put you off them. Mine was an unpleasant experience. Bleeding hearts I don't know too much about I'm sorry. If you want to go the livebearer route you can get all female or males to avoid fry. If you want fry you will need to be prepared to find a home for some. The male:female ratio is 1:2-3 to avoid the males picking on the females. Livebearers are usually very hardy. Occasionally you will come across a bad batch because they have been so overbred.

 

[scottb]

I read that Tetras are good, but only the rounder ones are more hearty, like the bleeding hearts but who knows. I know they have rasboras at my LFS so I think I'm leaning towards those. Will probably pick up 4-6, don't want to overload the tank with ammonia, either on thurs or fri. Also need to remember to check my water tomorrow. Will update with progress. Thanks for the help, yet again haha.

 

[Mumma.of.two]

No problem!

 

[scottb]

Just checked my ammonia and it reads 1.0ppm. I am the the process of doing a 60-70% WC. I will test the levels again in a few hours and update with the results. Am I testing my water too soon by chance?

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Just checked my ammonia and it reads 1.0ppm. I am the the process of doing a 60-70% WC. I will test the levels again in a few hours and update with the results. Am I testing my water too soon by chance?

After a water change? It's a good idea to give the new water an adequate amount of time to circulate the tank so you get a correct reading. About half an hour is enough IMO.

 

[scottb]

I just tested my water again after doing a 75-80% WC, and I still get the same results. Ammonia = 1.0ppm, NitrIte and NitrAte both at 0ppm, pH = 7.8 and temp. is at 77-78F. I let the tank run for about 3 hrs or so before testing. Could I be reading ammonia either because of Seachem Comprehensive or Excel? Or maybe there is still some ammonia left in my filters from before? Thanks for the help!

EDIT - I will let my tank run for 24hrs and test it again tomorrow. Hopefully I'll read all 0's. Otherwise, I guess another WC is in order, right?

 

[Mumma.of.two]

From my experience helping others removing ammonia from a tank (swapping from fishless to fish in), it takes 2-3 or more 100% (down to the gravel) water changes to get it down to 0.

 

[scottb]

ok, then I guess I am in for a few more changes. I get as much water out as I can, but it's never 100%, more like 90-95%. I did just test my water again and my ammonia levels dropped from 1.0ppm to 0.5ppm. This could just be a coincidence though. I'll test my water tomorrow morning and do another WC if ammonia is still present. Fingers crossed. Does it matter if my lights are on?

 

[Mumma.of.two]

Have you got plants yet? No need to leave them on unless you want to see the tank. I think during a fishless cycle it's recommended to have them off...

 

[scottb]

I have 3 Jungle Vals, so I've been leaving them on for about 8hrs. I actually just got done doing another ALMOST 100% wc. I'll leave my lights off until I test my water in the morning. Updates tomorrow on whether or not I read all zeros!