Lighting your reef... Best bang for your buck.

[audifusion]

Holy Shizzle!!! That'a a big tank!! I could scuba dive in a tank that big!

I have been in it with mask and snorkel before.

 

[Godfrey]

I have been in it with mask and snorkel before.

You probably have to just to aqua scape it lol.. Some day!

 

[Terrance]

Hey Terrance, which optics did you get? 60, 90, or 120? I was thinking about getting 90's but maybe the 120's would be better. Nice tank BTW.

Thanks for helping me out. These full spectrum lights are what I want. They give a closer appearance of 14K up to a 20k or there 'bouts.

The 120 is basically using no optics. Im not using any optics.

Mr X, people have reported on other reef forum minor loss of certain (not all) coral color due to using only white and royal blue. IMO corals need small amounts of other colors to retain color (used for photosynthesis)

The newer reefbreeders LED has changed the LED colors - less red, whites have changed. They have a new option to DIY change the LED, which i will change. My pics show the old version.

I think if you request a certain LED color/layout (email Logan), then it might be free. Not sure though.

 

[mr_X]

Terrance, I am using nothing but the white/blue units and have no problem with coloration. Their reports have more factors involved than just lighting, and many people are underestimating these units and bleaching corals. If they weren't getting enough usable light, they would brown out, not bleach.

 

[Hondatek]

I agree with x . I'm using a blue and white fixture over my 40 with no color issues at all with any of my corals. Imo the white and blue panels are a great light . I'm willing to bet they have other issues with their tanks causing the color issue.

 

[Animal-Chin]

Terrance, I am using nothing but the white/blue units and have no problem with coloration. Their reports have more factors involved than just lighting, and many people are underestimating these units and bleaching corals. If they weren't getting enough usable light, they would brown out, not bleach.

What % do you run yours on? I'm at 100% but I think I may be overdoing it. I just want to ensure my sps are getting enough light.

 

[Terrance]

Its not bleaching im talking about. Some people notice colors are not the same after switching from MH/T5 to LED. There is growth, but the coloration is not the same for certain corals with only white and royal blue LEDs.

 

[mr_X]

I am using a multicolored fixture as well, and see no difference between the two, except I don't like the way the multicolored unit makes my tank look pink. The blue/whites are much crisper looking.
I have heard of corals morphing under LEDs, but I don't see it being a bad thing. When most of these corals are in the ocean, they are very drab, some completely brown. Under the much more intense hobby lighting, they change to the corals we know. It makes sense that the different intensities make them change color.

 

[Animal-Chin]

Mr. X, do you run your units at 100% or are they turned down a bit?

 

[TrekBear]

I bet there's plenty of spectrum in the straight blue and white lights. Otherwise, how would I be growing and coloring up corals? I disagree that the multi colored ones look anywhere near 20k. They have a pinkish hue to them. None of the Taotronics or similar fixtures look close to 20k.

Isn't perception, put simply, an opinion?

I was calling it as I perceived the colors to be. Not, saying Blue/White TaoTronics suck wind. These are just my preference. I also, wasn't even implying that one is better than the other, or grows or doesn't grow corals any better.

I do see the pinkish hue. I see tanks that run T5HO's with Fiji Purple bulbs running and this what the Reef Breeder lights appear like, (to me in the pictures I've seen). I hope to be seeing these lights in person soon. Then I will be able to make a definitive statement as to my true opinion.

Terrance, back to your tank and lights. I really do like it!

Cheers!
TrekBear

 

[oyf709]

Green , Red, Orange, Yellow, even if you want to put rainbow color in your tank are all serving the same purpose which is just "eye candy" , as long as they spike in blue spectrum, then the coral should be growing and healthy. The only thing other than blue is just UV, when talking about UV, we talking about anything lower than 400nm. 420nm or 430 nm are just purple or violet. They don't serve the same purpose of UV. UV only use to force your coral create color pigment which bring out more vibrant color. 99% of the fixture on the market, when they call it "full spectrum" is really just making you pay more money for it. 1) red and green specturm barely able to penatrate into the sea, so please stop try to convince ppl that coral will need those to grow. Since they don't even reach deep enough to be effective.2) The only few spectrum that can go deaper are blue and UV. However, there is no UV on the market, so far I only see at best 410nm violet on the market(yes even those great brand name LEDs such as AI vega or Vertex UV module (410nm).
Since "Ultraviolet (UV) light is electromagnetic radiation with a wavelength shorter than that of visible light, but longer than X-rays, that is, in the range 10 nm to 400 nm, corresponding to photon energies from 3 eV to 124 eV. It is so-named because the spectrum consists of electromagnetic waves with frequencies higher than those that humans identify as the colour violet..." (This is taking from wikipedia btw). You can tell that even the "so call" UV moduel is really not UV.

This is the main reason when ppl ask me about full spectrum, my response would be "they are good to provide you vibrant color but blue and white only LED is sufficient to provide proper coral growth.


PS: Correct myself, the best LED that claim to be UV is Radion XR30W PRO at 405nm

 

[Ingy]

709,

I do agree with what you say about coral light needs for survival/growth. You are also correct in your details about UV light, for the most part. However a light rated as a 405nm light likely has some emissions slightly above and below that peak wavelength. Perhaps even in the UV band.
That being said, that detail is irrelevant. One reason some light manufacturers recommend the purple light us to help some coral colours POP through the effects of fluorescence. And this can occur when ANY shorter wavelength effects something that then radiates a longer wavelength. Therefore a purple light can lead to fluorescence in any colour while red can only fluoresce other reds. UV light is especially good as it does not light the tank but does make things appear to glow, which is the truest form of fluorescence.
Although not everything will fluoresce , it is more common in corals, hence the recommendation of some to include those purple and uv lights in your tank. Unfortunately it comes at the cost of less light in the 460nm coral food wavelength. Less of a concern for those of you fortunate to have led lights.

 

[mr_X]

Isn't perception, put simply, an opinion?

I was calling it as I perceived the colors to be. Not, saying Blue/White TaoTronics suck wind. These are just my preference. I also, wasn't even implying that one is better than the other, or grows or doesn't grow corals any better.

I do see the pinkish hue. I see tanks that run T5HO's with Fiji Purple bulbs running and this what the Reef Breeder lights appear like, (to me in the pictures I've seen). I hope to be seeing these lights in person soon. Then I will be able to make a definitive statement as to my true opinion.

Terrance, back to your tank and lights. I really do like it!

Cheers!
TrekBear

Yes, it's opinion, and I feel the need to let everyone reading know my perception as well. I'm trying to ensure that folks considering these fixtures will have more than a single eye witness to go by.
You would see the pinkish hue if you put it next to a blue/white model.

I agree that the reef breeders appear to be similar to that of the ATI mix with a Fiji Purple mixed in. I would not recommend that lamp because it makes the tank look pink and does nothing to bring out reds IMO/IME. I tell people to use maybe a UVL Aquasun in the place of that, Simply for more PAR, and less pink.

 

[Reefer4eva]

I've seen it being said in many forums how LEDs suck and t5's or metal halides are better,honestly i had both and yes there both great.my honest opinion is the cost to run them between the cost of electricity and the cost to replace the bulbs yearly.this is just my opinion of course and to each there own,if LEDs can give me somewhat similar results for a fraction of the cost than I'm jumping in balls deap on the led bandwagon!

 

[oyf709]

709,

I do agree with what you say about coral light needs for survival/growth. You are also correct in your details about UV light, for the most part. However a light rated as a 405nm light likely has some emissions slightly above and below that peak wavelength. Perhaps even in the UV band.
That being said, that detail is irrelevant. One reason some light manufacturers recommend the purple light us to help some coral colours POP through the effects of fluorescence. And this can occur when ANY shorter wavelength effects something that then radiates a longer wavelength. Therefore a purple light can lead to fluorescence in any colour while red can only fluoresce other reds. UV light is especially good as it does not light the tank but does make things appear to glow, which is the truest form of fluorescence.
Although not everything will fluoresce , it is more common in corals, hence the recommendation of some to include those purple and uv lights in your tank. Unfortunately it comes at the cost of less light in the 460nm coral food wavelength. Less of a concern for those of you fortunate to have led lights.

wat you are saying is very true, that is the main reason I didn't put the "UV" part of the red or green. However, wat I was saying is that there is no true UV LED out there and without true UV light, the real effect is very minimum. You are right at 405nm there will always some spectrum under 400nm. You can find that has the same result on the royal blue only LED also, just matter of the amount (not by much). Check out http://ecotechmarine.com/products/radion/radion-xr30w-pro/ on their spectrum, it did spike at the 405nm range but it really doesn't give much more under the 400nm compare to a royal blue+ white only LED, you can compare it to AI Sol http://www.aquaillumination.com/sol/performance.html.

My point is that when people call it "full spectrum", the only important thing concerns the coral growth is the blue spike. when it comes to the "look", UV/Violet/Purple will be part of that deal and when comes to "personal preference" that is where red, green orange or yellow LED comes in to play. ppl choosing blue and red only LED would still grow 100% healthy coral, just sometimes it will lack of the vibrant color. Adding the purple violet or even true UV LED in there will at least help on that part which I understand the reason why they cost higher(but I still disagree that it worth considerable amount higher)

 

[mr_X]

I've seen it being said in many forums how LEDs suck and t5's or metal halides are better

That sounds like an uneducated statement. efficiency per watt and penetration is what we are looking for and (the right) LEDs blow the others out of the water.
As I said earlier, folks are simply underestimating them and bleaching their corals. Not enough light = sps browning out, not bleaching out. Color morphs are to be expected when going from natural sun, to halide, to t5's, to LEDs....
If some of the sps is doing very well under the LEDs, it stands to reason that the lighting is providing enough PAR to the corals. The pieces that aren't coloring up as well just didn't acclimate fully IMO.

I know a guy who had a sps dominated tank that looked great under an 8 lamp t5 fixture. He wanted to go LED so he went out and bought some SOL Super Blues and put them over the tank. His sps started looking like crap and within a couple months, he went back to T5's.
This is a perfect example of not acclimating the corals properly and being impatient. This guy's experience is not uncommon, and these are the people saying LED's suck.
It's not like changing from Halides to T5's. I am trying as many scenarios as possible- different fixture heights, turning the fixtures up and down, different photo periods, colored LEDs V.S. the straight blue and whites, and whatever else I can think of, and I have been noticing that with at least these fixtures, I didn't need the PAR numbers to grow my stony corals as I did with the halides and T5 fixtures.
So far my conclusion is that it's totally an acclimation issue.

 

[Pisces3473]

That sounds like an uneducated statement. efficiency per watt and penetration is what we are looking for and (the right) LEDs blow the others out of the water.
As I said earlier, folks are simply underestimating them and bleaching their corals. Not enough light = sps browning out, not bleaching out. Color morphs are to be expected when going from natural sun, to halide, to t5's, to LEDs....
If some of the sps is doing very well under the LEDs, it stands to reason that the lighting is providing enough PAR to the corals. The pieces that aren't coloring up as well just didn't acclimate fully IMO.

I know a guy who had a sps dominated tank that looked great under an 8 lamp t5 fixture. He wanted to go LED so he went out and bought some SOL Super Blues and put them over the tank. His sps started looking like crap and within a couple months, he went back to T5's.
This is a perfect example of not acclimating the corals properly and being impatient. This guy's experience is not uncommon, and these are the people saying LED's suck.
It's not like changing from Halides to T5's. I am trying as many scenarios as possible- different fixture heights, turning the fixtures up and down, different photo periods, colored LEDs V.S. the straight blue and whites, and whatever else I can think of, and I have been noticing that with at least these fixtures, I didn't need the PAR numbers to grow my stony corals as I did with the halides and T5 fixtures.
So far my conclusion is that it's totally an acclimation issue.

Hey X, I noticed last night when I picked up some Zoa's that the lfs was using MH and then just a tiny strip of blue led's to show off the colors. I got a small colony and when I put them in the tank they were pretty closed up. I switched the LED's to blue and left the light on all night. They had started to open a bit by the time I left, but I haven't had a chance to go look yet today. How should I go about acclimating them to the LED's or do I not have to worry. LFS said they are a good starter and don't require high maintenance.
As always, your thoughts are appreciated.

 

[mr_X]

I would put them on the sand bed for starters. Let them open fully, which can take up to a week, and then slowly move them to where they do best. I start everything on the sand bed.

 

[Pisces3473]

I would put them on the sand bed for starters. Let them open fully, which can take up to a week, and then slowly move them to where they do best. I start everything on the sand bed.

I set them out front of the reef on the bottom, It's actually where I'm hoping to keep them. Here's a pic from last night.

 

[audifusion]

I set them out front of the reef on the bottom, It's actually where I'm hoping to keep them. Here's a pic from last night.

now that's a swanky background!

makes you diZzy if you focus on it.