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Christmasfish

Aquarium Advice Addict
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Jan 11, 2004
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The South-SOoTHWEsT that is
The 2 dwarfed Gourami I got for Christmas is now 100's. I removed Dad only when he cut the original number in half. So now i am the one doing retrieval duties for the eggs and non-mobiles fry. i eyedrop them up with a slimecoat solution and spit them back in the hornwort. I very few unlucky fry that end up deead at the bottom. maybe 1 per day. Swimmers that got disoriented and drowned probably.
I notice they all head for light so I made sure all light sources near the tank are above its level. that seems to work, it gathers them to the top.
So now The tank like has three groups at three locations. The larger , colored fly-sized hang near the heater or the gentle areation. The really big ones hang at the deep end. The small transparent ones hang around the plants anchored to the decorative rock/divider, the sea monkey looking ones hang with the nest still. I gather them from the bottom and dropper them back to the nest on a daily basis. And the number is increasing. Auugh! There must be at least 80 at larger darting stage alone!

I hated disturbing the parents, they were just becoming secure and friendly, ,now they are more easily spooked than before. I finally have control of the nitrate levels when I put all my lucky bamboo in the tank (It doesn't deteriorate in water, needs moderate light and likes it ph soft, some acidicy and nitric conditions.) Then i tuned up the areation so the oxygen isn't sucked up. Ammonia has been 0 all along, ,but finally i have the nitrites dropping below 0.3.

When do they have to be separated by size? and when are they proper labyrinth fish? This fish for Christmas thing is becoming a herculean task!
And how many should I expect to survive (read this as find housing/new homes for)

My grandpa was a show fish breeder, but I was only like 7-8 when I assisted him. And I wasn't exactly interested in committing it to memory... ^.^ My memory isn't just rusty...it has holes! 30 years is too long to trust when it is living things. Worse is this event took over my largest tank, so now my poor Gourami are unhappily waiting in an 8 gallon reptile keeper with a heater and a decoration stolen from the big tank.
I don't think my lfs will take the whole lot. And I will pan fry them before I send them to a Megapet store, it would be kinder (and they look kind like crappie anyway). Our poor bettas are former residents of such a place. I still haven't identified and killed all the parasites and diseases the poor unhappy things have. Siamese fighting fish were one of Grandpa's specialties. His never got sick or stressed! Unlike all his weird goldfish.
Any west coast people want some tropical fish? ^.^
 
Well, first off, congratulations!

I have not bred gourami but there are some things about it that I do know. You will need some infusoria to feed the fry, or liquid fry food. They need to be separated by size once the free-swimming ones are able to eat the eggs, which is the purpose of separating them. The labyrinth organ develops at about 2-4 weeks, and that is a crucial time, from what I understand, and you need to keep the tank water level at about 6" so they have access to the surface, and keep aeration up so there is no film on the surface of the water. It sounds like you have your work cut out for you! Good luck!
 
Hiya Christmasfish and welcome to Aquariumadvice :)

Just a thought. I'm guessing you don't have room for a few more tanks? If you're going to grow out the fish, you'll need the space. If you are unable to do that atm, I'd suggest doing some culling, and pulling out the biggest and healthiest, leaving the rest in the community to be get eaten and at least be a source of nutrients for the parents and other fish. Heh, and keep in mind this is only the beginning; there's a good chance this pair will breed again and often. I'm sort of on the same place; my angelfish started breeding a couple months ago (which I'm prepared for and will start them parent raising in their own tank soon) and the Bolivian rams I bought last week ALSO decided they needed to breed on Saturday (which I was NOT prepared for; I've about 80 wigglers in the tank now...ack!). I definitely plan on culling; I live in an apt and just don't have the space for a dedicated fish room!
 
Allivymar....

You can't cull Bolivian Rams!!! You simply CAN'T!!!!! You're SO darned cold-hearted!!!!! :lol:
 
I thought I was a softie Fruitbat? ;)

Heh, I have no issues culling (yet; this will be my first time). I'd rather keep the healthiest then stuff em all in a tank that's too small. Now THAT would give me guilt!
 
I thought you might have caught that Allivymar (chuckling)!! I agree with you completely, of course. Just giving you a hard time!
 
Culling is not coldhearted, it's an important part of the process. Culling helps keep the bloodline and the species as a whole healthy.
 
I know it Enki....I was just giving Allivymar a hard time. In a post in a different area, Allivymar posted about liking happy endings when someone spoke of how their betta had survived all of its problems. I posted that Allivymar was a 'softie'. Then I came to this thread and saw that Allivymar was going to cull her Rams....so, as a joke, I said that Alli was cold-hearted.

I do fully understand the necessity of culling. I used to do it all the time when I had billions and billions (well...maybe not billions...but a bunch!) of fry to deal with.
 
My concern is wanting the best chances for the healthiest and prettiest specimens, anyway. So just leave the fry together for the most part until they cut their own numbers down to 40-50 of them? ^.^
The lfs will only take about 20. And we only want one or two more. If they were not tropicals I'd give them away in a yard sale.
With the setups happening right at Christmas I am strapped until Feb, heh!
I have one more reptile keeper that I can use. I have a about 12 2-gallon pickle jars I use for dry storage.
It is the heating that is the issue. I still need to get heaters for the Bettas. Our house is multi-storied cold, drafty mausoleum between two large bodies of water. And this winter has been the coldest. (is shuddering to open the current power bill).
my Gourami are still mad at me though the male will come over when I talk to him now..as long as the lid is closed. I want them back in the largest tank as soon as possible. Before the great event, I was thinking I wanted a couple dalmatian mollies and some cardinal tetras. Dragon will prolly be kept in a tank of his own because of his aggressive tendencies AND to avoid unplanned fish fry. heh!
 
You might want to call a couple other lfs and see if they would be interested as well.

As for the stud *grin* maybe increasing the surface agitation a little would dissuade him from bubble nest building? No nest - no babies. Obviously not TOO much agitation; you want them to be able to gulp air, but enough that making a nest would be difficult.

As for the fry themselves, they likely won't eat each other. I'm not clear if its just them or they are in a community tank.
 
The tadpole/baby neon sized ones are taking snack attacks on the wee tiny ones.
I divided out 40 of each size range so I don't miss the keepers. I have a small tank with 2 sizes in each size and the big tank had the bigger fry as well as the leftover small ones. The biggest easily eat brine shrimp and worm cultures. The smallest are barely bigger than their meals of liqui-fry. And the two fast dark ones that live under the filter are still hard to ID. They are almost real neon tetra sized now. I am sure they're fish. And there were only gourami and ghost shrimp in the beginning. I wonder why they are not silvery clear like the rest. can fish eggs hitchike with plants? The plants are from the same shop as the gourami, I had bought all their hornwort for sale, so it came from 3 dif tanks.
And the snails! Auuugh! They are all over in every size! As long as the levels stay okay, i am not doing to much to it. Just adding fresh water mostly.
Temp: 82 in the day, 79 at night.
Amonia:0.0 pH and KH are solid.
Nitirtes:.001 the acidity is barely .3 over dead neutral

Is there any other test kits I should pick up?
 
I can't give you any advice on the fry in terms of whether or not they are gourami, but I did read that the fry will hatch at different times and you will have older and younger of the same batch, and that the older ones will try to eat the younger ones, so it is important to try to separate them out once they are free swimming. This is not going to be easy!

I think a nitrAte test will be useful, because you need to keep those levels down with water changes. Keep tabs on the nitrIte, because that is much more dangerous.

Good luck, and post some pics of those babies!
 
The lfs has a suspicion what they are. He id concur that they re not gourami. He wont say til I can bring them in about 4-5 weeks should they make it.. He just said to put as much salt as the gourami fry (he gave me a recipe) can stand and let the status quo go. And test-test-test. He GAVE me a nitrate test and some live swimmy doodads. He is kinda excited. But he won't say because there are several candidates I guess. He thinks I'm charmed.
I brought him a jar of "eggers" today to see what they were (official term for non-swimming fry that are still heart shaped with all eyes is?=). They developed behind the decorations sometime this week. I was suctioning the decoration and gravel when they got snagged.They are waaay bigger than the gourami eggs were. Snails and mold got most of them, but there were 6 good ones. The eye bubbles are bigger than the gourami eggs were. Big as some of the current smaller fry. He said that I will lose most of the gourami that I didn't separate out. He was happy the egger were still in warm tank water and took them to the back.

What the hell have I got NOW?! All I wanted was just 3 pretty fishes to swim around a planted tank. And now look! What kind of freshwater fish could possibly like living under a filter plate and not be stupid catfish?! Guess I'll know in a few weeks. Stay tuned....and see the exciting conclusion of "Mystery of the Black Filter Snakes" Meanwhile I have so many gourami that I may have to get yet ANOTHER 10 gallon to separate another 30-40 out
~sigh!~
What's with all this "work"!
 
Whoo! You have really gotten into something here :D

You have just got that mojo goin' on for hatching fry! Keep us posted, since this is getting more and more interesting as the days go by. 8)
 
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