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OceanMist 07-09-2006 04:36 PM

Refuge Evaporation
I read somewhere (may have been on this site) that if you install a refuge under the display tank evapouration will occour in the refuge and not the main, is this always the case? TIA

seaham358 07-09-2006 05:19 PM

Where did you read that? I would like to read that, No idea how it would happen ONLY in a fuge.
Seeing the Fuge and tank are hooked together some how both will loose water.
I find it hard to believe that my 24" fuge will evaporate and not my 72" tank.
IMO that info is not correct. Reason being I and others blow fans across the surface of the tank and sumps to lower heat, this causes evaporation which lowers tank temps.

austinsdad 07-09-2006 05:40 PM

If the fuge is serving as a sump also with your main return pump there, it will show evap there first. Yes it is evaporating everywhere, it's just that in the scenario I described above, the main will always have it's supply of water from the fuge/sump - which is where the level will drop before the main. That's where I have my topoff system located, to re-fill the fuge.

MT79 07-09-2006 09:12 PM

In a typical sump/fuge design the evaporation will show only in the return chamber of the sump. This animation may help you understand-

OceanMist 07-09-2006 11:06 PM


Consistent water level - The display tank will maintain the same water level all the times; evaporation occurs in the sump over time (see auto top-off)
Thanks MT79, that is exactly what I read, I did want to bookmark that page but I forgot,

will this only work if you use an overflow? only I can't afford one at the moment and have decided to use a peice of tube to syphon the water from the display?

This would be excellent if the evap does only show in the refuge as I have an auto top off I want to use on my tank and using a siphoning tube will depend on constantly monitoring the water level unless I can install this?

melosu58 07-10-2006 08:13 PM

In my tanks the fuge return chamber goes down.

seaham358 07-10-2006 08:50 PM

I did not understand the question... Agree with the others.. Water evaps from the whole system but the lover water level is SEEN in the sump or fuge.

Using a piece of tube to syphon water sounds risky too me. What happens if you loose power? how much water drains into the fuge before it loses syphon? And when power comes back on and your not home how does the syphon restart? If it wont restart I see some flooding and a dry fuge in your future.. Just a something too look at.

Scoot 07-10-2006 09:23 PM

Some commercial overflows have a nipple on top that you attach to either an lifter pump, or powerhead.

Or you can insert a length of airtubing up into the siphone U-tube, so it sucks the air out (and starts the siphon). That's how Mine is setup. I do have to keep the airline tubing clear of debris...

seaham358 07-10-2006 11:31 PM

they dont have a overflow just a tube, thats the issue IMO

OceanMist 07-11-2006 05:31 PM

1 Attachment(s)

Or you can insert a length of airtubing up into the siphone U-tube, so it sucks the air out (and starts the siphon). That's how Mine is setup. I do have to keep the airline tubing clear of debris...
sounds interesting, could you explain what you mean and how it works?

If the attachment works its my initial design, the pump failing wouldn't be a problem as the siphon would only let 1" or so of water from the main tank which I could allow room for in the 'fuge, or at worst - a minor overflow would occour, however the siphon failing or the pump restarting would be a problem as it would drain the fuge, cause a flood and burn out the pump, (this is why I mentioned constant water level is crutial to avoid siphon failing), can anyone suggest how this could be prevented, TIA

seaham358 07-11-2006 07:17 PM

you need to buy a overflow box or have the tank drilled and install a bulkhead.
You do not want to cut corners here. Trust me your not the first one to try the syphon with just a hose trick, it will fail. The only question is when. Take it off line ASAP until you get a OF box.

Scoot 07-11-2006 07:24 PM

Sometimes the LFS will have old overflows - got a 600GPH from one here in Omaha for $35.

Scoot 07-13-2006 05:10 PM

Why hasn't anyone used the overflow concept, but with a pump at the bottom? Pumping out until of overflowing/siphoning? Doesnt' seem like it'd take much power to get a good 300-600 GPH or more.

I imagine there's a priming issue - but I'm sure some pumps can start dry and pull water through a dry hose...

OceanMist 07-13-2006 05:57 PM

I've decided I might see If I can get the tank i'm planning to use drilled so I can use a ball float valve, this should solve the siphoning and return pump issues as long as I can find a pump that returns the water to the display slower than the siphon, I can't see any faults or possible failures using this method, can anyone think why this may not work?

seaham358 07-14-2006 06:24 PM

How is the syphon going to restart after a power outage? Ball float valve will keep the water level up if its attached to a auto top off in the sump.
What tank are you gonna drill the sump or main tank?
In your main tank you either need a OF box or a reef ready or drilled tank. Having a pipe hang in the tank with a syphon going is not going to work long term. You will have a flood one day.
If it was that easy everyone would be doing it.. Trust me on this, I had to set up a quick 75 QT tank when my 125 crashed and I used a syphon like your talking about. Well we lost power and I had a big flood in my family room.
So not only did my reef crash and I flooded my basement I was also very sick and we lost power. I don't wish a flood on anyone..

OceanMist 07-15-2006 11:12 AM


How is the syphon going to restart after a power outage?
The siphon will never stop, the float valve stop the water from entering the fuge, the longest power cut i've ever experienced was no longer than 5 hours (which would not be long enough to cause extreme evaporation), so although a flood would be possible, it's extremely improbable, I will use fixed platic plumbing pipe, not PVC tubing, so it would not pop out the tank for whatever reason.

i know cutting corners here isn't the cleverest of ideas, but I have things higher up on my list of priorities.


Sometimes the LFS will have old overflows
Thanks for the suggestion, but if you mean used ones, all the LFS I know have their tanks drilled, so are unlikely to have any.

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